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1972 Bus - engine won't turn on after driving. Flooded? (Help)
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chaunceyjung
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 14, 2021 10:20 am    Post subject: 1972 Bus - engine won't turn on after driving. Flooded? (Help) Reply with quote

Hi yall,

Thanks so much for all the feedback in advance. I really appreciate it.

So I have been driving my 72 bus.
I have zero knowledge in car mechanics. But I have been trying to learn from youtube.
Anyway this is what I have been experiencing with the car.
I took out the car and drove for about maybe 30 mins. Reached the destination and parked. After 1 hour I tried to turn the engine but this time it didn't work. So I googled and people said maybe the engine or something was flooded so they advised me to press the pedal VERY slowly as I turn on the engine. Which worked!

However now the problem got worse. I drove for maybe 5 mins but engine got turned off because of my mistake (it was uphill) so I tried to turn the engine again but it didn't work.
So I gave it about 1 hour but it didn't work.
Finally after a day I got it working again.

I'm not sure what's causing this.
Is this because me not driving properly? or something is wrong with the engine?
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timvw7476
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 14, 2021 10:34 am    Post subject: Re: 1972 Bus - engine won't turn on after driving. Flooded? (Help) Reply with quote

The first question would be do you smell unburned gas?
If yes then you may have flooding issues with the carburetor, which could be a
leaky float to a worn out needle & seat (attached to the float)
If it's the carb(s), they get repaired, rebuilt, or replaced.
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jlrftype7
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 14, 2021 11:06 am    Post subject: Re: 1972 Bus - engine won't turn on after driving. Flooded? (Help) Reply with quote

Check your oil level and also smell the dipstick on the engine. If you are losing gas into the engine via a carb leaking down into the intake, you will generally have a higher than normal oil level or/and, the oil will smell of gas if you take a whiff.
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 14, 2021 11:37 am    Post subject: Re: 1972 Bus - engine won't turn on after driving. Flooded? (Help) Reply with quote

What Carburetor or Carburetors are you running? I’m guessing Weber progressive.

Details of engine and induction set up would help. This could also be a starter issue or other things.
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Wildthings
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 14, 2021 1:06 pm    Post subject: Re: 1972 Bus - engine won't turn on after driving. Flooded? (Help) Reply with quote

How about some pictures of your carb setup. Also remove the air cleaner and take a picture looking down into the top of the carb when it will not start.
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chaunceyjung
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 14, 2021 4:00 pm    Post subject: Re: 1972 Bus - engine won't turn on after driving. Flooded? (Help) Reply with quote

Hi, Thanks for all the reply.
I will take some pictures when I get home.
As far as oil or gas smell- YES I smell it a lot.
Actually my wife and cousin who used to ride in 3rd row complained that there was so much gas smell.
I thought that was part of fun driving bus....
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chaunceyjung
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 14, 2021 5:56 pm    Post subject: Re: 1972 Bus - engine won't turn on after driving. Flooded? (Help) Reply with quote

Here are the pictures. Let me know if you need different angle.
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 14, 2021 8:55 pm    Post subject: Re: 1972 Bus - engine won't turn on after driving. Flooded? (Help) Reply with quote

Great images. 34 ICTs with factory fuel pump I do believe.
I would pull a sparkplug from left & right side & compare color of insulator,
it's possible one carb has a malfunction in the inlet needle or the float.

The first thing would be checking the breaker points, when the gap on the points closes easy starts & smooth running become elusive. Gap is .016".
It closes over time & miles.
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 14, 2021 9:36 pm    Post subject: Re: 1972 Bus - engine won't turn on after driving. Flooded? (Help) Reply with quote

Here’s some friendly advice. Before you try to run the engine try harder to keep your bus from catching fire. Your fuel line is old and cracked. Thanks for the detailed pictures but wow, you need help
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 14, 2021 10:15 pm    Post subject: Re: 1972 Bus - engine won't turn on after driving. Flooded? (Help) Reply with quote

Actually my wife and cousin who used to ride in 3rd row complained that there was so much gas smell.

This is a problem. Going down the road and smelling fuel vapors could be as simple as your rear hatch rubber being missing. They could be smelling exhaust being drafted back into the bus due to the low pressure area created by that loaf of bread moving through the air. It could be a leaking fuel tank vent system. It could be rubber hoses behind your firewall. It could be your engine driven fuel pump leaking. Whatever it is you need to fix it pronto and be sure to always carry a fully charged extinguisher on board. I speak from personal experience.
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 15, 2021 2:52 am    Post subject: Re: 1972 Bus - engine won't turn on after driving. Flooded? (Help) Reply with quote

At some time in the past your engine was blowing oil every where, while the engine looks pretty clean today I would be wanting to wipe down the insides of the engine compartment so its not such a nasty mess. You may want to use some spray solvent or at least a solvent moistened rag so the oily smear comes off easier.

Yes you want to change out your fuel lines and you might want to add a marine anti siphon valve or electric fuel cut off at the tank outlet while you are at it. Engine fires are far from fun. Use Gate Barricade 30r14 fuel line as it can handle the ethanol in today's fuel, I believe you will need two different sizes for the fuel lines themselves and then you will need whatever size you need to fix the fuel tank vent lines.

