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Redpepper31 Samba Member
Joined: August 11, 2015 Posts: 37 Location: Austin, TX
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Posted: Thu Nov 29, 2018 8:54 pm Post subject: Drop Spindles |
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I know I'm probably going to get beat up here discussing drop spindles,but I need to lower the front of my 77 bus about 1 inch to fit it in my new parking space under my second story deck. Looking at the Empi 2 inch drop spindles for around $240 and found a place called vintage vdubs that fabricates a 2.5 drop out of my cores for $425.
I drive my bus no more that 2000 miles a year so considering the Chinese Empi spindles but don't want to die from a failed spindle. Any input as to if the Empi's are safe or should I just suck it up and pay for some good ole Merica made stuff? |
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hazetguy Samba Member
Joined: April 06, 2001 Posts: 10773 Location: iT StiNgeD iTseLf tO dEAd
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Posted: Thu Nov 29, 2018 9:13 pm Post subject: Re: Drop Spindles |
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https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=156211 _________________ thebucket: I invested in hoodride, now DBD won't return my call?
hazetguy: invested?
thebucket: Yeah Haze, its where people put money into a company in hopes of a return on their money |
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ratherb-buggin Samba Member
Joined: January 30, 2005 Posts: 985 Location: Shawnee, KS
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Posted: Thu Nov 29, 2018 9:56 pm Post subject: Re: Drop Spindles |
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Wagenswest |
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Redpepper31 Samba Member
Joined: August 11, 2015 Posts: 37 Location: Austin, TX
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Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2018 4:35 am Post subject: Re: Drop Spindles |
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ratherb-buggin wrote: |
Wagenswest |
Nice but $700 for spindles, ouch! |
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ratherb-buggin Samba Member
Joined: January 30, 2005 Posts: 985 Location: Shawnee, KS
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Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2018 5:11 am Post subject: Re: Drop Spindles |
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Redpepper31 wrote: |
ratherb-buggin wrote: |
Wagenswest |
Nice but $700 for spindles, ouch! |
You get what you pay for. Think all of the bus's front weight and turning pressure is on the front spindles. Is that really somewhere where you want to short change? Imagine driving down the road and your spindle breaks!! The geometry is off on Empi spindles and the VV are not worth it.
Cominging from 20+ years of bay experience and a little insight buy the wagenswest spindles or leave the bus stock. |
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Zed999 Samba Member
Joined: March 04, 2018 Posts: 1244 Location: UK
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Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2018 5:15 am Post subject: Re: Drop Spindles |
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Dropped spindles lead to lots of problems - increased track or just too low if they're flipped ones. They are attractive because the beam stays on and it's just a bit of spannering... until you find the tyres hitting the arch and start on your road to fabricating bump stops, coil over shocks or whatever, it never stops at bolting on spindles. If you have early disc brakes they don't fit on many welded spindles so new brakes too, and no backing plate as they don't fir either.
For 1-2" I'd fit adjusters to the beam every time or let your tyres down a bit. |
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ratherb-buggin Samba Member
Joined: January 30, 2005 Posts: 985 Location: Shawnee, KS
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Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2018 5:38 am Post subject: Re: Drop Spindles |
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Zed999 wrote: |
For 1-2" I'd fit adjusters to the beam every time or let your tyres down a bit. |
I agree, for a minor drop a beam can do a lot. Plus you avoid the issues Zed999 mentioned. |
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Redpepper31 Samba Member
Joined: August 11, 2015 Posts: 37 Location: Austin, TX
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Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2018 5:43 am Post subject: Re: Drop Spindles |
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ratherb-buggin wrote: |
Redpepper31 wrote: |
ratherb-buggin wrote: |
Wagenswest |
Nice but $700 for spindles, ouch! |
You get what you pay for. Think all of the bus's front weight and turning pressure is on the front spindles. Is that really somewhere where you want to short change? Imagine driving down the road and your spindle breaks!! The geometry is off on Empi spindles and the VV are not worth it.
Cominging from 20+ years of bay experience and a little insight buy the wagenswest spindles or leave the bus stock. |
Makes sense. I should have figured there wouldn't be a cheap way to do it right. My $3000 budget for the type 4 rebuild ended up at $5000, nothing of quality is cheap on these things. |
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Balmoral1958 Samba Member
Joined: May 13, 2011 Posts: 248 Location: Austin
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Posted: Sat Dec 01, 2018 5:19 pm Post subject: Re: Drop Spindles |
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Hi - I have a '77 and went with the Wagenswest - great quality.
Have Konis and a larger front roll bar - bus handles very well now! _________________ 2x 1974 Karmann Ghia Coup
1984 Citroen 2CV
1956 Citroen 2CV
!984 911 Targa |
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Redpepper31 Samba Member
Joined: August 11, 2015 Posts: 37 Location: Austin, TX
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Posted: Sat Dec 01, 2018 8:54 pm Post subject: Re: Drop Spindles |
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Balmoral1958 wrote: |
Hi - I have a '77 and went with the Wagenswest - great quality.
