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tmitoraj Samba Member
Joined: May 10, 2007 Posts: 177
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Posted: Tue Sep 14, 2021 2:22 pm Post subject: TVS help needed. |
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I do have the black labeled D ECU. The problem that started this thread is that my C TVS has 4 prongs. One is for wire #14 from the ECU. My ECU does not have wires 2,14,25. If these are compatible according to the chart above then which prongs on the TVS do the other 3 wires attach to? Is there another wire somewhere in the engine compartment that takes the place of the #14? Do I leave one prong empty? Which one? I have not found a need for wires 2 and 25 yet. Thanks for all your help. |
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tmitoraj Samba Member
Joined: May 10, 2007 Posts: 177
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Posted: Thu Sep 16, 2021 5:45 pm Post subject: TVS help needed |
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I think I got it figured out. Wire #11 from the ECU is pigtailed into a wire from #14 prong on the TVS and they both go to the ground plug on the top of the engine case. #14 on the TVS is ground. Thanks for all the help. |
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tmitoraj Samba Member
Joined: May 10, 2007 Posts: 177
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Posted: Thu Sep 16, 2021 5:49 pm Post subject: Re: Fuel injection relief here! |
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Does anyone have a picture of the fuel injection hose routing as it passes from one set of injectors to the other side? Thanks |
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Mike Fisher Samba Member
Joined: January 30, 2006 Posts: 17970 Location: Eugene, OR
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Posted: Fri Sep 17, 2021 5:19 am Post subject: Re: Fuel injection relief here! |
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tmitoraj wrote: |
Does anyone have a picture of the fuel injection hose routing as it passes from one set of injectors to the other side? Thanks |
Fuel enters on the left to the 1-2 injectors and then runs across the rear of the engine.
It feeds 4-3 injectors and exits as a return line through the fuel pressure regulator. _________________ https://imgur.com/user/FisherSquareback/posts
69 FI/AT square Daily Driver
66 sunroof,67,70,71,71,71AT,72,72AT,73 Parts
two 57 oval ragtops sold
'68 Karmann Ghia sold
Society is like stew. If you don't keep it stirred up you end up with a lot of scum on the top! - Russ_Wolfe/Edward Abbey |
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RonPinPG Samba Member
Joined: October 25, 2017 Posts: 3 Location: CA
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Posted: Sat Sep 18, 2021 3:47 pm Post subject: Re: Fuel injection relief here! |
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Searching for part name or replacement to solve problem
Greetings all - I have a new to me 1970 Squareback - The throttle valve connector plug is missing and the wires have just been spliced into the TVA. As I drive I will get shorts causing die out and surges depending upon what bump I hit in the road.
1. Is there a source for this connector? What do I call it?
2. Since it is a specific wiring harness connector do I need to replace the entire harness - and are their sources for one that works with the 1970 model year (I have searched and can find through '69 but anything more recent is out of stock.
Thanks in advance for the assistance.
Ron |
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Bobnotch Samba Member
Joined: July 06, 2003 Posts: 22431 Location: Kimball, Mi
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Posted: Sat Sep 18, 2021 4:11 pm Post subject: Re: Fuel injection relief here! |
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RonPinPG wrote: |
Searching for part name or replacement to solve problem
Greetings all - I have a new to me 1970 Squareback - The throttle valve connector plug is missing and the wires have just been spliced into the TVA. As I drive I will get shorts causing die out and surges depending upon what bump I hit in the road.
1. Is there a source for this connector? What do I call it?
2. Since it is a specific wiring harness connector do I need to replace the entire harness - and are their sources for one that works with the 1970 model year (I have searched and can find through '69 but anything more recent is out of stock.
Thanks in advance for the assistance.
Ron |
You need to know how many wires/terminals it has. Then try Auto Atlanta for a TVS wire connector. It'll have leads on it to allow you to splice it in. Pelican Parts might also have one as well. Be prepared to pay Porsche prices for it from either place. _________________ Bob 65 Notch S with Sunroof
71 Notch ...aka Krunchy; build pics here;
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=249390 -been busy working
64 T-34 Ghia...aka Wolfie, under construction... http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=412120
Tram wrote: |
"Friends are God's way of apologizing for relatives." |
Tram wrote: |
People keep confusing "restored" and "restroyed". |
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Tram Samba Socialist
Joined: May 02, 2003 Posts: 22728 Location: Still Feelin' the Bern- Once you've felt it you can't un- feel it.
