| Author |
Message |
Rick F
Samba Member
Joined: October 14, 2017
Posts: 7
Location: Prescott, AZ
|
 Posted: Thu Jun 10, 2021 11:55 am Post subject: Push button ignition switch '74 Thing |
 |
|
Ignition switch died years ago, went push button. I want to keep push button because ignition switches are junk.
Because it was a hard start, I recently put in relay starter. It turns over with the push button however only 2 fuses are hot 9 & 10. The other fuses are not hot.
Gas gauge does not register. The #1 fuse is not hot, fuel gauge regulator does not get power. Have power to starter, head lights, parking, tail & license plate lights. NO brake lights, turn signals, windshield wiper.
The wire to the gas tank sender is brown and has been brown since I purchased the '74 Thing in the 1980's, now no power.
So what did I miss? Could it be in the back of steering column?
3 plug in's. |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
Wildthings
Samba Member
Joined: March 13, 2005
Posts: 50332
|
| Posted: Thu Jun 10, 2021 12:08 pm Post subject: Re: Push button ignition switch '74 Thing |
|
|
You need to supply power to the #15 ignition circuit and the "X" load reduction circuit, if your original ignition switch can not do this function for you then you will need to add a toggle switch or something else to do so.
"D" is the ignition switch, it is confusingly shown in two parts which are electrically and mechanically connected.
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/archives/info/wiring/181_Current_Flow_Diagram_4-73.pdf |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Rick F
Samba Member
Joined: October 14, 2017
Posts: 7
Location: Prescott, AZ
|
| Posted: Mon Jun 14, 2021 7:30 am Post subject: Re: Push button ignition switch '74 Thing |
|
|
Thanks for sending the diagram, however having a hard time reading it 
I have a toggle switch now to push button start. Disconnected big plug on lower back side of steering column to check #15 and the X wire. No juice to #15, the other 3 wires on the plug which includes X wire has juice.
Can you suggest what to do with #15 at this point (short of tossing it  ....
Thanks again
Sorry this may be a posting duplicate |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Semper_Dad
Samba Member
Joined: May 14, 2005
Posts: 3508
Location: Indiana
|
| Posted: Mon Jun 14, 2021 8:08 am Post subject: Re: Push button ignition switch '74 Thing |
|
|
There are basically 2 switches in the ignition switch.
The first is circuit 15 which connects when you turn the key to the first position. This provides power to the coil and other circuits.
The second is circuit 50 which provides power to the starter solenoid only when the key is fully turned. Once the key is released, circuit 50 disengages and only circuit 15 is active.
By disconnecting the main plug from the ignition switch circuit, circuit 15 has no way of providing power to the coil or other circuits.
_________________
Walküre Restoration Thread: https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=737492 |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
TDCTDI
Samba Advocatus Diaboli
Joined: August 31, 2013
Posts: 12846
Location: North Carolina
|
| Posted: Mon Jun 14, 2021 8:13 am Post subject: Re: Push button ignition switch '74 Thing |
|
|
| Semper_Dad wrote: |
There are basically 2 switches in the ignition switch.
The first is circuit 15 which connects when you turn the key to the first position. This provides power to the coil and other circuits.
The second is circuit 50 which provides power to the starter solenoid only when the key is fully turned. Once the key is released, circuit 50 disengages and only circuit 15 is active.
By disconnecting the main plug from the ignition switch circuit, circuit 15 has no way of providing power to the coil or other circuits. |
Actually, there are three separate circuits, one for the ignition, one for the accessories, & one for the starter.
The accessories circuit disengages when the ignition switch is in the start position, this causes a rudimentary “load reduction”. Later cars used a “load reduction” relay in addition on this circuit to reduce the load on the switch itself.
The easiest way to bypass the ignition switch is to run a (fused) hot lead directly from the battery to your push button, and then a wire from that to the wire connector to the starter under the back seat, usually on the driver side, near where the hard brake line goes through the pan. No screwing with wires in the dash/column.
_________________
Everybody born before 1975 has a story, good, bad, or indifferent, about a VW.
GOFUNDYOURSELF, quit asking everyone to do it for you!
An air cooled VW will make you a hoarder.
Do something, anything, to your project every day, and you will eventually complete it. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Wildthings
Samba Member
Joined: March 13, 2005
Posts: 50332
|
| Posted: Mon Jun 14, 2021 11:01 am Post subject: Re: Push button ignition switch '74 Thing |
|
|
| Rick F wrote: |
Thanks for sending the diagram, however having a hard time reading it
I have a toggle switch now to push button start. Disconnected big plug on lower back side of steering column to check #15 and the X wire. No juice to #15, the other 3 wires on the plug which includes X wire has juice.
Can you suggest what to do with #15 at this point (short of tossing it ....
Thanks again
Sorry this may be a posting duplicate |
It actually sounds like you have a short somewhere in your harness, or maybe the wires on the fuse box have been rearranged? With the plug removed from the switch you should only have power to the #30 terminal in the plug. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Rick F
Samba Member
Joined: October 14, 2017
Posts: 7
Location: Prescott, AZ
|
| Posted: Wed Jun 23, 2021 1:57 pm Post subject: Re: Push button ignition switch '74 Thing |
|
|
Thanks guys for your help.
Got hot wire to battery, with in-line fuse with relay.
Just need coil wire from ignition to the plus side of the coil. Need to know what in-line fuse # to use.
Thanks again |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Wildthings
Samba Member
Joined: March 13, 2005
Posts: 50332
|
| Posted: Wed Jun 23, 2021 2:03 pm Post subject: Re: Push button ignition switch '74 Thing |
|
|
| Rick F wrote: |
Thanks guys for your help.
Got hot wire to battery, with in-line fuse with relay.
Just need coil wire from ignition to the plus side of the coil. Need to know what in-line fuse # to use.
Thanks again |
If you are fusing the #15 ignition wire you want the fuse to be rated high enough that it is very unlikely that it would accidentally blow, there is a reason that VW didn't put a fuse in the ignition circuit from the factory. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
TDCTDI
Samba Advocatus Diaboli
Joined: August 31, 2013
Posts: 12846
Location: North Carolina
|
| Posted: Wed Jun 23, 2021 2:26 pm Post subject: Re: Push button ignition switch '74 Thing |
|
|
| Wildthings wrote: |
| Rick F wrote: |
Thanks guys for your help.
Got hot wire to battery, with in-line fuse with relay.
Just need coil wire from ignition to the plus side of the coil. Need to know what in-line fuse # to use.
Thanks again |
If you are fusing the #15 ignition wire you want the fuse to be rated high enough that it is very unlikely that it would accidentally blow, there is a reason that VW didn't put a fuse in the ignition circuit from the factory. |
Yes, but…. Removing the load from the starter by putting it on it’s own, separate circuit greatly reduces the draw on the ignition circuit.
_________________
Everybody born before 1975 has a story, good, bad, or indifferent, about a VW.
GOFUNDYOURSELF, quit asking everyone to do it for you!
An air cooled VW will make you a hoarder.
Do something, anything, to your project every day, and you will eventually complete it. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
