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Aluminum rear brake drum
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metahacker
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 18, 2021 7:51 am    Post subject: Aluminum rear brake drum Reply with quote

Has anyone ever been bold (and clever) enough to equip a Bay window with aluminum rear drums?

Has anyone ever seen custom made aluminum drums?

I do not believe that a CNC rear drum "blank" would be a difficult endeavor for the Late Bay (particularly given the fact that they do not need to hold any lug bolts directly)... but I believe a finished rear drum poses a significant challenge in terms of mounting the friction surface.

How did Porsche do it on the 356A? I have to doubt that the friction area inserts were simply press-fit.

I know SGKent will tell me to buy an Acura SUV with 350HP for asking this, but hey, inquiring minds want to know Smile
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TDCTDI
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 18, 2021 8:27 am    Post subject: Re: Aluminum rear brake drum Reply with quote

It’d be simpler, cheaper, & more effective to convert to disc.
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 18, 2021 8:33 am    Post subject: Re: Aluminum rear brake drum Reply with quote

I ask why?

Because race-bus?

GM did this back in the day, the drum was cast iron lined. Really it was just to shave a few lb's of rotational weight, and the aluminum would shed heat faster. Really only made sense if you needed an edge to help win around the track.

Nowadays, you can simply convert to disk and call it day!
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SGKent Premium Member
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 18, 2021 10:37 am    Post subject: Re: Aluminum rear brake drum Reply with quote

aluminum would gall. One would have to put a steel sleeve in it and eventually it would come loose. I can see the racing example because everything is being changed after a few races. Even a tire that has rubber left gets hard and looses its gummy grip so those get changed on cars that don't do a lot of laps. The trick set up would be to put a disk caliper system on the transmission to brake the rear wheels. That reduces rotational mass and unsprung weight.
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 18, 2021 11:41 am    Post subject: Re: Aluminum rear brake drum Reply with quote

SGKent wrote:
aluminum would gall. One would have to put a steel sleeve in it and eventually it would come loose. I can see the racing example because everything is being changed after a few races. Even a tire that has rubber left gets hard and looses its gummy grip so those get changed on cars that don't do a lot of laps. The trick set up would be to put a disk caliper system on the transmission to brake the rear wheels. That reduces rotational mass and unsprung weight.
Or get an Acura SUV! Laughing
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 18, 2021 3:10 pm    Post subject: Re: Aluminum rear brake drum Reply with quote

TomWesty wrote:
SGKent wrote:
aluminum would gall. One would have to put a steel sleeve in it and eventually it would come loose. I can see the racing example because everything is being changed after a few races. Even a tire that has rubber left gets hard and looses its gummy grip so those get changed on cars that don't do a lot of laps. The trick set up would be to put a disk caliper system on the transmission to brake the rear wheels. That reduces rotational mass and unsprung weight.
Or get an Acura SUV! Laughing


True, that is how we get around when all but cruising in the VW or camping - but you knew that already. We also use the 04 Sable wagon sometimes. If someone wants to beef up brakes in a bay, maybe a set of 944 brakes might be a solution. That said, I had to make a panic stop in my bus right after I restored it to avoid a red light runner, and from about 35 mph it stopped in just over a bus length. The distance buses stop in is very short unless they have a heavy load. The limit is more the tires grip than the brakes. The engineering payload in a bus is 2000 lbs so the brakes are overkill.
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Cap10323
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 18, 2021 8:34 pm    Post subject: Re: Aluminum rear brake drum Reply with quote

SGKent wrote:
The distance buses stop in is very short unless they have a heavy load. The limit is more the tires grip than the brakes. The engineering payload in a bus is 2000 lbs so the brakes are overkill.


I was going to say. Providing your brakes are in good shape, the stock brake setup in a bay window is really pretty damn good.

My 77 Bus, even with full camper interior, panic-stops in about a bus and a half's worth of length. All 4 tires locked. It almost outstops my other car, which is a 2005 Subaru wagon.
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 19, 2021 3:18 am    Post subject: Re: Aluminum rear brake drum Reply with quote

Even without a servo in a European bus over here, I have stopped from 60mph faster than a modern GM car.. They hit my towbar and suffered more damage than my bus. They almost stopped in the same distance.

And having warped a set of cast iron drums through heat, I would not want to use aluminum with its lower softening temperature.
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Starbucket
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 19, 2021 2:27 pm    Post subject: Re: Aluminum rear brake drum Reply with quote

Let's see: You would need a mold to cast a donut with an outer rib, have a foundry cast it in iron, then have it machined to apx. size with the outer surface finished with a dove tail in the outer rib, then have a mold made to cast the aluminum around it and then have it finished machined, an order of 100 would only cost you around $2000. ea. if you are lucky. (and a set of 2 will only save you 1lb.)
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metahacker
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 20, 2021 7:11 pm    Post subject: Re: Aluminum rear brake drum Reply with quote

Hmm, I have seen 356B drums on barndoors.. so I assumed someone had been brave enough to figure this out on some other VWs.

I know that there are many OE aluminum drums (perhaps most famously the GM ones...such as used on Buicks...and Corvair...), so I'd imagine it might be possible to machine one down to fit a late bay VW Bus rear.

I also think making a blank from scratch also seems reasonable given the relatively easy access to CAD/CNC machining that individuals enjoy in "modern times." But, again, not so sure how one could effectively mount a friction surface. It seems a bit challenging. I assume one could machine down a stock iron drum and use the inner ring as a friction surface, and attach the aluminum outer drum using fasteners anywhere where wear from the brake shoes won't cause them to fail. Maybe not the most sophisticated way to do it, though.

Sure would be nice if there was something off the shelf that cross referenced (e.g. Porsche 356 or Corvair) closely enough that it just required drilling new holes for the studs.

I will refrain from "convincing" anyone why they are "needed." Needless to say, they would perform better than stock and make a not insignificant reduction to unsprung weight/ rotational mass. And yes, SGKent, I agree, inboard brakes would be the ultimate Smile
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