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spencerfvee Samba Member
Joined: August 19, 2004 Posts: 3071
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Posted: Thu Sep 16, 2021 1:43 pm Post subject: beware of EMPI stock rocker arm kits and lash caps |
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well the new EMPI rocker arm kits have bad rocker arms the rockers are not heat treated they wear out after 100 miles . and can damage a motor these are real junk . i know of 3 people that have had this happen to there motors . and had to rebuild there motors the part number is 17-2954-0 use at your own risk i had to replace the empi rockers with stock vw rockers spencerfvee
..............................................................................................................................................thanks to ohio tom saying that the empi lash caps were junk i looked at my motor and a friends motor and sure enought the lash caps were beat out and i only had 20 miles on my motor i am so up set with empi they just dont give a dam i hope some one takes them to court and wins empi could have cost me a motor spencerfvee
Last edited by spencerfvee on Mon Sep 27, 2021 4:06 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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c77owen Samba Member
Joined: July 07, 2017 Posts: 454 Location: Kansas City, MO
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Posted: Thu Sep 16, 2021 2:48 pm Post subject: Re: beware of EMPI stock rocker arm kits |
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I haven't had issue with the rockers themselves, but I have had problems with the swivel ball adjusters that come with them as well as the ones they sell by themselves (same ones). They are not the same as the ones that used to be available several years ago. Now I just use the shafts and spacers out of these kits with original rockers and stock style adjusters |
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spencerfvee Samba Member
Joined: August 19, 2004 Posts: 3071
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Posted: Thu Sep 16, 2021 6:51 pm Post subject: Re: beware of EMPI stock rocker arm kits |
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c77owen wrote: |
I haven't had issue with the rockers themselves, but I have had problems with the swivel ball adjusters that come with them as well as the ones they sell by themselves (same ones). They are not the same as the ones that used to be available several years ago. Now I just use the shafts and spacers out of these kits with original rockers and stock style adjusters |
.......................................................................................................what is happing to the empi rocker is where the push rod fits into the rocker cup . the tip of the push rod eats away at the cup .so the valve lash opens up . and metal goes into the oil . not a great thing to happen to a brand new motor . spencerfvee |
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madmike Samba Member
Joined: July 11, 2005 Posts: 5292 Location: Atlanta,Michigan
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Posted: Fri Sep 17, 2021 5:03 am Post subject: Re: beware of EMPI stock rocker arm kits |
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Or just Beware of Anything EMPI _________________ 'Black Ice'Drag Buggy 'Turbo'
Rail Buggy 1915 turbo
76 Drag/Street bug 2180cc 'Turbo' 11:85 @113 mph"If I go any faster I'll burn up the Hamster" ,gets 28 mpg. also 10/09/22 11.90 @115 mph
"If I'm ever on Life Support,UNPLUG Me, Then Plug me back In see if that Works" |
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spencerfvee Samba Member
Joined: August 19, 2004 Posts: 3071
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Posted: Fri Sep 17, 2021 6:29 am Post subject: Re: beware of EMPI stock rocker arm kits |
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madmike wrote: |
Or just Beware of Anything EMPI |
....................................................................................i under stand where your coming from mike . some EMPI parts are great for a mild motor build . you just have to be care full what EMPI parts one buys . what up sets me is why EMPI did not test the rocker sets out be for they sold them . or may be they did and still sold them who knows for sure .we are sending these bad rockers back to empi. to show them how they wore out after under 100 miles spencerfvee |
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Lingwendil Samba Member
Joined: February 25, 2009 Posts: 3988 Location: Antioch, California, a block from the hood
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Splitdog Samba Split Personality
Joined: February 16, 2004 Posts: 4125 Location: Planet VW
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Posted: Fri Sep 17, 2021 7:24 am Post subject: Re: beware of EMPI stock rocker arm kits |
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Looks like Empi will always be trash. Henry, what say ye? _________________ CH³NO²
Z = z² + C
Der Blitzkrieg Kafers
#notacallooker |
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Zundfolge1432 Samba Member
Joined: June 13, 2004 Posts: 12467
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Posted: Fri Sep 17, 2021 8:16 am Post subject: Re: beware of EMPI stock rocker arm kits |
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madmike wrote: |
Or just Beware of Anything EMPI |
Despite the all the happy talk a few months ago about how they (empi)
We’re going to really step up to meet the needs of the VW community I suspect the driving force is to make more money as evidenced that they’ve bought out the competition. The original Empi was all about quality and innovation. They were the first to make replacement valve guides, prior to that heads were just shitcanned. They must be spinning in their graves to see what has become of this great old company.
