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rbsurfguy Samba Member
Joined: August 10, 2008 Posts: 1757 Location: Fairfax, Northern Virginia Formerly Huntington Beach, SoCal
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Posted: Mon Jun 14, 2021 8:03 am Post subject: Re: Jeff's 71 Vert Restoration/Reassembly |
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Braukuche wrote: |
The bow will require a second spongy seal in the groove that sits on the second step up.
I didn’t know about the shims for the window seals. I adjusted my windows best I could but still have a gap on the back edge. Guess I will have to look for some rubber to shim it out with.
I’ve been lazy about updating my own thread. I did learn some stuff the hard way.
After the headliner is installed it’s important to follow this order of assembly.
1: wind lacing. Only use the carpet tacks in the spots required the other holes are for screws for the hinge covers. The carpet tacks can be bought from Wolfsburgwest.
2: hinge covers. Mark on the edge where your three screw holes should go make sure they don’t line up with carpet tacks. If using the shoulder harness point drill out ahead of time. Mount the hinge cover.
3: back of rear sear.
4: rear carpet pieces. |
Thank you Sir, can you explain what you mean by this: "The bow will require a second spongy seal in the groove that sits on the second step up."
Not sure what that means. The spongy seal I used along the front edge of the bow looks great.
Re the shims, yeah I learned that from reading other threads, and when I found a few pieces on the original weather strip, I could see where I could use it to move the new rubber closer to the windows after making all the final adjustments. The hardest part was drilling out all the new holes to move the rubber closer to the glass, screw in the correct size screws, and using longer screws where I had to add the shims. Depending on how thick of a shim you need, I had thought about, before finding factory shim rubber, taking the old rubber and cutting it down to fit the gaps. I think if you have any long pieces, you could trim them down on a flat sanding belt to get them to the thickness (thinner?) as you would need.
I have the tacks already and many of the originals are still in place waiting for me to pull them and replace or reuse.
#2- good idea re hinge cover prep. I've had to repair cracks on them and plan on covering with whatever cloth material I use for the seats and/or door panels.
Noted for #3-4
Thanks,
Jeff _________________ 1971 Ghia convertible (Body off rebuild)
2019 VW Atlas 4Motion
2012 Passat-Sold
See my build on The Samba at:
Jeff's 71 Vert Restoration/Reassembly http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=6...highlight= |
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crocteau Samba Member
Joined: March 31, 2005 Posts: 1204 Location: Philaburbia
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Posted: Mon Jun 14, 2021 12:53 pm Post subject: Re: Jeff's 71 Vert Restoration/Reassembly |
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rbsurfguy wrote: |
... can you explain what you mean by this: "The bow will require a second spongy seal in the groove that sits on the second step up."
Not sure what that means. The spongy seal I used along the front edge of the bow looks great. |
Jeff, I'll let Braukuche elaborate, but in the interim note item 27 in this composite from the parts manual, below. Chuck provided both the seals, the item 27 spongy seal and the more recent weatherstrip type seal item 28, in the top kit I purchased, and FWIW he lists both on his site. You're really coming right along with it; looking good!
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rbsurfguy Samba Member
Joined: August 10, 2008 Posts: 1757 Location: Fairfax, Northern Virginia Formerly Huntington Beach, SoCal
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Posted: Mon Jun 14, 2021 1:50 pm Post subject: Re: Jeff's 71 Vert Restoration/Reassembly |
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Thank you Sir. Sorry for being frustrating, but since mine is a 71 it matches more #'s 28 and 29. I looked at that in the parts manual on the page you provided. That said, I guess I was confused about his "second step up" statement. I realize that the spongy trim goes directly onto the wood bow 'Before' putting the top cover on, got that. Does the second trim piece #29 go on outside the top skin and under that plastic cover plate, or onto the windshield frame? Previous to tearing down my Ghia, I had a thin rubber strip along the top of the windshield frame. Sorry for being confused, just want to be sure I only place the needed item 1 time, instead of multiple times like other parts!!
Always appreciate your and others' input and guidance.
