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skills@eurocarsplus
Samba Peckerhead
Joined: January 01, 2007
Posts: 16863
Location: sticksville, ct.
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 Posted: Wed Jun 23, 2021 8:34 am Post subject: Re: Not a How much is this Vanagon worth? thread. Maybe a little... |
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| mikemtnbike wrote: |
my. 02- OEM will hold value much better than anything custom, regardless of quality. The OEM is nice, well-designed, functional, classic, all that. If you make something custom, it's to fit your needs better which may not match the needs of others.
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i'd have to agree with this. seems that a true westfalia is worth more than a sportsmobile/safare'/riviera....at least in the bay window platform...a vanagon isn't much different.
stock, or dam close to it will always command more money (usually) than some over the top custom.
lots of overpriced vans out there with too much gingerbread bolted on and it seem the sellers want to recoup the outlay of cash for bumpers/ladders/awnings etc
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| gprudenciop wrote: |
my reason for switching to subaru is my german car was turning chinese so i said fuck it and went japanese....... |
| Jake Raby wrote: |
| Thanks for the correction. I used to be a nice guy, then I ruined it by exposing myself to the public. |
| Brian wrote: |
| Also the fact that people are agreeing with Skills, it's a turn of events for samba history |
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Wildthings
Samba Member
Joined: March 13, 2005
Posts: 50337
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| Posted: Wed Jun 23, 2021 8:40 am Post subject: Re: Not a How much is this Vanagon worth? thread. Maybe a little... |
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| skills@eurocarsplus wrote: |
lots of overpriced vans out there with too much gingerbread bolted on and it seem the sellers want to recoup the outlay of cash for bumpers/ladders/awnings etc |
As the owner of some pretty ancient high mileage cars and trucks, my '91 Vanagon being my newest vehicle, I have found that the fewer gizmos a vehicle has and the simpler the trim package the easier it is to maintain. |
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kamzcab86
Samba Moderator
Joined: July 26, 2008
Posts: 7916
Location: Arizona
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| Posted: Wed Jun 23, 2021 9:08 am Post subject: Re: Not a How much is this Vanagon worth? thread. Maybe a little... |
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| 16CVs wrote: |
| What is a weekender Tin Top? Is a Carat a Weekender ? Is any van that has a convertible rear seat a Weekender? |
"Weekender" was never a model in the T3 era, merely an optional interior package that did not include a table, cabinet, or jump seats.
MultiVan (or MV) is the proper nomenclature for a van with fold-out table, jump seats, and rear bed, regardless of roof style, if we apply the T4 naming "rules". "Weekender" was still an optional package (not a model) in 1993, but was offered only on the MV and included the pop-top, curtains, screens, and a fixed jump seat with built-in fridge with aux battery.
"Weekender" has simply become the common vernacular among the VW van world to describe any pop-top without the kitchen... for better or worse, right or wrong.
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~Kamz 
1986 Cabriolet: www.Cabby-Info.com
 1990 Vanagon Westfalia: Old Blue's Blog
2016 Golf GTI S
"Real knowledge is to know the extent of one's ignorance." - 孔子 |
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82westyrabbit
Samba Member
Joined: March 02, 2015
Posts: 968
Location: Ma
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| Posted: Wed Jun 23, 2021 7:45 pm Post subject: Re: Not a How much is this Vanagon worth? thread. Maybe a little... |
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| The problem here is there are at two kinds of vanagon buyers the Hobbyist who is looking for good deal and is willing to put some work into it. That person is probably going to pay less than 10k for any van maybe much less. Then you have the person who just wants a van that is all sorted out. That person might pay 40 or 50 for a really nice camper and thinks he got a deal. This is a fine until the person trying to buy a well sorted camper finds he bought project van for big money. Sometimes the hobbyist finds a perfect sorted out van for not much money. This makes answering this question to subjective. If you want a camper synchro in nice shape get ready to pay. My van is a 82 camper started life as a diesel now has a Ticco engine with a aircooled transmission. It’s not perfect but it is well sorted out and well documented it doesn’t have air conditioning or power steering (never did). That’s going to limit it’s value to maybe 16-18. So you have the early to late model price difference as well. I have owed mine for 33 years and it is unlikely I will ever sell it. And I don’t have much money in it. I hope nobody ever runs into. I would hate to have to try to replace it for 20k it is insured for. John |
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kaalualu
Samba Member
Joined: June 09, 2011
Posts: 274
Location: Big Island, Hawaii
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| Posted: Wed Jun 23, 2021 10:50 pm Post subject: Re: Not a How much is this Vanagon worth? thread. Maybe a little... |
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It's what serves you best, do you need a camper? Are you going camping? Or just owning a camper. For me a tin top serves me better, I get the pleasure of driving this type of vehicle without the weight of camping stuff, but hauling things that I use to enjoy life, work on house, with some power to spare. Beauty and price is in the eye of the beholder. $5500 OG owner, minimal rust. I've put 3-4k into it, worth it, cause it's fun.