Quality control would dictate they do random sampling checking for proper dimensions and heat treat but perhaps that is asking for too much. Sadly VW owners have always gravitated to cheap parts and cutting corners. There is a market for quality but it’s small. 😞 |
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bugguy1967 Samba Member
Joined: January 16, 2008 Posts: 4341 Location: Los Angeles, CA 90016
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Posted: Fri Sep 17, 2021 12:19 pm Post subject: Re: beware of EMPI stock rocker arm kits |
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I brought this up last year. I don't think Empi heat-treats anything. The pushrod cups are machined poorly as well. I milled a set for a guy, but I told him what I thought of them. They cut too easy to safely be used.
While on the subject, it's not worth it to buy anything EMPI/AA, if there is a similarly-priced alternative. These rockers retail higher than CB's Super Stock rockers, so I can't for the life of me understand why anyone would consider them. _________________ "A petrol engine can start readily, run smoothly and give every appearance of being in good order, without necessarily being in good tune." - Colin Campbell, "The Sportscar Engine" |
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spencerfvee Samba Member
Joined: August 19, 2004 Posts: 3071
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Posted: Fri Sep 17, 2021 3:20 pm Post subject: Re: beware of EMPI stock rocker arm kits |
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Zundfolge1432 wrote: |
madmike wrote: |
Or just Beware of Anything EMPI |
Despite the all the happy talk a few months ago about how they (empi)
We’re going to really step up to meet the needs of the VW community I suspect the driving force is to make more money as evidenced that they’ve bought out the competition. The original Empi was all about quality and innovation. They were the first to make replacement valve guides, prior to that heads were just shitcanned. They must be spinning in their graves to see what has become of this great old company.
Quality control would dictate they do random sampling checking for proper dimensions and heat treat but perhaps that is asking for too much. Sadly VW owners have always gravitated to cheap parts and cutting corners. There is a market for quality but it’s small. 😞 |
....................................................................................................................well said EMPI has no pride in what they sell . they only see how cheap they can get china to make parts . EMPI keeps buying up other co.like mr bug treuhaft race trim auto house and bug pack whos next on EMPI list. to take over the vw market place .maybe gene berg C.B spencerfvee |
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craigman Samba Member
Joined: March 28, 2004 Posts: 2397 Location: redding
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Posted: Mon Sep 20, 2021 10:00 pm Post subject: Re: beware of EMPI stock rocker arm kits |
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madmike wrote: |
Or just Beware of Anything EMPI |
Hell I though everyone knew that... |
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gringoloco2000 Samba Member
Joined: August 15, 2013 Posts: 150 Location: Debary, FL
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Posted: Tue Sep 21, 2021 3:08 pm Post subject: Re: beware of EMPI stock rocker arm kits |
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The problem I have with EMPI is that you have so many inconsistencies in quality across the products that they sell. I wish someone had a decoder ring on what was solid and what is crap. I pretty much default that it is all crap until proven otherwise. They really should as a business attempt to have a consistent level of quality across all products. That would help their brand. Why sell crap next to decent quality stuff when at the end of the any your brand is the butt of so many VW jokes. You can make a buck and produce/sell quality products. I find CB Performance to be consistent on quality. No company is perfect, but striving for quality only makes sense. My .02. YMMV _________________ '68 Rust Bucket |
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spencerfvee Samba Member
Joined: August 19, 2004 Posts: 3071
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Posted: Wed Sep 22, 2021 2:37 pm Post subject: Re: beware of EMPI stock rocker arm kits |
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gringoloco2000 wrote: |