Jeff _________________ 1971 Ghia convertible (Body off rebuild)
2019 VW Atlas 4Motion
2012 Passat-Sold
See my build on The Samba at:
Jeff's 71 Vert Restoration/Reassembly http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=6...highlight= |
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Braukuche Samba Member
Joined: September 03, 2004 Posts: 11005
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Posted: Mon Jun 14, 2021 2:42 pm Post subject: Re: Jeff's 71 Vert Restoration/Reassembly |
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rbsurfguy wrote: |
Thank you Sir. Sorry for being frustrating, but since mine is a 71 it matches more #'s 28 and 29. I looked at that in the parts manual on the page you provided. That said, I guess I was confused about his "second step up" statement. I realize that the spongy trim goes directly onto the wood bow 'Before' putting the top cover on, got that. Does the second trim piece #29 go on outside the top skin and under that plastic cover plate, or onto the windshield frame? Previous to tearing down my Ghia, I had a thin rubber strip along the top of the windshield frame. Sorry for being confused, just want to be sure I only place the needed item 1 time, instead of multiple times like other parts!!
Always appreciate your and others' input and guidance.
Jeff |
Using the install guide chuck sells from VW, they show a foam strip that goes into the groove between the locating pins and n the other side tapering off. It glues on and is covered by extra top material, which my kit didn’t come with, so I used headliner material.
As for the rubber strip and metal piece, chuck included both the foam seal and the rubber strip. The VW directions only show the foam strips being used so that’s the route I went. _________________ Go Reds! Smash state!
Retirement is here!
1956 Ghia
1959 SO-23 Westfalia
1960 double cab
1960 Baja Bug
1963 stretched double cab
1962 Golde sunroof Ghia
1963 356 B coupe
1963 Notchback
1967 21 window less rusty now |
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rbsurfguy Samba Member
Joined: August 10, 2008 Posts: 1757 Location: Fairfax, Northern Virginia Formerly Huntington Beach, SoCal
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Posted: Mon Jun 14, 2021 3:03 pm Post subject: Re: Jeff's 71 Vert Restoration/Reassembly |
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Awesome, thank you Sir, that makes more sense now. When I order my top material from Chuck, I'll be sure to get that part as well.
Jeff _________________ 1971 Ghia convertible (Body off rebuild)
2019 VW Atlas 4Motion
2012 Passat-Sold
See my build on The Samba at:
Jeff's 71 Vert Restoration/Reassembly http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=6...highlight= |
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rbsurfguy Samba Member
Joined: August 10, 2008 Posts: 1757 Location: Fairfax, Northern Virginia Formerly Huntington Beach, SoCal
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Posted: Mon Jun 14, 2021 3:26 pm Post subject: Re: Jeff's 71 Vert Restoration/Reassembly |
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What about this plastic piece? https://chucksconvertibleparts.com/index.php/model...-trim.html
Chuck's calls this front header bow inner trim. I've always seen this, and had one previously, mounted outside the top skin/headliner closing against the windshield frame. Now I'm confused about this part. Does it go between the header bow and headliner, or outside as I've had it previously? So many little pieces!
Jeff _________________ 1971 Ghia convertible (Body off rebuild)
2019 VW Atlas 4Motion
2012 Passat-Sold
See my build on The Samba at:
Jeff's 71 Vert Restoration/Reassembly http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=6...highlight= |
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Braukuche Samba Member
Joined: September 03, 2004 Posts: 11005
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Posted: Mon Jun 14, 2021 4:10 pm Post subject: Re: Jeff's 71 Vert Restoration/Reassembly |
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rbsurfguy wrote: |
What about this plastic piece? https://chucksconvertibleparts.com/index.php/model...-trim.html
Chuck's calls this front header bow inner trim. I've always seen this, and had one previously, mounted outside the top skin/headliner closing against the windshield frame. Now I'm confused about this part. Does it go between the header bow and headliner, or outside as I've had it previously? So many little pieces!
Jeff |
You wrap it is headliner material and it screws to inside of the header. It trims off the header. _________________ Go Reds! Smash state!
Retirement is here!
1956 Ghia
1959 SO-23 Westfalia
1960 double cab
1960 Baja Bug
1963 stretched double cab
1962 Golde sunroof Ghia
1963 356 B coupe
1963 Notchback
1967 21 window less rusty now |
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Marcdeb Samba Member
Joined: May 22, 2019 Posts: 3036 Location: Vermont
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Posted: Mon Jun 14, 2021 4:35 pm Post subject: Re: Jeff's 71 Vert Restoration/Reassembly |
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rbsurfguy wrote: |
What about this plastic piece? https://chucksconvertibleparts.com/index.php/model...-trim.html
Chuck's calls this front header bow inner trim. I've always seen this, and had one previously, mounted outside the top skin/headliner closing against the windshield frame. Now I'm confused about this part. Does it go between the header bow and headliner, or outside as I've had it previously? So many little pieces!
