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Snoww_ Samba Member
Joined: September 25, 2015 Posts: 73 Location: California
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Posted: Mon Aug 02, 2021 4:01 pm Post subject: Re: Pushrod Wear Acceptable? |
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Ahh I see, sounds good. When I get back to the shop this weekend, and get the case back together, I'll flip the tubes and try the sharpie technique to see if I can get away with what I have or if I need to reach out to Tabari for rocker arms and make sure to get some better adjusters. I'm definitely going with lash caps this time around.
Thanks for the help this thing didn't come with instructions and I'm just trying to do things right. I appreciate it. _________________ 1991 Tiico Vanagon Carat
1961 Baja Bug |
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74 Thing Samba Member
Joined: September 02, 2004 Posts: 7375
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Posted: Mon Aug 02, 2021 4:18 pm Post subject: Re: Pushrod Wear Acceptable? |
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Don't use lash caps with the adjuster (elephant foot swivel adjusters) at the valve.
Just use the lash cap if using with a rocker with the adjuster at the pushrod. |
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mark tucker Samba Member
Joined: April 08, 2009 Posts: 23937 Location: SHALIMAR ,FLORIDA
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Posted: Mon Aug 02, 2021 5:56 pm Post subject: Re: Pushrod Wear Acceptable? |
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I use lash caps on everything, Ive seen tomany effed up parts without them. |
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Dan Ruddock Samba Member
Joined: October 25, 2012 Posts: 3574 Location: Sarasota, in my adopted state of Florida
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Posted: Tue Aug 03, 2021 6:46 am Post subject: Re: Pushrod Wear Acceptable? |
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74 Thing wrote: |
Don't use lash caps with the adjuster (elephant foot swivel adjusters) at the valve.
Just use the lash cap if using with a rocker with the adjuster at the pushrod. |
X2
You can buy stock rockers in the classifieds for $20. When I do stock rockers (very rare for me) I just bench grind .100" off the underside and add elephant feet adjuster. Screw the adjusters in as far as possible and the make pushrods to fit. Stock 1.1 rockers is the most ratio you should run with the 218 despite what others will say. The gains are not worth the potential pain to run more ratio.
Dan |
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Snoww_ Samba Member
Joined: September 25, 2015 Posts: 73 Location: California
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Posted: Tue Aug 03, 2021 8:46 am Post subject: Re: Pushrod Wear Acceptable? |
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Dan Ruddock wrote: |
74 Thing wrote: |
Don't use lash caps with the adjuster (elephant foot swivel adjusters) at the valve.
Just use the lash cap if using with a rocker with the adjuster at the pushrod. |
X2
You can buy stock rockers in the classifieds for $20. When I do stock rockers (very rare for me) I just bench grind .100" off the underside and add elephant feet adjuster. Screw the adjusters in as far as possible and the make pushrods to fit. Stock 1.1 rockers is the most ratio you should run with the 218 despite what others will say. The gains are not worth the potential pain to run more ratio.
Dan |
What's the drawback of running the 218 with the 1.25 rockers? Too much lift? Too little displacement? I'm just trying to understand how this all works together.
Thanks! _________________ 1991 Tiico Vanagon Carat
1961 Baja Bug |
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Dan Ruddock Samba Member
Joined: October 25, 2012 Posts: 3574 Location: Sarasota, in my adopted state of Florida
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Posted: Tue Aug 03, 2021 9:09 am Post subject: Re: Pushrod Wear Acceptable? |
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Snoww_ wrote: |
Dan Ruddock wrote: |
74 Thing wrote: |
Don't use lash caps with the adjuster (elephant foot swivel adjusters) at the valve.
Just use the lash cap if using with a rocker with the adjuster at the pushrod. |
X2
You can buy stock rockers in the classifieds for $20. When I do stock rockers (very rare for me) I just bench grind .100" off the underside and add elephant feet adjuster. Screw the adjusters in as far as possible and the make pushrods to fit. Stock 1.1 rockers is the most ratio you should run with the 218 despite what others will say. The gains are not worth the potential pain to run more ratio.