Have Konis and a larger front roll bar - bus handles very well now! |
Do the Konis help reduce the nosedive when braking? |
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SGKent Samba Member
Joined: October 30, 2007 Posts: 41031 Location: Citrus Heights CA (Near Sacramento)
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Posted: Sat Dec 01, 2018 9:51 pm Post subject: Re: Drop Spindles |
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no. _________________ “Most people don’t know what they’re doing, and a lot of them are really good at it.” - George Carlin |
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airschooled Air-Schooled
Joined: April 04, 2012 Posts: 12721 Location: on a bike ride somewhere
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Posted: Sun Dec 02, 2018 9:40 pm Post subject: Re: Drop Spindles |
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Redpepper31 wrote: |
Do the Konis help reduce the nosedive when braking? |
Enjoy your nose dive; the weight transfer to the front tires give your excellent front brakes better traction.
Robbie _________________ Learn how your vintage VW works. And why it doesn't!
One-on-one tech help for your Volkswagen:
www.airschooled.com |
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Spike0180 Samba Member
Joined: June 06, 2015 Posts: 2269 Location: Detroit, Michigan
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Posted: Mon Dec 03, 2018 6:10 am Post subject: Re: Drop Spindles |
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asiab3 wrote: |
Redpepper31 wrote: |
Do the Konis help reduce the nosedive when braking? |
Enjoy your nose dive; the weight transfer to the front tires give your excellent front brakes better traction.
Robbie |
... you mean how the bus eliminates rear wheel assistance with its nose dive? ... and puts all the breaking on 2 tires instead of 4... and those 2 tires happen to not only be skinny (compared to new vehicles) but also the tires you are requiring to turn your vehicle... so lets have some weight being thrown forward and take most of the weight of the vehicle and toss it up (reducing rear traction so that when the vehicle has to turn, those rear wheels can be nice and light and torque right around the pivot point of your front wheels. It'll be fun!) ... and on top of that, your foot is the abs... nose dive is not a good thing... though I like your optimism! _________________ Brutis Patches Izabich: 1970 VW Transporter - 1776cc DP
Current State: Projects never truly end...
Location: Grosse Pointe, Michigan
Other cars: 2003 F150, 2003 Jetta GLI vr6-6sp
Sambastic: adj; the quality of being nit picky, elitist, expecting everyone to do things the way they believe is best with no regard to situation, "sambastic" |
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Zed999 Samba Member
Joined: March 04, 2018 Posts: 1244 Location: UK
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Posted: Mon Dec 03, 2018 7:27 am Post subject: Re: Drop Spindles |
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That sounds sensible...but isn't it the braking that puts the weight on the front wheels rather than the nose diving? Mine's all stock, I've used the brakes in anger and I wouldn't say the nose dives much. I've had 2" and 4 1/2" lowered vans that didn't behave any different under hard braking, they were all poor compared to modeern braking - no anti-lock.
One wonders why nobody has produced a retro anti-lock system for a bay. Well I do, I think there would be a queque for them. My father was a electronics designer for truck anti-lock systems in the 60's and 70's but sadly he has dementia so no help there.
He used to drive a Jag full of electronics across frozen lakes firing coloured chalk at the ice each time the brakes cut in/out. Neat stuff when you're a kid but I never got a ride as there was only one seat, electronics were big in those days. |
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jtauxe Samba Member
Joined: September 30, 2004 Posts: 5780 Location: Los Alamos, New Mexico
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Posted: Mon Dec 03, 2018 8:06 am Post subject: Re: Drop Spindles |
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It would be better to modify your deck to fit the bus. Just take a Sawzall to the bottom of the joists, adding a nice curve to the bottom that just clears the bus roof. _________________ John
"Travelling in a fried-out Kombi, on a hippie trail, head full of zombie..." - Colin Hay and Ron Strykert
http://vw.tauxe.net
1969 Transporter, 1971 Westfalia, 1976, 1977, 1976, 1977, 1971, 1973, 1977 Westfalias,
1979 Champagne Sunroof, 1974 Westfalia Automatic, 1979 Transporter, 1972 Sportsmobile, 1973 Transporter Wild Westerner, 1974 Westfalia parts bus, 1975 Mexican single cab *FOR SALE*, 1978 Irish 4-door double cab RHD
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Busstom Samba Member
Joined: November 23, 2014 Posts: 3839 Location: San Jose, CA
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Posted: Mon May 10, 2021 11:27 am Post subject: Re: Drop Spindles |
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ratherb-buggin wrote: |
The geometry is off on Empi spindles... |
Do you know which aspect of the geometry is off? How did you measure?
I'm very curious, thanks. |
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