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Fighting Fish Samba Member
Joined: April 11, 2021 Posts: 27 Location: Davenport, Iowa
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Posted: Sun Apr 11, 2021 5:03 pm Post subject: Customize or original |
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Ok, so this is my first post and I fear it will be met with anger and vitriol. I am going to Colorado in May to pick up a 1969 red convertible Ghia from my Aunt. She has no children and I am it. We are very close and she treats me like her kid. She is very gracious. I currently have a custom cafe drag bike that I love but due to a messed up elbow, it has been very difficult for me to ride as of late. So I started thinking of an alternative and decided to ask my aunt to sell me her car. She said she would just give it to me. She has a black 70 hard top that she bought new that I will eventually get as well, but she said she has to keep it until her husband dies since her father-in-law (my grandpa) found it for her. She still drives it 50 years later. She is 81 years old and will probably live until 100. She is extremely healthy (we went skydiving last year for her 80th) and very minimalist, so this car has been well taken care of and she plans on having it until she dies.
A little background - I used to customize Porsches. Not restore. Not repair. Customize. New motors (sometimes V8s) in 914s and 911s. Fender flares and wide bodies. The works. And while a lot of people liked them, the purists acted like they wanted to stab me.
Anyway, the 69. She has had it for 30 years and has taken great care of it. It has always been garage stored and only driven in nice weather. So I am really getting blessed with a great car. Here lies the issue: I am not a purist. Every since last weekend, I have been going down a Ghia porn rabbit hole. I have watched and read an insane amount of info online - on a side note; I am so glad to have found this forum. But at the end of the day, I just don't love the look of the Ghia in it's factory form. I am not looking to make great changes but there are a few things I have seen over and over and they really appeal to me. Such as removing the bumpers and side bump guards. Additionally, I would like to lower it at least a small amount. Finally, I am pretty bummed about the power and would like to upgrade the motor at least a bit.
So, my question is, will I be tarred and feathered in this forum? I have read a ton of posts at this time and there are some beautiful cars here. But I haven't seen much in the way of the customization. And I would like to be part of this gathering but I am not looking to cause heart attacks and cursing. Regardless, I will continue to lurk and enjoy the great postings. Cheers. |
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Sebastian Gaeta Samba Member
Joined: December 25, 2003 Posts: 281 Location: Ann Arbor, MI
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Posted: Sun Apr 11, 2021 5:15 pm Post subject: Re: Customize or original |
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Fighting Fish wrote: |
So, my question is, will I be tarred and feathered in this forum? |
First off, welcome!!
I really don't think you will be tarred and feathered but you may not always get the exact answer you need on this particular forum and may have to go to the Performance/Engines/Transmissions, Body/Paint and Custom Wheel/Tire forums for help.
Lots of purists here but I am sure you'll be well received! _________________ Sebastian Gaeta
'63 Beetle Turkis
‘64 Karmann Ghia Coupe Manilagelb/Black Roof
'64 356C cabriolet Signalrot
'65 356C coupe Rubinrot
'66 Single Cab Velvet Green
'67 Karmann Ghia convertible Heliosblau |
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Glenn Mr. 010
Joined: December 25, 2001 Posts: 76760 Location: Sneaking up behind you
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Posted: Sun Apr 11, 2021 5:19 pm Post subject: Re: Customize or original |
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It's your car, do what you want.