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Posted: Wed Sep 22, 2021 12:00 am Post subject: Re: Fuel injection relief here! |
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Bobnotch wrote: |
RonPinPG wrote: |
Searching for part name or replacement to solve problem
Greetings all - I have a new to me 1970 Squareback - The throttle valve connector plug is missing and the wires have just been spliced into the TVA. As I drive I will get shorts causing die out and surges depending upon what bump I hit in the road.
1. Is there a source for this connector? What do I call it?
2. Since it is a specific wiring harness connector do I need to replace the entire harness - and are their sources for one that works with the 1970 model year (I have searched and can find through '69 but anything more recent is out of stock.
Thanks in advance for the assistance.
Ron |
You need to know how many wires/terminals it has. Then try Auto Atlanta for a TVS wire connector. It'll have leads on it to allow you to splice it in. Pelican Parts might also have one as well. Be prepared to pay Porsche prices for it from either place. |
An original 1970 will have a "C" system with a 4 terminal TVS. However, some of what you are experiencing sounds suspiciously like a dying TVS to me. The 4 pin ones were notorious for the random "buck" issue. It's wear in the PC board in the unit. If it were really the harness shorting or going open, likely the car will shut down.
I think I have a few 1970 harnesses and TVS units in my stash. If you are interested, email me at [email protected]. _________________ Немає виправдання для війни! Я з Україною.
Bryan67 wrote: |
Just my hands. And a little lube. No tools. |
To best contact me, please use the EMAIL function in my profile |
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tmitoraj Samba Member
Joined: May 10, 2007 Posts: 177
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Posted: Wed Sep 22, 2021 6:16 am Post subject: Re: Fuel injection relief here! |
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Does anyone know the Bosch number for VW TVS 311 906 111 c? I am looking for an extra for my stash. Thanks |
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Maltboy! Samba Member
Joined: June 17, 2006 Posts: 137 Location: Santa Fe, Texas
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Posted: Wed Sep 22, 2021 2:32 pm Post subject: Re: Fuel injection relief here! |
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I'm working on a 76 Super. I think all the wiring is sorted except for one mystery. There are two red/blue wires with clear rectangular covers in the dash.
Both are male. One goes to the double relay, and the other goes to the fuel pump. It looks like they are supposed to be connected somehow, but I don't see any dashboard junctions on the schematics. Am I missing a double female connector, or do I have something wired wrong?
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Tram Samba Socialist
Joined: May 02, 2003 Posts: 22728 Location: Still Feelin' the Bern- Once you've felt it you can't un- feel it.
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Posted: Wed Sep 22, 2021 4:54 pm Post subject: Re: Fuel injection relief here! |
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Maltboy! wrote: |
I'm working on a 76 Super. I think all the wiring is sorted except for one mystery. There are two red/blue wires with clear rectangular covers in the dash.
Both are male. One goes to the double relay, and the other goes to the fuel pump. It looks like they are supposed to be connected somehow, but I don't see any dashboard junctions on the schematics. Am I missing a double female connector, or do I have something wired wrong?
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According to current track 80 on the current flow diagram here, these should be joined by a similar color wire in the luggage compartment, between connectors T1D and T2C:
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/archives/info/wiring/76-79113wiring.jpg _________________ Немає виправдання для війни! Я з Україною.
Bryan67 wrote: |
Just my hands. And a little lube. No tools. |
To best contact me, please use the EMAIL function in my profile |
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Maltboy! Samba Member
Joined: June 17, 2006 Posts: 137 Location: Santa Fe, Texas
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Posted: Thu Sep 23, 2021 8:28 am Post subject: Re: Fuel injection relief here! |
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The odd thing is that T1D is on the end of the main front harness that comes in through the firewall, so it has to join under the dash like all the other wires on that end. The rear main harness terminates in the same place, so it looks like the diagram could be wrong. I'm wondering if they plug into some sort of union. The diagram also shows that T8A and T8B are in the engine compartment but they are clearly in the dash as well.