Jeff |
On the outside. Here's an original factory top on a 1970 Ghia.
_________________ Marc
68 Karmann Ghia Cabrio Autostick
71 Karmann Ghia Cabrio
Previously Owned:
2011 VW EOS Hard Top Conv
2008 Saab 9-3 2.0T Conv
2003 Saab 9-3 SE Conv
2001 Saab 9-3 Conv
1998 BMW 3 Series Conv
1997 Saab 900 Conv
1997 Mazda Miata
68 Ghia Vert Survivor with 22,350 miles: https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=768107&highlight=
71 Ghia Vert Restoration: https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=726710&postorder=asc |
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rbsurfguy Samba Member
Joined: August 10, 2008 Posts: 1757 Location: Fairfax, Northern Virginia Formerly Huntington Beach, SoCal
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Posted: Mon Jun 14, 2021 6:21 pm Post subject: Re: Jeff's 71 Vert Restoration/Reassembly |
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Thanks Marc, that's what I thought, I've always had and seen that piece mounted exactly like that, never seen it mounted inside and not sure how it would mount exactly. Not to say if it's correct or not, it's just always how I've seen it.
Now there's this piece which I am not sure if it mounts on the wood bow between or along where the location pins are, or on the outside of the top where it meets the windshield as is described. https://chucksconvertibleparts.com/index.php/front-top-seal-1096.html
There's so many pieces I've never seen before, I guess I didn't pay attention to it when I replaced the first top around 25 years ago....Interesting. I'm becoming as inquisitive and frustrated as 'Trylon'-Michael Speaking of which, he's not posted in a while...hope he hasn't fried his cool Ghia.
Jeff _________________ 1971 Ghia convertible (Body off rebuild)
2019 VW Atlas 4Motion
2012 Passat-Sold
See my build on The Samba at:
Jeff's 71 Vert Restoration/Reassembly http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=6...highlight= |
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Braukuche Samba Member
Joined: September 03, 2004 Posts: 11005
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Posted: Mon Jun 14, 2021 7:25 pm Post subject: Re: Jeff's 71 Vert Restoration/Reassembly |
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rbsurfguy wrote: |
Thanks Marc, that's what I thought, I've always had and seen that piece mounted exactly like that, never seen it mounted inside and not sure how it would mount exactly. Not to say if it's correct or not, it's just always how I've seen it.
Now there's this piece which I am not sure if it mounts on the wood bow between or along where the location pins are, or on the outside of the top where it meets the windshield as is described. https://chucksconvertibleparts.com/index.php/front-top-seal-1096.html
There's so many pieces I've never seen before, I guess I didn't pay attention to it when I replaced the first top around 25 years ago....Interesting. I'm becoming as inquisitive and frustrated as 'Trylon'-Michael Speaking of which, he's not posted in a while...hope he hasn't fried his cool Ghia.
Jeff |
Isn’t that the piece that’s supposed to mount on the outside of the top where it meets the windshield frame using a metal strip like the window seals use. However, I was told years ago that it was better to use the foam seal which goes under the top so I never use the external rubber one. The instruction booklet Chuck sells doesn’t even show that part being installed, instead it has directions for the foam seal. _________________ Go Reds! Smash state!
Retirement is here!
1956 Ghia
1959 SO-23 Westfalia
1960 double cab
1960 Baja Bug
1963 stretched double cab
1962 Golde sunroof Ghia
1963 356 B coupe
1963 Notchback
1967 21 window less rusty now |
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rbsurfguy Samba Member
Joined: August 10, 2008 Posts: 1757 Location: Fairfax, Northern Virginia Formerly Huntington Beach, SoCal
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Posted: Mon Jun 14, 2021 7:37 pm Post subject: Re: Jeff's 71 Vert Restoration/Reassembly |
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Braukuche wrote: |
Isn’t that the piece that’s supposed to mount on the outside of the top where it meets the windshield frame using a metal strip like the window seals use. However, I was told years ago that it was better to use the foam seal which goes under the top so I never use the external rubber one. The instruction booklet Chuck sells doesn’t even show that part being installed, instead it has directions for the foam seal. |
I agree, I had that rubber piece originally mounted on top of the windshield. As I remember years ago when I put my first top on, I think I had the Chuck's install manual but don't remember that piece, I honestly don't remember the inner rubber piece either. But since you and others had mentioned it, I'm going with the foam rubber inside the top. I have it sealing very nicely now, that is until I get the top skin on and then no doubt will have to readjust.