BTW, stock care are generally worth more, but i don't think you're looking at it as an investment. _________________ Glenn
74 Beetle Specs | 74 Beetle Restoration | 2180cc Engine
"You may not get what you pay for, but you always pay for what you get"
Member #1009
#BlueSquare |
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Tom K. Samba Member
Joined: March 10, 2005 Posts: 1600 Location: Central Pennsylvania
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Posted: Sun Apr 11, 2021 5:26 pm Post subject: Re: Customize or original |
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I'll buy your bumpers. Seriously! I just acquired a '65 hard top that the previous owner had been converting to a rat rod, and the bumpers are missing. I'm returning it to stock. It has dual carbs, what I'm sure is a strong engine, and a exhaust that looks more like a tuba than a stock muffler. Maybe you want some of this stuff in exchange for the stock stuff you don't want? _________________ '91 Vanagon Westfalia
'70 Beetle Convertible
'71 Super Beetle Semi-Automatic: https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=714131&highlight=
'65 Ghia: https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=762478&highlight= |
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Fighting Fish Samba Member
Joined: April 11, 2021 Posts: 27 Location: Davenport, Iowa
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Posted: Sun Apr 11, 2021 6:05 pm Post subject: Re: Customize or original |
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Tom K. wrote: |
I'll buy your bumpers. Seriously! I just acquired a '65 hard top that the previous owner had been converting to a rat rod, and the bumpers are missing. I'm returning it to stock. It has dual carbs, what I'm sure is a strong engine, and a exhaust that looks more like a tuba than a stock muffler. Maybe you want some of this stuff in exchange for the stock stuff you don't want? |
Thanks. I am open to talking about options with you. For now, I need to get the car and I hope to suss out my aunt's feelings about doing anything to it. But I plan on doing some things regardless. I don't have any pics right now but can you post any pics of what you are talking about and working with? |
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Fighting Fish Samba Member
Joined: April 11, 2021 Posts: 27 Location: Davenport, Iowa
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Posted: Sun Apr 11, 2021 6:07 pm Post subject: Re: Customize or original |
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Thanks all. I am looking forward to learning more about this great car. And I love seeing all the pics of everyone's rides. |
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rbsurfguy Samba Member
Joined: August 10, 2008 Posts: 1757 Location: Fairfax, Northern Virginia Formerly Huntington Beach, SoCal
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Posted: Sun Apr 11, 2021 6:15 pm Post subject: Re: Customize or original |
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Welcome! First, it's your car, do what you want. Who cares what anyone else thinks. While there are a lot of really nice, beautifully restored stock Ghia's, if you really look through some of the rebuilds, most here don't have pure stock cars. Custom motors, wheels, interior, lowered, rat rods, off-roaders (RIP GHIA PET), paint colors, you name it, people here have all kinds of opinions, good and bad or whatever. I think the only way you will get any real crap is if you make some abortion rod, I think there is an abortion topic in the archives...do something like those examples and you will for sure get trashed and ignored. No one really likes a V8 in a Ghia, but if you want to install a Porsche motor, doubt you'll get much crap, at least it's a relative to the VW.
Don't live your life worrying about what anyone here thinks about how you want to customize your Ghia, if they don't like it, they don't have to read your thread, if you are worried about being trashed, then why post here....Your car, make it yours!
Jeff _________________ 1971 Ghia convertible (Body off rebuild)
2019 VW Atlas 4Motion
2012 Passat-Sold
See my build on The Samba at:
Jeff's 71 Vert Restoration/Reassembly http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=6...highlight= |
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iowegian Samba Curmudgeon
Joined: February 16, 2005 Posts: 9826 Location: Somewhere between Dubuque and Keokuk
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Posted: Sun Apr 11, 2021 6:33 pm Post subject: Re: Customize or original |
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Hiya Fish:
There are more air-cooled VWs in your area than you might think.
The next local event will be a show on Saturday May 1st at the German American Heritage Center in downtown Davenport from 10AM to 1PM. Stop by even if you don't have your Ghia home yet. |
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Braukuche Samba Member
Joined: September 03, 2004 Posts: 10965
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Posted: Sun Apr 11, 2021 6:55 pm Post subject: Re: Customize or original |
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Very few people do correct restorations because it’s very expensive and until very recently the cars weren’t worth it.
I’d hate to see a perfectly original and one owner car get customized, would seem a waste. Not too many of those left. _________________ Go Reds! Smash state!
Retirement is here!
1956 Ghia
1959 SO-23 Westfalia
1960 double cab
1960 Baja Bug
1963 stretched double cab
1962 Golde sunroof Ghia
1963 356 B coupe
1963 Notchback
1967 21 window less rusty now
1973 Ghia convertible |
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Fighting Fish Samba Member
Joined: April 11, 2021 Posts: 27 Location: Davenport, Iowa
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Posted: Sun Apr 11, 2021 7:11 pm Post subject: Re: Customize or original |
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iowegian wrote: |
Hiya Fish:
There are more air-cooled VWs in your area than you might think.