The problem I have with EMPI is that you have so many inconsistencies in quality across the products that they sell. I wish someone had a decoder ring on what was solid and what is crap. I pretty much default that it is all crap until proven otherwise. They really should as a business attempt to have a consistent level of quality across all products. That would help their brand. Why sell crap next to decent quality stuff when at the end of the any your brand is the butt of so many VW jokes. You can make a buck and produce/sell quality products. I find CB Performance to be consistent on quality. No company is perfect, but striving for quality only makes sense. My .02. YMMV |
............................................................................................................the thing that gets me .is EMPI had to know that these rockers .were junk and they sold them any way . EMPI has never tried to make things right when things like these rockers are trash. just try to talk to EMPI about what they sell . thats junk . its like EMPI says .we got your money now F%ck you sucker .spencerfvee |
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evanfrucht Samba Member
Joined: July 24, 2016 Posts: 2180 Location: Laurel Canyon, CA
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Posted: Wed Sep 22, 2021 4:59 pm Post subject: Re: beware of EMPI stock rocker arm kits |
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Empi cranks are good. So, that's at least something _________________ 1967 Bug ( the daily rod )
1964 Fury Wagon ( the pavement shredder ) |
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spencerfvee Samba Member
Joined: August 19, 2004 Posts: 3071
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Posted: Wed Sep 22, 2021 5:17 pm Post subject: Re: beware of EMPI stock rocker arm kits |
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evanfrucht wrote: |
Empi cranks are good. So, that's at least something |
.................................................................................................................your right about the cranks i got one of EMPI bug pack cranks .after they bought bug pack spencerfvee |
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Ohio Tom Samba Member
Joined: February 09, 2006 Posts: 1660 Location: Marshallville Ohio
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Posted: Thu Sep 23, 2021 6:33 am Post subject: Re: beware of EMPI stock rocker arm kits |
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Empi lash caps suck as well.
They can't even make lash caps worth a damn...
It's really sad....
Wore right thru in a matter of a few hundred miles.
Fell off and went into the sump.
Great fun.. |
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[email protected] Samba Member
Joined: August 15, 2002 Posts: 4394 Location: Brew City
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Posted: Thu Sep 23, 2021 7:14 am Post subject: Re: beware of EMPI stock rocker arm kits |
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If you want to use 1.1 rocker arms, ALWAYS find a good used German set, make sure the oil passages are clean and you won't have any problems.
I only use German 1.1 rocker arms on all my engine builds. Between finding them, paying for the parts and shipping, and then unpacking, cleaning disassembling and rebuilding; it actually costs me more than buying new ones. You all now know why I would spend more on a used part compared to a new one. _________________ Please "LIKE" us on facebook to see what we are working on.
https://www.facebook.com/mofoco?ref=ts&fref=ts
www.mofoco.com
Cylinder Head Reference Sheet |
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Lingwendil Samba Member
Joined: February 25, 2009 Posts: 3988 Location: Antioch, California, a block from the hood
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OB Bus Samba Member
Joined: February 09, 2003 Posts: 2535 Location: Ocean Beach in Beautiful BLUE California
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hsosa1 Samba Member
Joined: January 17, 2005 Posts: 1897 Location: Fontana
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Posted: Thu Sep 23, 2021 10:07 pm Post subject: Re: beware of EMPI stock rocker arm kits |
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[email protected] wrote: |
If you want to use 1.1 rocker arms, ALWAYS find a good used German set, make sure the oil passages are clean and you won't have any problems.
I only use German 1.1 rocker arms on all my engine builds. Between finding them, paying for the parts and shipping, and then unpacking, cleaning disassembling and rebuilding; it actually costs me more than buying new ones. You all now know why I would spend more on a used part compared to a new one. |
. pin this! _________________ Just Cruzin Sur Califas VW Car Club est♤1998 |
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