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Lennert.vw Samba Member
Joined: May 12, 2020 Posts: 20 Location: Geel
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Posted: Thu Jun 17, 2021 9:28 am Post subject: Typ 12 convertible?? |
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The topic about the Typ 32 has been brought back in a certain way, people are again discussing about the early history of the beetle. So I feel like now is a good time to discuss another beetle forerunner by Porsche.
Anyways I have read numerous times that of the three Zündapp Typ 12 prototypes one was a convertible. Has some more information about this.
If find this quite unlikely because in the early 1930s german citizens weren't in the best situation, cars were a luxury let alone a convertible. The fate of the Typ 12 was a lack of financial support (and also because the car was a flop, mostly the engine's fault) so considering these two thing I find it hard to believe that Zündapp would make a convertible volkswagen or "Qualitäts-kleinwagen" as they called it.
Hopefully some of you have some more info on this.
Kind regards
_________________ 58 ragtop bug |
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finster Samba Member
Joined: May 26, 2012 Posts: 7951 Location: north o' the border
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Posted: Thu Jun 17, 2021 11:16 am Post subject: Re: Typ 12 convertible?? |
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this photo is supposedly the first type 12 and seems to have a convertible (and rather dated) look to it. that's ferry porsche standing by. a convertible needn't be a full blown expensive cabrio. many economy cars at that time were convertibles or cabrio saloons.
_________________ "we're here on Earth to fart around" kurt vonnegut
nothing lasts, nothing is finished, and nothing is perfect... |
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Lennert.vw Samba Member
Joined: May 12, 2020 Posts: 20 Location: Geel
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Posted: Thu Jun 17, 2021 12:08 pm Post subject: Re: Typ 12 convertible?? |
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finster wrote: |
this photo is supposedly the first type 12 and seems to have a convertible (and rather dated) look to it. that's ferry porsche standing by. a convertible needn't be a full blown expensive cabrio. many economy cars at that time were convertibles or cabrio saloons.
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I've seen this picture before but I always thought that it was a Wanderer, but now that I see the front it does look like a Typ 12, but thats also the only thing to recognise it.
Since this car looks so dated I wonder if the 2 other limousines looked the same or different.
Thanks for the info. _________________ 58 ragtop bug |
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finster Samba Member
Joined: May 26, 2012 Posts: 7951 Location: north o' the border
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Posted: Fri Jun 18, 2021 6:38 am Post subject: Re: Typ 12 convertible?? |
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I wonder if that photo was taken in reutter's body shop? the design looks like a step on from the boehler-wagen (designed by fidelis boehler) that zundapp were looking to make in 1931
and the mercedes 120H prototype _________________ "we're here on Earth to fart around" kurt vonnegut
nothing lasts, nothing is finished, and nothing is perfect... |
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Blue Baron VW Aficionado
Joined: June 16, 2006 Posts: 24104 Location: Southeast USA
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Posted: Fri Jun 18, 2021 8:12 pm Post subject: Re: Typ 12 convertible?? |
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Lennert.vw wrote: |
finster wrote: |
this photo is supposedly the first type 12 and seems to have a convertible (and rather dated) look to it. that's ferry porsche standing by. a convertible needn't be a full blown expensive cabrio. many economy cars at that time were convertibles or cabrio saloons.
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I've seen this picture before but I always thought that it was a Wanderer, but now that I see the front it does look like a Typ 12, but thats also the only thing to recognise it.
Since this car looks so dated I wonder if the 2 other limousines looked the same or different.
Thanks for the info. |
It looks a lot like they stripped the car behind it to repurpose the body. It also looks like just a body mockup, with no chassis or running gear. _________________ We are striving for perfection, to make our cars run forever, if possible.