Dan |
What's the drawback of running the 218 with the 1.25 rockers? Too much lift? Too little displacement? I'm just trying to understand how this all works together.
Thanks! |
High lift is not a good idea with a stock style rocker, the rocker to valve angles get too extreme for good valve guide life. Higher lifts are more difficult for the valve springs to control requiring more spring tension which is harder on the train wear. Higher lift shortens valve spring life. Stock rockers were designed for .340" lift and work very well for that. Yes higher lifts will make a little more power but the cons out way the pros. Point is, you have to ask yourself, do I want to build a high maintenance race engine or something fun to own. To run more lift you need a different cam designed for 1.4 rockers. Conservative engine last longer.
Dan |
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Snoww_ Samba Member
Joined: September 25, 2015 Posts: 73 Location: California
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Posted: Tue Aug 03, 2021 9:34 am Post subject: Re: Pushrod Wear Acceptable? |
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Dan Ruddock wrote: |
Snoww_ wrote: |
Dan Ruddock wrote: |
74 Thing wrote: |
Don't use lash caps with the adjuster (elephant foot swivel adjusters) at the valve.
Just use the lash cap if using with a rocker with the adjuster at the pushrod. |
X2
You can buy stock rockers in the classifieds for $20. When I do stock rockers (very rare for me) I just bench grind .100" off the underside and add elephant feet adjuster. Screw the adjusters in as far as possible and the make pushrods to fit. Stock 1.1 rockers is the most ratio you should run with the 218 despite what others will say. The gains are not worth the potential pain to run more ratio.
Dan |
What's the drawback of running the 218 with the 1.25 rockers? Too much lift? Too little displacement? I'm just trying to understand how this all works together.
Thanks! |
High lift is not a good idea with a stock style rocker, the rocker to valve angles get too extreme for good valve guide life. Higher lifts are more difficult for the valve springs to control requiring more spring tension which is harder on the train wear. Higher lift shortens valve spring life. Stock rockers were designed for .340" lift and work very well for that. Yes higher lifts will make a little more power but the cons out way the pros. Point is, you have to ask yourself, do I want to build a high maintenance race engine or something fun to own. To run more lift you need a different cam designed for 1.4 rockers. Conservative engine last longer.
Dan |
That's great info, thanks for educating me Dan! _________________ 1991 Tiico Vanagon Carat
1961 Baja Bug |
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chrisflstf Samba Member
Joined: February 10, 2004 Posts: 3413 Location: San Diego
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Posted: Tue Aug 03, 2021 2:05 pm Post subject: Re: Pushrod Wear Acceptable? |
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What is the stock length of a push rod for a stock vw, 1600 motor. I've seen 10.935 and 11.060? |
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Snoww_ Samba Member
Joined: September 25, 2015 Posts: 73 Location: California
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Posted: Tue Aug 03, 2021 4:10 pm Post subject: Re: Pushrod Wear Acceptable? |
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chrisflstf wrote: |
What is the stock length of a push rod for a stock vw, 1600 motor. I've seen 10.935 and 11.060? |
I'm not sure, I had to order a set of 11.06 inch push rods for this motor but it's far from stock. _________________ 1991 Tiico Vanagon Carat
1961 Baja Bug |
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mark tucker Samba Member
Joined: April 08, 2009 Posts: 23937 Location: SHALIMAR ,FLORIDA
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Posted: Tue Aug 03, 2021 6:13 pm Post subject: Re: Pushrod Wear Acceptable? |
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Snoww_ wrote: |
Dan Ruddock wrote: |
Snoww_ wrote: |
Dan Ruddock wrote: |
74 Thing wrote: |
Don't use lash caps with the adjuster (elephant foot swivel adjusters) at the valve.
Just use the lash cap if using with a rocker with the adjuster at the pushrod. |
X2
You can buy stock rockers in the classifieds for $20. When I do stock rockers (very rare for me) I just bench grind .100" off the underside and add elephant feet adjuster. Screw the adjusters in as far as possible and the make pushrods to fit. Stock 1.1 rockers is the most ratio you should run with the 218 despite what others will say. The gains are not worth the potential pain to run more ratio.