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'84 Transporter 16" CLK's/LED's/ AT's/Mansi injectors
'86 Wolfey Weekender Westfalia AT's/otherwise stock
Sold-'82 TinTop Diesel |
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4Gears4Tires
Samba Member
Joined: October 08, 2018
Posts: 3019
Location: MD
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| Posted: Thu Jun 24, 2021 12:51 pm Post subject: Re: Not a How much is this Vanagon worth? thread. Maybe a little... |
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What's the difference between the tin top GL Syncro 89 and earlier and the Syncro 90-91?
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'87 Syncro
Ferric Oxyhydroxide Superleggera Edition |
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kiltedhiker
Samba Member
Joined: April 27, 2016
Posts: 108
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| Posted: Thu Jun 24, 2021 11:30 pm Post subject: Re: Not a How much is this Vanagon worth? thread. Maybe a little... |
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| 4Gears4Tires wrote: |
What's the difference between the tin top GL Syncro 89 and earlier and the Syncro 90-91? |
The 90-91 were a base model
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1989 Syncro Westfalia (bought new) sold
1990 Syncro Westfalia sold
1990 Syncro TinTop |
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4Gears4Tires
Samba Member
Joined: October 08, 2018
Posts: 3019
Location: MD
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| Posted: Fri Jun 25, 2021 6:13 am Post subject: Re: Not a How much is this Vanagon worth? thread. Maybe a little... |
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I see, even though the GL Syncro in 87 was the most base model it could be, it was not a base model. Do you know what the base 90-91's lost in comparison? Locking diff, folding seat bed, and ac?
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'87 Syncro
Ferric Oxyhydroxide Superleggera Edition |
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danfromsyr
Samba Member
Joined: March 01, 2004
Posts: 15144
Location: Syracuse, NY
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| Posted: Fri Jun 25, 2021 6:29 am Post subject: Re: Not a How much is this Vanagon worth? thread. Maybe a little... |
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no chrome trim, black bumpers
rubber front and middle floor treatments
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| Abscate wrote: |
| These are the reasons we have words like “wanker” |
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crazyvwvanman
Samba Member
Joined: January 28, 2008
Posts: 9923
Location: Orbiting San Diego
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| Posted: Fri Jun 25, 2021 8:02 am Post subject: Re: Not a How much is this Vanagon worth? thread. Maybe a little... |
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Off the top of my head,
90/91 base had no tach, no armrests on front seats, no opening wind-wings in front doors, no bottom lever on dash vent control panel because no rear ceiling vents, no grayish hue headliner, no deluxe durable velour seat fabric, no fabric insets on interior panels, no slide-in middle seat or tracks for one, no large dash pad,...
DID have weekender style rear bed/bench with bed cushion, 2 removable rear facing jumpseats, all rubber floor mats, steel bumpers painted black,...
Optional - A/C, Auto trans (2wd), power mirrors, power door locks, cruise control...
probably more things different too....
Mark
| 4Gears4Tires wrote: |
| I see, even though the GL Syncro in 87 was the most base model it could be, it was not a base model. Do you know what the base 90-91's lost in comparison? Locking diff, folding seat bed, and ac? |
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Syncro Jael
Samba Member
Joined: December 19, 2013
Posts: 2204
Location: Utah
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| Posted: Fri Jun 25, 2021 9:25 am Post subject: Re: Not a How much is this Vanagon worth? thread. Maybe a little... |
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A Vanagon is worth whatever you are willing to pay for it.
When selling, it is worth whatever you are willing to sell it for.
The "Van Life" market is up right now. There are waiting lists for new vehicles so many people are looking at the "Vanagon Market" right now.
And then you always find those special buyers that have always wanted a Syncro Westfalia. They are out there just waiting for the right van.
Go price out any of the new van platforms. You will see how a Vanagon can demand these prices. (Oh, and they are not making anymore of them).
Just my $0.02 
_________________
1987 Syncro Westfalia Hightop - NAHT
Subaru EJ25 Forged Frankenmotor, Triple Knob.