Jeff _________________ 1971 Ghia convertible (Body off rebuild)
2019 VW Atlas 4Motion
2012 Passat-Sold
See my build on The Samba at:
Jeff's 71 Vert Restoration/Reassembly http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=6...highlight= |
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rbsurfguy Samba Member
Joined: August 10, 2008 Posts: 1757 Location: Fairfax, Northern Virginia Formerly Huntington Beach, SoCal
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Posted: Mon Jun 21, 2021 3:11 pm Post subject: Re: Jeff's 71 Vert Restoration/Reassembly |
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Got some time in this weekend to mess with a few things. Dug out the windshield weather strip to do some pre-fitting. Rubber was difficult to stretch even after leaving it in the sun for a bit. I set it into the windshield frame and most of the rubber fell easily into place with much of the inner lip setting into place. I'm hoping when I permanently mount it will draw in as easy....of course we'll see!
More pre-fitting with the little rubber wedge pieces held down by the chrome strips, I forget all the names for those, but had to pre-drill some holes, so got them fitted.
Moved to the Intermediate Bow. Where it flops against the vert frame, there's these small holes at the ends where a little rubber bumper sits. I noticed drivers side set flat, but passenger side was slightly raised. Tried to bend a little but decided not to possibly screw it up. In place of buying new bumpers, I seem to have had some extra anti glass rattle pieces that normally go in the doors so the windows don't rattle. After chipping away at the little pointy tab that fits in the hole, I was able to wedge them in place, allowing for a soft landing of the bow. Since the drivers side originally set flat, I shaved the top of that button until the pass side touched down, problem solved, money saved...I think that's called repurposing.
Finally, went to work on the fold down rear glass. Removed the hinges and latches, needed to replace the gaskets and frame was dirty and scarred up. Washed it, sanded the frame, taped it up, sprayed some POR15 as a base, then let fly with some semi-gloss top coat. Came out nice!
Good news was hearing from the guy working on my engine that he was buttoning things up and balancing the pressure plate to balance with everything else he worked on, so fingers crossed I'll see it soon!
All for now.
Jeff _________________ 1971 Ghia convertible (Body off rebuild)
2019 VW Atlas 4Motion
2012 Passat-Sold
See my build on The Samba at:
Jeff's 71 Vert Restoration/Reassembly http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=6...highlight= |
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Trylon Samba Member
Joined: August 16, 2019 Posts: 4853 Location: Connecticut
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Posted: Mon Jun 21, 2021 4:38 pm Post subject: Re: Jeff's 71 Vert Restoration/Reassembly |
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Hat’s off to you — I could barely stand to watch a professional install my windshield.
Great to see progress— do we have some tangible goal/deadline other than “I’d like to drive it sometime”? _________________ 1973 Porsche 914 2.0
1959 Volkswagen Karmann Ghia
1979 Volkswagen Rabbit
1973 Volkswagen Bus
1970 MGB-GT
1962 Oldsmobile Jetfire
More tomfoolery on
The Karmann Ghia Fever YouTube Channel! |
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rbsurfguy Samba Member
Joined: August 10, 2008 Posts: 1757 Location: Fairfax, Northern Virginia Formerly Huntington Beach, SoCal
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Posted: Mon Jun 21, 2021 4:45 pm Post subject: Re: Jeff's 71 Vert Restoration/Reassembly |
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Trylon wrote: |
Hat’s off to you — I could barely stand to watch a professional install my windshield.
Great to see progress— do we have some tangible goal/deadline other than “I’d like to drive it sometime”? |
Thanks. If I had the answer to that question I'd be a cryptocurrency billionaire! Alas, some things are dependent on what I farmed out to others...I'm sure you can understand that. This is why I toil with all the little things so when the major components are ready I can slap the big pieces on. Mid to end of summer would be great....Hopefully to at least get a test run.
I have to get mine on the road before Marc so I can slap that shiny nose piece on!!