The next local event will be a show on Saturday May 1st at the German American Heritage Center in downtown Davenport from 10AM to 1PM. Stop by even if you don't have your Ghia home yet. |
That sounds great. I will try to be there. It is very close to my house. Thanks. |
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Onceler Samba Member
Joined: May 28, 2010 Posts: 1646 Location: Indiana
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Posted: Sun Apr 11, 2021 7:53 pm Post subject: Re: Customize or original |
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Better keep that oil bath air cleaner _________________ 1972 Karmann Ghia |
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Fighting Fish Samba Member
Joined: April 11, 2021 Posts: 27 Location: Davenport, Iowa
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Posted: Sun Apr 11, 2021 8:13 pm Post subject: Re: Customize or original |
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Braukuche wrote: |
Very few people do correct restorations because it’s very expensive and until very recently the cars weren’t worth it.
I’d hate to see a perfectly original and one owner car get customized, would seem a waste. Not too many of those left. |
I will say, that is something I am struggling with. The other cars I have customized were rough to begin with. But I am also excited about the prospect of not having an overwhelming project from the start. I plan on having an overall picture in my mind and then just do projects that I can bring to completion in a weekend. |
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kent70ghia Samba Member
Joined: June 15, 2020 Posts: 172 Location: WA
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Posted: Sun Apr 11, 2021 10:12 pm Post subject: Re: Customize or original |
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My nickles worth. I have a 70 Ghia, that I bought from the original owner, who was like your aunt, only 30 years ago. She sold it to me because she knew I would take care of it. I was hit in the left rear quarter, had it repaired, swapped the chrome bumper for fiberglass blades. When the auto stick went out I swapped it for a 4 speed, and repainted it a cool metal flake blue. Not quite original, but I love the Ghia. I am not into the lowered or patina look that is so popular now.
If I knew then what I know now, I amy have kept the old bumpers and had the autistic rebuilt, as original are more valuable. However, I do not regret the changes I have made, and when I pass it on, if someone wants to put it back to stock original, they can. I would say don't make crazy changes that can't be undone in the future.
Fighting Fish wrote: |
Braukuche wrote: |
Very few people do correct restorations because it’s very expensive and until very recently the cars weren’t worth it.
I’d hate to see a perfectly original and one owner car get customized, would seem a waste. Not too many of those left. |
I will say, that is something I am struggling with. The other cars I have customized were rough to begin with. But I am also excited about the prospect of not having an overwhelming project from the start. I plan on having an overall picture in my mind and then just do projects that I can bring to completion in a weekend. |
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sputnick60 Samba Moderator
Joined: July 22, 2007 Posts: 3907 Location: In Molinya Orbit
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TDCTDI Samba Advocatus Diaboli
Joined: August 31, 2013 Posts: 12815 Location: North Carolina
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Posted: Mon Apr 12, 2021 4:37 am Post subject: Re: Customize or original |
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If you HAVE to modify it, do only what can be easily reversed & keep what you took off. Or sell it/trade it for a car that isn’t as original. I have no problems taking a rotten or abandoned hulk & modifying as I please but I wouldn’t do that to a car that was a one owner original (mostly because I’d flip it & buy a turd that I could beat the shit out of.). _________________ Everybody born before 1975 has a story, good, bad, or indifferent, about a VW.
GOFUNDYOURSELF, quit asking everyone to do it for you!
An air cooled VW will make you a hoarder.
Do something, anything, to your project every day, and you will eventually complete it. |
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Era Vulgaris Samba Member
Joined: August 22, 2012 Posts: 1662 Location: Raleigh, NC
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Posted: Mon Apr 12, 2021 5:21 am Post subject: Re: Customize or original |
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TDCTDI wrote: |
If you HAVE to modify it, do only what can be easily reversed & keep what you took off. Or sell it/trade it for a car that isn’t as original. I have no problems taking a rotten or abandoned hulk & modifying as I please but I wouldn’t do that to a car that was a one owner original (mostly because I’d flip it & buy a turd that I could beat the shit out of.). |
^^^ this 100%
If this car is a clean, original survivor with no structural, aesthetic, or mechanical issues then put it up for sale on Bring A Trailer, where it'll sell for $35-40k, or possibly more if it's pristine. Then you'll have a mound of cash that you can use to do whatever you want to any beat up Ghia you find.