Jael = (Mountain Goat) |
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jimf909 
Samba Member
Joined: April 03, 2014
Posts: 7465
Location: WA/ID
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| Posted: Fri Jun 25, 2021 10:15 am Post subject: Re: Not a How much is this Vanagon worth? thread. Maybe a little... |
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Oh goodness, this has gone in a dozen directions.
The $18K starting point has become a distraction.
I think the OP is trying to get at this:
- Let's say that it's June 2021 and VW has reintroduced the Vanagon (yay!)
- Amazingly, they offer a Weekender tintop for free!
- How much more would a reasonable person pay to add:
* Westy pop-top and camper (kitchen and pop-top)
* The above plus Syncro?
For me, I'd pay a premium of $5-$7 K for the Westy with kitchen and I'd pay an additional $5K for a Syncro meaning the window sticker would say I'd pay $12K.
There's a thread here showing a tual window stickers and prices VW charged for these options.
Caveat: none of this matters when someone w/ stupid money joins the bidding war.
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- Jim
| Abscate wrote: |
Do not get killed, do not kill others.
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Current: 1990 Westy Camper - Bostig RG4, 2wd, manual trans w/Peloquin, NAHT high-top, 280 ah LFP battery, 160 watts solar, Flash Silver, seam rust, bondo, etc., etc.
Past: 1985 Westy Camper - 1.9 wbx, 2wd, manual trans, Merian Brown, (sold after 17 years to Northwesty who converted it to a Syncro). |
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Ahwahnee
Samba Member
Joined: June 05, 2010
Posts: 9798
Location: Mt Lemmon, AZ
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| Posted: Fri Jun 25, 2021 12:35 pm Post subject: Re: Not a How much is this Vanagon worth? thread. Maybe a little... |
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| jimf909 wrote: |
| ...For me, I'd pay a premium of $5-$7 K for the Westy with kitchen... |
I find it hard to imagine that a Westfalia would fetch just $5 - 7,000 more than a similar condition tintop weekender (is that just a bed & a table?).
As for Syncros - I've never wanted one but I'll readily concede that a Syncro Westy will command considerably more than $5,000 over a 2WD Westy.
But then this discussion started with a rather strange assumption:
| Winterhawk wrote: |
| Lets take a $18000 Vanagon Weekender tintop and agree it's fairly priced... |
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jlrftype7
Samba Member
Joined: July 24, 2018
Posts: 3576
Location: Chicago
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| Posted: Fri Jun 25, 2021 2:04 pm Post subject: Re: Not a How much is this Vanagon worth? thread. Maybe a little... |
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| crazyvwvanman wrote: |
Off the top of my head,
90/91 base had no tach, no armrests on front seats, no opening wind-wings in front doors, no bottom lever on dash vent control panel because no rear ceiling vents, no grayish hue headliner, no deluxe durable velour seat fabric, no fabric insets on interior panels, no slide-in middle seat or tracks for one, no large dash pad,...
DID have weekender style rear bed/bench with bed cushion, 2 removable rear facing jumpseats, all rubber floor mats, steel bumpers painted black,...
Optional - A/C, Auto trans (2wd), power mirrors, power door locks, cruise control...
probably more things different too....
Mark
| 4Gears4Tires wrote: |
| I see, even though the GL Syncro in 87 was the most base model it could be, it was not a base model. Do you know what the base 90-91's lost in comparison? Locking diff, folding seat bed, and ac? |
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I seem to remember we were in a Recession at that time and other Car makers came up with stripped down models to lower the price and encourage lackluster sales to pick up.
Not sure if the Luxury Tax had gone into effect by then as well, that didn't help European Car Sales either back then.
_________________
'68 Westy- my first VW and vehicle/Bus- long gone.- sold it to a traveling Swiss couple....
'67 Type 3 Fastback, my 2nd car- gone
'69 Semi-Auto Stick Shift Beetle-gone
2017 MINI Coopers, our current DDs
‘84 Tin Top - Hilga....Auto |
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Winterhawk
Samba Member
Joined: November 07, 2020
Posts: 5
Location: Whidbey Island, WA
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| Posted: Fri Jun 25, 2021 11:14 pm Post subject: Re: Not a How much is this Vanagon worth? thread. Maybe a little... |
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| jimf909 wrote: |
Oh goodness, this has gone in a dozen directions.
The $18K starting point has become a distraction.
I think the OP is trying to get at this:
- Let's say that it's June 2021 and VW has reintroduced the Vanagon (yay!)
- Amazingly, they offer a Weekender tintop for free!
- How much more would a reasonable person pay to add:
* Westy pop-top and camper (kitchen and pop-top)
* The above plus Syncro?