Jeff _________________ 1971 Ghia convertible (Body off rebuild)
2019 VW Atlas 4Motion
2012 Passat-Sold
See my build on The Samba at:
Jeff's 71 Vert Restoration/Reassembly http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=6...highlight= |
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Marcdeb Samba Member
Joined: May 22, 2019 Posts: 3036 Location: Vermont
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Posted: Mon Jun 21, 2021 4:48 pm Post subject: Re: Jeff's 71 Vert Restoration/Reassembly |
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Amazing that these cars can be dismantled in a day or two, but seem to take so long to put back together again! Good thing it's fun to work on them. Now I understand the need to have more than one VW, got to have a backup to drive around in while working on the other! _________________ Marc
68 Karmann Ghia Cabrio Autostick
71 Karmann Ghia Cabrio
Previously Owned:
2011 VW EOS Hard Top Conv
2008 Saab 9-3 2.0T Conv
2003 Saab 9-3 SE Conv
2001 Saab 9-3 Conv
1998 BMW 3 Series Conv
1997 Saab 900 Conv
1997 Mazda Miata
68 Ghia Vert Survivor with 22,350 miles: https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=768107&highlight=
71 Ghia Vert Restoration: https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=726710&postorder=asc |
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rbsurfguy Samba Member
Joined: August 10, 2008 Posts: 1757 Location: Fairfax, Northern Virginia Formerly Huntington Beach, SoCal
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Posted: Mon Jun 21, 2021 4:56 pm Post subject: Re: Jeff's 71 Vert Restoration/Reassembly |
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Yeah, tearing down and bagging, with a little destruction at times seems to go much faster. Look at a building, how long it takes to design, construct, get operational, and with one swing of of a BF'ing wrecking ball or a couple sticks of blasting plastic, it comes down quickly.
Building and restoring takes us to a precision level to do what probably 50 men on a line did in a day....plus find all the replacement parts, NOS, Repop, or used originals, add time to the clock....
My Deputy told me when I finally finish this Ghia I'm going to have to find something else to do or another car.....I've plenty of continuous Honey Do's to keep me busy for a lifetime!
I've come close at times to picking something else up just to drive around, but keep telling myself to use the money for goodies and upgrades on what I have. Soon grasshopper, soon!
Jeff. _________________ 1971 Ghia convertible (Body off rebuild)
2019 VW Atlas 4Motion
2012 Passat-Sold
See my build on The Samba at:
Jeff's 71 Vert Restoration/Reassembly http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=6...highlight= |
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Marcdeb Samba Member
Joined: May 22, 2019 Posts: 3036 Location: Vermont
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obus Samba Member
Joined: March 08, 2001 Posts: 11071 Location: just off Garden State Parkway Exit 81
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rbsurfguy Samba Member
Joined: August 10, 2008 Posts: 1757 Location: Fairfax, Northern Virginia Formerly Huntington Beach, SoCal
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Posted: Tue Jun 22, 2021 5:34 am Post subject: Re: Jeff's 71 Vert Restoration/Reassembly |
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obus wrote: |
I have 3 and none of them run properly right now GRRR |
That's why I just stick with one until completed, otherwise they will all be in various non-working condition. My dad always had multiple non running VW's and it pissed me off that I could never get him to focus on one or especially give me one of the three Notchbacks he had...They eventually went to someone else and I never had a chance to build just one of those rare models.
Ok, focus on Ghia, focus on Ghia........
Jeff _________________ 1971 Ghia convertible (Body off rebuild)
2019 VW Atlas 4Motion
2012 Passat-Sold
See my build on The Samba at:
Jeff's 71 Vert Restoration/Reassembly http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=6...highlight= |
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rbsurfguy Samba Member
Joined: August 10, 2008 Posts: 1757 Location: Fairfax, Northern Virginia Formerly Huntington Beach, SoCal
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Posted: Sat Jun 26, 2021 4:00 pm Post subject: Re: Jeff's 71 Vert Restoration/Reassembly |
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Decided since I cleaned up the rear window frame, it was time to clean up the hinges of 50 years of gunk. Started like this:
Hit them with the power wire brush
Put on some POR15 Chassis Black
Then hit it with some Rustoleum semi-gloss paint
Have the gaskets on order from Airhead so I can mount everything in place.
Came out nice, now just drying. Did some trimming of the window scraper rubber, but haven't mounted the chrome yet. Next step.
Jeff _________________ 1971 Ghia convertible (Body off rebuild)
2019 VW Atlas 4Motion
2012 Passat-Sold
See my build on The Samba at:
Jeff's 71 Vert Restoration/Reassembly http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=6...highlight= |
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