I would be wanting to change any and all rubber hoses and boots affecting you intake air system, vacuum leaks throw things out of whack and people often respond by turning screws to richen up the carbs and maybe go so far at to rejet them, which could be why yours will not always start well now. Someone may know a good baseline jetting and adjustments for your particular carbs and will hopefully post.

Your tuneup needs to be right on to get a good start as well. Clean properly gapped contact points, and newish properly gapped spark plugs of the right heat range. You are going to want your timing set at 28-30° BTDC @3800 rpm, with any hoses going to the distributor removed. I avoid Bosch tuneup parts any more as they quality and gone down hill badly and use Echlin ventilated points from NAPA and NGK spark plugs instead.

The proper VW experience is an engine that starts well every time, doesn't spit and sputter and has no odd smells and makes decent power and get decent gas mileage. Initially it can take a lot of your time to reach this point.
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 15, 2021 5:40 am    Post subject: Re: 1972 Bus - engine won't turn on after driving. Flooded? (Help) Reply with quote

All the above is correct. Please take it to a competent ACVW mechanic for repair and service. The carburetor issues may be beyond the attention a novice could provide.
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 15, 2021 8:03 am    Post subject: Re: 1972 Bus - engine won't turn on after driving. Flooded? (Help) Reply with quote

chaunceyjung wrote:
Here are the pictures. Let me know if you need different angle.
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Where's the hose on the right side of the canister going to?
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 15, 2021 8:27 am    Post subject: Re: 1972 Bus - engine won't turn on after driving. Flooded? (Help) Reply with quote

Thank you all for kind and in-depth reply.
I really appreciate it although I don't understand most of it.
I will take some time today and tomorrow to digest it - need to google and youtube sometimes.

One last question, do any of yall live in Southern California?
If you do can you recommend me good mechanic for this kind of problem?
I live in Long Beach, CA.
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 15, 2021 8:28 am    Post subject: Re: 1972 Bus - engine won't turn on after driving. Flooded? (Help) Reply with quote

Perhaps one of the floats in a carb is leaking, then sinking, and not stopping fuel pouring into the carb - thus flooding the engine and making it tough to start.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 15, 2021 8:50 am    Post subject: Re: 1972 Bus - engine won't turn on after driving. Flooded? (Help) Reply with quote

chaunceyjung wrote:
As far as oil or gas smell- YES I smell it a lot.
Actually my wife and cousin who used to ride in 3rd row complained that there was so much gas smell.
I thought that was part of fun driving bus....

You should not be smelling gasoline. That is a bad sign, and could lead to a fire.

The old and cracked fuel line that is attached to the fuel filter looks dangerous. Don't use that braided hose, even though that is what was used originally with these vehicles. the nature of fuel has changed, as BusDaddy points out. You need the Gates Barricade fuel hose that he mentioned. There are also many short connections of fuel lines and fuel vapor lines around the engine compartment and up into the air intake towers. Make sure all of those are replaced with fresh hose.

I think you should stop driving the bus until you get the fuel smell sorted out. It is not the cause of your starting problem, but it is part of good maintenance practice.

Buy a VW Bus service manual (by Bentley Publishers) and start learning about your bus. It may take a few years to get it all into your head and get the bus "dialed in", but once you do, it will perform well and serve you well and be a joy to own.

Southern California (and the Pacific Northwest) is probably one of the few places left where you can find mechanics who will work on these old buses. Good luck!
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 15, 2021 9:36 am    Post subject: Re: 1972 Bus - engine won't turn on after driving. Flooded? (Help) Reply with quote

A copy of John Muir's VW Idiot Book is a good source of info for a newbie. I read it cover to cover 5 decades back when I first got into aircooled VWs.
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 17, 2021 5:07 am    Post subject: Re: 1972 Bus - engine won't turn on after driving. Flooded? (Help) Reply with quote

I had a similar problem in the past. One of my carburetor bowls had a hairline crack just big enough to allow fuel to run down the manifolds and flood the engine after shut off.

Here’s an easy test: after you shut off the engine, wait an hour and check the fuel level in your carb bowls. If one is empty, chances are your carburetor is cracked, which is unfortunate, but easily fixed by slapping on a new set of carbs.

Hope this helps.

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PostPosted: Sat Apr 17, 2021 9:47 am    Post subject: Re: 1972 Bus - engine won't turn on after driving. Flooded? (Help) Reply with quote

Gas leaking into the crankcase is a common issue with these carbs when they get some mileage on them. You also need to replace your fuel lines. There are also a number of hoses for the fuel ventilation system, charcoal canister etc that need some attention. I drove for years with a bus that smelled like gas. After I replaced those lines, replaced the charcoal canister and plumbed it all correctly, the gas smell went away. Like you, I just thought it was normal.

None of these issues are that hard to deal with, but you are starting from the position of a novice. No problem with that but you have a lot of learning ahead. There is really no good substitute for doing it yourself as it is hard to find someone who knows the ins and outs of these old crates and it becomes really expensive paying a mechanic to learn on your bus.
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 17, 2021 1:38 pm    Post subject: Re: 1972 Bus - engine won't turn on after driving. Flooded? (Help) Reply with quote

Gates Barricade J30R14 for the fuel hose. Your parts guy may have to order it. Also, use FInstyle clamps.

And get the fuel filter out of the engine compartment and away from spark and heat.
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