But then I don't know how your Aunt would feel about you just flipping her car after she GAVE it to you!
Original cars that are clean are so rare, and quickly becoming quite valuable. Just looking at auction results on Bring A Trailer, cars like that have probably doubled in price in the last 2-3 years.
Most folks here don't have problems with people modifying their cars. But I think you'll find reticence among many of us to alter an original survivor.
Fighting Fish wrote: |
Such as removing the bumpers and side bump guards. Additionally, I would like to lower it at least a small amount. Finally, I am pretty bummed about the power and would like to upgrade the motor at least a bit.
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Funny, removing the bumpers and side trim are two immediate turn offs for me. It makes the car look like a naked tadpole!
I'm 100% into lowering though. The stock height is too high, especially the front end. My 66 I'm currently building is moving 2.5" closer to the ground.
And I'd say the majority of us that aren't buying investment cars would agree on the power. The 1500 single port in that '69 is weak! I had the same engine in the 67 I used to own, and it was so slow it felt dangerous at times. Swapping in a 1600 dual port from a later car will allow you to keep the stock single carb look, with a 50% increase in power, and you won't feel like you're holding up traffic. If you want more, look into a 1776 or 1915cc with dual carbs and headers, and you'll be doubling or tripling the stock power. _________________ Currently own:
66 Karmann Ghia, L390 Gulf Blue, under construction, here: www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=760505&highlight=
99 Mazda MX-5 10AE, Sapphire Blue Mica, 6 speed, LSD
Previously owned:
98 Porsche Boxster, silver, 2.5L -- 67 Karmann Ghia, Black, 1500sp -- 98 BMW Z3, Atlanta Blue Metallic, 2.8L I6 -- 75 Porsche 914, Laguna Blue, 2270cc -- 72 Porsche 914, Signal Orange, 1.7 FI -- 74 Karmann Ghia, Black, 1600dp -- 74 Triumph TR6 with O.D., sapphire blue |
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Fighting Fish Samba Member
Joined: April 11, 2021 Posts: 27 Location: Davenport, Iowa
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Posted: Mon Apr 12, 2021 6:50 am Post subject: Re: Customize or original |
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Dang it. My reply disappeared.
Great replies all. Thanks for taking the time. I will take the advice and drive it for a while first. And I will try to only to mods that can be reversed. |
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Braukuche Samba Member
Joined: September 03, 2004 Posts: 10965
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Posted: Mon Apr 12, 2021 8:18 am Post subject: Re: Customize or original |
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Post up some pictures when you can. I bet we are all curious as to what the car looks like. _________________ Go Reds! Smash state!
Retirement is here!
1956 Ghia
1959 SO-23 Westfalia
1960 double cab
1960 Baja Bug
1963 stretched double cab
1962 Golde sunroof Ghia
1963 356 B coupe
1963 Notchback
1967 21 window less rusty now
1973 Ghia convertible |
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cmdrfire Samba Member
Joined: September 03, 2009 Posts: 67 Location: UK
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Posted: Mon Apr 12, 2021 5:55 pm Post subject: Re: Customize or original |
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Certainly no tarring and feathering. This forum is great and full of deeply knowledgable people.
For my 2 pfennigs worth, there is nothing wrong with sympathetic modifications (my car is lowered with as many 356 and other Porsche bits as I can get). In the end it's your car. The only real thing I can suggest to that is that whatever is done to it, is done properly - seen too many good cars that are ruined by a "stitch in time" which becomes permanent.
But on that note I second the advice to drive and enjoy it a while first. I regret not doing that with mine, I started the restoration I think two weeks after I bought it. Better to live life when you have the chance, I say now, a little older. _________________ 1966 RHD Karmann Ghia restoration |
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Glenn Mr. 010
Joined: December 25, 2001 Posts: 76760 Location: Sneaking up behind you
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