Sorry if I posted this in the wrong forum. I didn't realize this was for Type 3s. I'll move this over to the Type 1 forum. |
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tbb Samba Member
Joined: July 26, 2017 Posts: 84 Location: Van Nuys, CA
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Posted: Sun Sep 26, 2021 11:09 am Post subject: Re: Fuel injection relief here! |
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What would cause the idle to surge once the engine is warm, but idle nice and smooth when cold? ‘68 squareback. “2nd generation B FI system” |
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Tram Samba Socialist
Joined: May 02, 2003 Posts: 22728 Location: Still Feelin' the Bern- Once you've felt it you can't un- feel it.
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Posted: Fri Oct 01, 2021 2:45 pm Post subject: Re: Fuel injection relief here! |
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tbb wrote: |
What would cause the idle to surge once the engine is warm, but idle nice and smooth when cold? ‘68 squareback. “2nd generation B FI system” |
One of the temp sensors is out of range, your AAR isn't closing completely, or you are running too lean a baseline. Unplug TS1 (in the engine case by the aux air regulator).
BUT- check your ignition system first and make sure points, timing, etc. are spot on _________________ Немає виправдання для війни! Я з Україною.
Bryan67 wrote: |
Just my hands. And a little lube. No tools. |
To best contact me, please use the EMAIL function in my profile |
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tmitoraj Samba Member
Joined: May 10, 2007 Posts: 177
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Posted: Fri Oct 15, 2021 6:28 pm Post subject: Cold start and thermo couple wiring |
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The cold start valve on my 71 fi/at Fasty has two prongs. I am trying to figure out the wiring. Does one go to number 50 on the starter? Does the other one attach to the thermocouple below it? Does it matter which prong takes the wire from the starter? Thanks |
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Bobnotch Samba Member
Joined: July 06, 2003 Posts: 22431 Location: Kimball, Mi
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Posted: Sat Oct 16, 2021 11:27 am Post subject: Re: Cold start and thermo couple wiring |
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tmitoraj wrote: |
The cold start valve on my 71 fi/at Fasty has two prongs. I am trying to figure out the wiring. Does one go to number 50 on the starter? Does the other one attach to the thermocouple below it? Does it matter which prong takes the wire from the starter? Thanks |
Yes. One does go to the starter#50. I believe it does go to the sensor.
Yes, you want it to connect to the starter solenoid, so it gets power when starting. This is why type 3 starters have an extra terminal on them (for the FI). _________________ Bob 65 Notch S with Sunroof
71 Notch ...aka Krunchy; build pics here;
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=249390 -been busy working
64 T-34 Ghia...aka Wolfie, under construction... http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=412120
Tram wrote: |
"Friends are God's way of apologizing for relatives." |
Tram wrote: |
People keep confusing "restored" and "restroyed". |
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tmitoraj Samba Member
Joined: May 10, 2007 Posts: 177
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Posted: Sat Oct 16, 2021 11:43 am Post subject: Re: cold start and thermocouple |
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Thanks a lot for the reply! Is it also true that ECU wire 18 goes to the #50 on the starter? If so I can run #18 and the cold start wire together to #50.
Does it matter which prong on the cold start sensor I attach the spade from #50.
I am getting so close to getting this part finished! |
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Bolse Samba Member
Joined: November 03, 2021 Posts: 2 Location: Sweden
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Posted: Wed Nov 03, 2021 2:48 am Post subject: Re: Fuel injection relief here! |
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I have a 71 1600 with injection that won´t start. It´s defiantly fuel related. If I pour fuel directly into the inlet manifold it starts and runs to the point the gas is consumed.
I followed the steps in the workshop manual regarding the fuel pump.
• First, I couldn’t figure out which fuse was to the pump, but all the fuses are okay.
• Then I checked with a voltmeter if there was voltage present at the pump. No voltage.
