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need help with 1974 1303s front brakes
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Fairmounter
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PostPosted: Mon May 10, 2021 3:56 pm    Post subject: need help with 1974 1303s front brakes Reply with quote

my friend just bought a 74 1303s
lowish miles, very original, lots of early accessories
1303s is a cool model
std beetle size, but has struts and curved windshield like a super, and a lot of chrome
it has been sitting a long time
rear brake refresh went easily, replaced wheel cylinders with std beetle ones
now on to the front
clearly there are issues, one of the four pads is very worn and one of the two disks is very worn
i think he should replace the entire disk, caliper and pads for both front wheels

the problem lies in sourcing the parts
we don't have a service manual, the main question is whether the 1303s uses the same calipers/disks/pads as a standard beetle

second question is, where do you recommend sourcing these from

thanks for any help
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Fairmounter
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PostPosted: Mon May 10, 2021 4:12 pm    Post subject: Re: need help with 1974 1303s front brakes Reply with quote

Judging from these two pages, the front brakes appear different than a standard beetle. standard seems to be 40.0mm cylinder and 1303s appears to be 40.4mm cylinder

any advice in getting these brakes together is greatly appreciated


https://brakeparts.co.uk/shop/VW/BEETLE/72-79/BEET...0Cylinders


https://brakeparts.co.uk/shop/VW/Beetle/70-79/Beet...0Cylinders
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Fairmounter
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PostPosted: Mon May 10, 2021 4:38 pm    Post subject: Re: need help with 1974 1303s front brakes Reply with quote

judging from part numbers here, now i am thinking it could have the same calipers as a super beetle

https://brakeparts.co.uk/shop/VW/Beetle/70-72/Beet...0Cylinders

Can anyone confirm that the 1303s uses the same front brake components as a super?
Hopefully that is the case, if so can anyone recommend a source for super beetle front brake parts?
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Tim Donahoe
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PostPosted: Mon May 10, 2021 4:49 pm    Post subject: Re: need help with 1974 1303s front brakes Reply with quote

I have a 1974 Super Beetle, and the front disc conversion I got was a clone of the Karmann Ghia front disc brakes.

If I were you, I’d contact Jon at Topline Parts, he sells parts exclusive to Super Beetles, and should be able to tell you if the 1303s is the same.

Also, he has the most complete, good-quality conversion kits.

Tim
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PostPosted: Mon May 10, 2021 7:22 pm    Post subject: Re: need help with 1974 1303s front brakes Reply with quote

All of the US market Superbeetle’s received drum brakes on the front. As for the rotors, my understanding is the Ghia, and Type 3 of the US used the same ones. The late Type 3’s used a slightly larger caliper, as did the 914 Porsche’s. See if you can remove a brake pad to measure the overall dimensions, and measure the width of the mounting bolts of the caliper to help determine its size. VW always seemed to use what was on hand. You could also look into what the 924 Porsche’s used for a caliper/pads.

Addition: Here is a site that I found while trying to locate a spindle number for a 1303s. It has multiple caliper/pad VW part numbers that may help you reference what you have. It looks like the OEM manufactures were ATE, and Girling.

https://nemigaparts.com/cat_spares/etka/volkswagen/1200/32/052000/
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PostPosted: Tue May 11, 2021 8:37 am    Post subject: Re: need help with 1974 1303s front brakes Reply with quote

The rubber brake line to the disc.s tend to swell shut inside while the outside looks fine, without the brake shoe springs forcing the fluid back the pads will drag causing excessive wear. Test by jacking the front up and have a helper step hard on the brakes and let off then try turning the front tires to see if they are dragging.
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PostPosted: Wed May 12, 2021 10:28 am    Post subject: Re: need help with 1974 1303s front brakes Reply with quote

Thanks for the help. Parts are hard to come by here, but my friend sourced standard beetle rotors and calipers and they seems to fit ok. The calipers we took off had round pads and the ones he found are square pads. Is there any problem with using square pad calipers on a car that had the round ones? So far they seem to fit fine.
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PostPosted: Wed May 12, 2021 11:36 am    Post subject: Re: need help with 1974 1303s front brakes Reply with quote

Fairmounter wrote:
Thanks for the help. Parts are hard to come by here, but my friend sourced standard beetle rotors and calipers and they seems to fit ok. The calipers we took off had round pads and the ones he found are square pads. Is there any problem with using square pad calipers on a car that had the round ones? So far they seem to fit fine.


As long as you have new rotors the square pads are fine.
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PostPosted: Wed May 12, 2021 12:18 pm    Post subject: Re: need help with 1974 1303s front brakes Reply with quote

Ok, thanks. We hope to get it out on a test drive this weekend.


Starbucket wrote:
Fairmounter wrote:
Thanks for the help. Parts are hard to come by here, but my friend sourced standard beetle rotors and calipers and they seems to fit ok. The calipers we took off had round pads and the ones he found are square pads. Is there any problem with using square pad calipers on a car that had the round ones? So far they seem to fit fine.


As long as you have new rotors the square pads are fine.

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PostPosted: Wed May 12, 2021 4:40 pm    Post subject: Re: need help with 1974 1303s front brakes Reply with quote

The pads are retracted by the "flex" in the seals in the pistons. If you have one side of the pad worn more than the other then one piston is seized either in the off or on position.

Calipers can be rebuilt quite easily, but the pistons may have been corroded past the point of doing this.

My Euro '68 had discs as standard. There are two types of OEM pads used on beetles. Early ones had one pin retainer on the pad and later ones had two pins. All the pads were square.
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PostPosted: Wed May 12, 2021 5:03 pm    Post subject: Re: need help with 1974 1303s front brakes Reply with quote

viiking wrote:
The pads are retracted by the "flex" in the seals in the pistons. If you have one side of the pad worn more than the other then one piston is seized either in the off or on position.

Calipers can be rebuilt quite easily, but the pistons may have been corroded past the point of doing this.

My Euro '68 had discs as standard. There are two types of OEM pads used on beetles. Early ones had one pin retainer on the pad and later ones had two pins. All the pads were square.


With the disposable mentality in most of today’s auto parts, finding rebuild kits may even be difficult.

That nemigaparts site actually has listings for 3 different pads. A single pin ATE, a dual pin ATE that were both square, and a single pin Girling that was round. It sounds as if the op has the Girling caliper, but apparently it is interchangeable with the aftermarket ATE design with the dual pin square pads.
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