For me, I'd pay a premium of $5-$7 K for the Westy with kitchen and I'd pay an additional $5K for a Syncro meaning the window sticker would say I'd pay $12K.
There's a thread here showing a tual window stickers and prices VW charged for these options.
Caveat: none of this matters when someone w/ stupid money joins the bidding war. |
Yes this has gone a dozen directions. I'm asking as the OP because I'm having a very difficult time with prices all over the map. A lot of sellers seem to think their rigs are totally unique, rare, ultra diserable, etc. I'm know they're not rare, none of them are, but as a potential buyer most sellers seem to think they're doing you a favor just letting you see it. I have my personal reasons for wanting one and a tintop will be just fine for my needs. I'll just be patient and the right one will come along and the right price. Might take a year, but thats better than buying a $5000 one that needs $20000 in mechanical, body and interior work. By the way, ads that say "it needs nothing", "I don't need to sell", "very little rust", etc, turn out to be Vanagons that need work, sellers that are trying to capitalize on "van fever", and need expensive rust repair beyond simple surface rust. I'm not that person writing a check just to write many more after purchase. Just wish prices were predictable.
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Just dropped in to see what condition my condition is in... |
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Abscate
Samba Member
Joined: October 05, 2014
Posts: 22639
Location: NYC/Upstate/ROW
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| Posted: Sat Jun 26, 2021 12:17 am Post subject: Re: Not a How much is this Vanagon worth? thread. Maybe a little... |
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You need to adjust the window stickers for 30 years of inflation
The market value of the bump between two comparable tintops and a Westie is about 10k.
The Syncro bump is a lot more
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.ssS! |
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WestyWanter
Samba Member
Joined: February 15, 2017
Posts: 459
Location: San Diego
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| Posted: Sat Jun 26, 2021 3:38 am Post subject: Re: Not a How much is this Vanagon worth? thread. Maybe a little... |
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| Winterhawk wrote: |
| jimf909 wrote: |
Oh goodness, this has gone in a dozen directions.
The $18K starting point has become a distraction.
I think the OP is trying to get at this:
- Let's say that it's June 2021 and VW has reintroduced the Vanagon (yay!)
- Amazingly, they offer a Weekender tintop for free!
- How much more would a reasonable person pay to add:
* Westy pop-top and camper (kitchen and pop-top)
* The above plus Syncro?
For me, I'd pay a premium of $5-$7 K for the Westy with kitchen and I'd pay an additional $5K for a Syncro meaning the window sticker would say I'd pay $12K.
There's a thread here showing a tual window stickers and prices VW charged for these options.
Caveat: none of this matters when someone w/ stupid money joins the bidding war. |
Yes this has gone a dozen directions. I'm asking as the OP because I'm having a very difficult time with prices all over the map. A lot of sellers seem to think their rigs are totally unique, rare, ultra diserable, etc. I'm know they're not rare, none of them are, but as a potential buyer most sellers seem to think they're doing you a favor just letting you see it. I have my personal reasons for wanting one and a tintop will be just fine for my needs. I'll just be patient and the right one will come along and the right price. Might take a year, but thats better than buying a $5000 one that needs $20000 in mechanical, body and interior work. By the way, ads that say "it needs nothing", "I don't need to sell", "very little rust", etc, turn out to be Vanagons that need work, sellers that are trying to capitalize on "van fever", and need expensive rust repair beyond simple surface rust. I'm not that person writing a check just to write many more after purchase. Just wish prices were predictable. |
Going back to what Ron said, a vanagon is worth what one is willing to pay for it. I was just buying a syncro and shared the frustrations you have currently. Maybe the current market is too inflated for you to buy a vanagon currently and maybe you should look to other vehicles. These vehicles might be great when you buy them but every turn of the key there is a chance an issue will arise. I vote tacoma |
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pdm777
Samba Member
Joined: August 06, 2012
Posts: 348
Location: Clovis, CA
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| Posted: Sat Jun 26, 2021 10:30 am Post subject: Re: Not a How much is this Vanagon worth? thread. Maybe a little... |
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As the years churn away, fewer and fewer
original non-molested/rust-free Westys are available.
The days of finding a 60K garage kept time capsule
owned by little old man/lady for $12K are gone.
Now, if someone could solve the California Smog Nazi
problem, and drop in a bulletproof reliable drivetrain...
(I want more than 100 pathetic ponies).
but $20,000 is -too much- for a conversion (for me)
this is a VAN, not a Porsche!
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1990 Westy Full Camper |
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