Dan |
thus the reason to can the oe style rockers weather 1.1 or 1.24 and get the type that have the adjuster on the pushrod end of the rocker.
What's the drawback of running the 218 with the 1.25 rockers? Too much lift? Too little displacement? I'm just trying to understand how this all works together.
Thanks! |
High lift is not a good idea with a stock style rocker, the rocker to valve angles get too extreme for good valve guide life. Higher lifts are more difficult for the valve springs to control requiring more spring tension which is harder on the train wear. Higher lift shortens valve spring life. Stock rockers were designed for .340" lift and work very well for that. Yes higher lifts will make a little more power but the cons out way the pros. Point is, you have to ask yourself, do I want to build a high maintenance race engine or something fun to own. To run more lift you need a different cam designed for 1.4 rockers. Conservative engine last longer.
Dan |
That's great info, thanks for educating me Dan! |
thus the reason to shit can the oe style rockers weather 1.1 or 1.25 and get the type that have the adjuster on the pushrod end of the rocker. much less thrust to the guide&stem. |
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Snoww_ Samba Member
Joined: September 25, 2015 Posts: 73 Location: California
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Posted: Tue Aug 03, 2021 9:42 pm Post subject: Re: Pushrod Wear Acceptable? |
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mark tucker wrote: |
Snoww_ wrote: |
Dan Ruddock wrote: |
Snoww_ wrote: |
Dan Ruddock wrote: |
74 Thing wrote: |
Don't use lash caps with the adjuster (elephant foot swivel adjusters) at the valve.
Just use the lash cap if using with a rocker with the adjuster at the pushrod. |
X2
You can buy stock rockers in the classifieds for $20. When I do stock rockers (very rare for me) I just bench grind .100" off the underside and add elephant feet adjuster. Screw the adjusters in as far as possible and the make pushrods to fit. Stock 1.1 rockers is the most ratio you should run with the 218 despite what others will say. The gains are not worth the potential pain to run more ratio.
Dan |
thus the reason to can the oe style rockers weather 1.1 or 1.24 and get the type that have the adjuster on the pushrod end of the rocker.
What's the drawback of running the 218 with the 1.25 rockers? Too much lift? Too little displacement? I'm just trying to understand how this all works together.
Thanks! |
High lift is not a good idea with a stock style rocker, the rocker to valve angles get too extreme for good valve guide life. Higher lifts are more difficult for the valve springs to control requiring more spring tension which is harder on the train wear. Higher lift shortens valve spring life. Stock rockers were designed for .340" lift and work very well for that. Yes higher lifts will make a little more power but the cons out way the pros. Point is, you have to ask yourself, do I want to build a high maintenance race engine or something fun to own. To run more lift you need a different cam designed for 1.4 rockers. Conservative engine last longer.
Dan |
That's great info, thanks for educating me Dan! |
thus the reason to shit can the oe style rockers weather 1.1 or 1.25 and get the type that have the adjuster on the pushrod end of the rocker. much less thrust to the guide&stem. |
Do they make a 1.1 ratio with the adjuster on the pushrod? So far I can only find the OE style for 1.1. _________________ 1991 Tiico Vanagon Carat
1961 Baja Bug |
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madmike Samba Member
Joined: July 11, 2005 Posts: 5291 Location: Atlanta,Michigan
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Posted: Wed Aug 04, 2021 3:45 am Post subject: Re: Pushrod Wear Acceptable? |
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Highjack,, Looks like these were flexing ? good old 'empi'
_________________ 'Black Ice'Drag Buggy 'Turbo'
Rail Buggy 1915 turbo
76 Drag/Street bug 2180cc 'Turbo' 11:85 @113 mph"If I go any faster I'll burn up the Hamster" ,gets 28 mpg. also 10/09/22 11.90 @115 mph
"If I'm ever on Life Support,UNPLUG Me, Then Plug me back In see if that Works" |
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