Heinz Nordhoff |
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finster Samba Member
Joined: May 26, 2012 Posts: 7951 Location: north o' the border
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Posted: Sat Jun 19, 2021 1:25 am Post subject: Re: Typ 12 convertible?? |
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I've read that the bodies were made by reutter then transported to zundapp who made the chassis and running gear...so the photo would seem to match this.
and I came across this regarding their fate...Two of the three prototypes of the Zündapp Beetle were scrapped in Nuremberg in the mid-thirties, the number 3 remained until 1944.
this is an interesting article about porsche and zundapp but it's a shame the photos aren't captioned.http://www.austroclassic.at/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=8458&Itemid=46 _________________ "we're here on Earth to fart around" kurt vonnegut
nothing lasts, nothing is finished, and nothing is perfect... |
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mandraks Samba Member
Joined: November 28, 2004 Posts: 7050 Location: Lawrenceville, Ga
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Posted: Sat Jun 19, 2021 1:16 pm Post subject: Re: Typ 12 convertible?? |
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finster wrote: |
I've read that the bodies were made by reutter then transported to zundapp who made the chassis and running gear...so the photo would seem to match this.
and I came across this regarding their fate...Two of the three prototypes of the Zündapp Beetle were scrapped in Nuremberg in the mid-thirties, the number 3 remained until 1944.
this is an interesting article about porsche and zundapp but it's a shame the photos aren't captioned.http://www.austroclassic.at/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=8458&Itemid=46 |
they are captioned, albeit in German? _________________ regards
Uli
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'53 3-Fold Oval, L35 Metallic Blue, looking for a narrow hatch panel |
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fossil Samba Member
Joined: November 22, 2011 Posts: 36 Location: Germany
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Posted: Sat Jun 19, 2021 11:18 pm Post subject: Re: Typ 12 convertible?? |
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No, they are not. The running text is not directly linked to the pictures, for some a relation can be recognized. |
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Lennert.vw Samba Member
Joined: May 12, 2020 Posts: 20 Location: Geel
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Posted: Sun Jun 20, 2021 2:13 am Post subject: Re: Typ 12 convertible?? |
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finster wrote: |
I've read that the bodies were made by reutter then transported to zundapp who made the chassis and running gear...so the photo would seem to match this.
and I came across this regarding their fate...Two of the three prototypes of the Zündapp Beetle were scrapped in Nuremberg in the mid-thirties, the number 3 remained until 1944.
this is an interesting article about porsche and zundapp but it's a shame the photos aren't captioned.http://www.austroclassic.at/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=8458&Itemid=46 |
That article is gold, also the first time that I have seen the 3 cyl radial engine. To my knowledge that engine was not produced, I could be wrong. _________________ 58 ragtop bug |
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finster Samba Member
Joined: May 26, 2012 Posts: 7951 Location: north o' the border
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Posted: Sun Jun 20, 2021 3:59 am Post subject: Re: Typ 12 convertible?? |
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I'm pretty sure that tech drawing is of a 5 cylinder radial... _________________ "we're here on Earth to fart around" kurt vonnegut
nothing lasts, nothing is finished, and nothing is perfect... |
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Lennert.vw Samba Member
Joined: May 12, 2020 Posts: 20 Location: Geel
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Posted: Sun Jun 20, 2021 4:50 am Post subject: Re: Typ 12 convertible?? |
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I only count 3 cylinders, also in the porsche typ list under number 12 is stated: "Zündapp 3 and 5 cylinder radial engine for rear-engined saloon" _________________ 58 ragtop bug |
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finster Samba Member
Joined: May 26, 2012 Posts: 7951 Location: north o' the border
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Posted: Sun Jun 20, 2021 5:55 am Post subject: Re: Typ 12 convertible?? |
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only 3 are shown in that cross section - others possibly omitted to allow annotation of the distributor drive. the other view shows 5 cylinders
I would assume a 3 cylinder radial would have them arranged 120 degrees apart like this
_________________ "we're here on Earth to fart around" kurt vonnegut
nothing lasts, nothing is finished, and nothing is perfect... |
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Lennert.vw Samba Member
Joined: May 12, 2020 Posts: 20 Location: Geel
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Posted: Sun Jun 20, 2021 7:59 am Post subject: Re: Typ 12 convertible?? |
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Indeed didn't saw those 2 lines, got really exited when I thought I saw the 3 cylinder radial engine. They are at 72° and not 120° as you mentioned. Maybe the drawing is out there somewhere. _________________ 58 ragtop bug |
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