• Next step will be to check the pump relay. No voltage present at the terminals 85 and 86 either.
• Then I Removed the plug from terminal 85 and 86 of the relay. And connected 85 to ground and terminal 86 to 30/51. The relay pulls and I get voltage at terminal 87
Next step according to the manual will be to replace the ECU. Is that the only option or is there anything else I can try?
I have Bosch 280 000 019/311 906 021 D. Is it possible to change to change to a later or earlier model, like C, B or E? |
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Bobnotch Samba Member
Joined: July 06, 2003 Posts: 22431 Location: Kimball, Mi
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Posted: Wed Nov 03, 2021 11:02 am Post subject: Re: Fuel injection relief here! |
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Bolse wrote: |
I have a 71 1600 with injection that won´t start. It´s defiantly fuel related. If I pour fuel directly into the inlet manifold it starts and runs to the point the gas is consumed.
I followed the steps in the workshop manual regarding the fuel pump.
• First, I couldn’t figure out which fuse was to the pump, but all the fuses are okay.
• Then I checked with a voltmeter if there was voltage present at the pump. No voltage.
• Next step will be to check the pump relay. No voltage present at the terminals 85 and 86 either.
• Then I Removed the plug from terminal 85 and 86 of the relay. And connected 85 to ground and terminal 86 to 30/51. The relay pulls and I get voltage at terminal 87
Next step according to the manual will be to replace the ECU. Is that the only option or is there anything else I can try?
I have Bosch 280 000 019/311 906 021 D. Is it possible to change to change to a later or earlier model, like C, B or E? |
If you have a "D" brain, you can swap it with a "C" brain. an A or B is too early for your system. The "C" was used in both 70 and 71. An E is too late and requires a different MPS, and TVS to work. Ideally you want to keep the system all matching (letter wise), but this is one of a few things that can be different, along with the MPS. _________________ Bob 65 Notch S with Sunroof
71 Notch ...aka Krunchy; build pics here;
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=249390 -been busy working
64 T-34 Ghia...aka Wolfie, under construction... http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=412120
Tram wrote: |
"Friends are God's way of apologizing for relatives." |
Tram wrote: |
People keep confusing "restored" and "restroyed". |
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KTPhil Samba Member
Joined: April 06, 2006 Posts: 34021 Location: Conejo Valley, CA
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Posted: Wed Nov 03, 2021 11:32 am Post subject: Re: Fuel injection relief here! |
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Bolse wrote: |
I have a 71 1600 with injection that won´t start. It´s defiantly fuel related. If I pour fuel directly into the inlet manifold it starts and runs to the point the gas is consumed.
I followed the steps in the workshop manual regarding the fuel pump.
• First, I couldn’t figure out which fuse was to the pump, but all the fuses are okay.
• Then I checked with a voltmeter if there was voltage present at the pump. No voltage.
• Next step will be to check the pump relay. No voltage present at the terminals 85 and 86 either.
• Then I Removed the plug from terminal 85 and 86 of the relay. And connected 85 to ground and terminal 86 to 30/51. The relay pulls and I get voltage at terminal 87
Next step according to the manual will be to replace the ECU. Is that the only option or is there anything else I can try?
I have Bosch 280 000 019/311 906 021 D. Is it possible to change to change to a later or earlier model, like C, B or E? |
Just to be clear, are you checking for voltage at rest? By default, the pump is shut off after one second if the engine is not running. |
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Mike Fisher Samba Member
Joined: January 30, 2006 Posts: 17970 Location: Eugene, OR
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Posted: Wed Nov 03, 2021 12:57 pm Post subject: Re: Fuel injection relief here! |
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If the fuel pump isn't spinning then it's probably locked up?
You can use jumper cables to see if it spins forwards & backwards. _________________ https://imgur.com/user/FisherSquareback/posts
69 FI/AT square Daily Driver
66 sunroof,67,70,71,71,71AT,72,72AT,73 Parts
two 57 oval ragtops sold
'68 Karmann Ghia sold
Society is like stew. If you don't keep it stirred up you end up with a lot of scum on the top! - Russ_Wolfe/Edward Abbey |
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