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futhark
Samba Member
Joined: March 12, 2004
Posts: 184
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 Posted: Mon Jun 22, 2015 11:50 am Post subject: Tubular Fuel Gauge Sender Length |
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Now that my '72 coupe is back on the road after several years of barn storage, I decided to replace the after-market 15 gallon fuel tank installed by the previous owner with a stock tank, hoping to gain a little more room in the front trunk. I bought a new stock sized fuel tank and sent it off to ABC Radiator in Stockton, California to have the inside coated with Gas Tank Renu. When I got it back, I took it to a local mechanic, who swapped the tanks, reinstalling the cylindrical fuel gauge sender unit that was in the larger tank. The first time I filled up the tank it leaked and the fumes were overwhelming. I suspected an incompetent fuel tank sender unit gasket and had this replaced, but was still plagued with leakage and fumes.
2015 June 19, I took it to JSC Auto Volkswagen Repair in Santa Rosa, California and the mechanic there quickly identified several causes of the problem. Yes, the sender unit seal was incompetent, because 1) the sender unit from the larger tank was too long to fit in the stock tank and 2) the mechanic who installed the stock tank had torqued down the mounting screws to make a better seal, warping the mounting flange of the sender, so it still wouldn't seal. As a temporary measure, the JSC mechanic hammered the wavy flange flat, installed an additional gasket to raise the unit and also put on some petrol proof gasket sealer. This helped a lot, but I am still getting fumes. I want a sender that actually fits the tank. The current sender is 19.4 cm (= 7 1/4 inches) from flange bottom to the bottom of the cylinder and 20.5 cm (= 8 inches) from sender top to the bottom of the cylinder.
CIP1.com offers
VDO-224-228 - 224228 - FUEL TANK TUBE SENDER - 280MM (11 INCH) LONG
and
VDO-224-231 - 224231 - FUEL TANK TUBE SENDER - 310MM (12-1/4 INCH) LONG
Both these are longer than the one I am trying to replace!
karmannghia.com offers
fuel gauge Sending Unit, Tube Style
Part #: 919-051 67 73 RP
VW #: 271-919-051 B
length not specified.
Any suggestions? |
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c21darrel
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Joined: January 22, 2009
Posts: 8211
Location: San Dimas
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futhark
Samba Member
Joined: March 12, 2004
Posts: 184
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| Posted: Wed Jun 24, 2015 11:44 am Post subject: |
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| Thanks. I'll consider this, but rather like the tubular style on the grounds that it looks like it would be less subject to variable readings caused by fuel sloshing around while traveling. My identical posting on karmannghia.com had a reply suggesting that the tubular fuel gauge sender unit I currently have has measurements that are the same as stock, so may order from there once they have the gasket available again. |
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futhark
Samba Member
Joined: March 12, 2004
Posts: 184
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| Posted: Mon Jul 13, 2015 10:19 pm Post subject: Tubular Fuel Gauge Sender Length Update |
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| I installed the new cylindrical fuel gauge sender unit from karmannghia.com in my '72 coupe today. Yes, the new unit is shorter than its replacement, 185 mm from the mounting flange bottom to the bottom of the cylinder versus 194 mm for the after market large tank unit. I put gasket sealer on the gasket. The mounting screws were not all that easy to secure, but I stayed with it until all was snug. Next fill up will deliver the verdict on whether or not this procedure has rectified the gasoline fume and leakage problem. |
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futhark
Samba Member
Joined: March 12, 2004
Posts: 184
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| Posted: Wed Jun 06, 2018 8:19 pm Post subject: Re: Tubular Fuel Gauge Sender Length |
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Still chronically plagued with cabin gasoline fumes and even gasoline leaking from the fuel gauge sender unit joint at the top of the gas tank, I have adopted a new system for purchasing gasoline. I am one of those obsessive-compulsive types who keeps a service journal in each of my vehicles, mostly concerned with recording each fuel purchase and computing the gas mileage over the preceding interval. I have been doing this since the mid-1970s, starting with my 1968 Ford Cortina 4-door saloon. My initial technique has been to run the pump until it stopped automatically, then blip it up to the next nearest dime, avoiding acquiring or exchanging one cent coins. Recording the accumulated miles on the odometer and dividing that by the volume of gasoline purchased yields the vehicular efficiency. Now gasoline is about 10 times as expensive as it was when I started this, with a dollar buying what a dime formerly did, so now I try to bump the volume up to the next nearest dollar.
This works fine in my Chevy Metros, but on the '68 Karmann Ghia there is an overfilling problem, with resultant cabin fumes and even leakage into the front luggage compartment and onto the garage floor. This necessitated a new policy. Now I divide the trip odometer reading by 25, approximating that as a likely figure for my miles per gallon, since I drive very cautiously keeping to an even 55 mph on the highways and 45 mph on secondary roads. The quotient from my division is the volume of fuel I should expect to buy to refill the tank. Multiplying this number by the price of the gas gives me the potential cost. However, in view of the problems attendant with overfilling, I have opted to subtract $2 plus any change in my result and just buy that amount of fuel. So, if I figured that at 25 mpg I should refill with $22.45, I hand the cashier $20 and just buy that much. Well, so far it has been working pretty well. |
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sputnick60
Samba Moderator
Joined: July 22, 2007
Posts: 3915
Location: In Molinya Orbit
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| Posted: Thu Jun 07, 2018 3:33 am Post subject: Re: Tubular Fuel Gauge Sender Length |
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Good to see you back after a three year hiatus...
Reading this it all seems very clever but is rather convoluted way to deal with a fuel smell. Have look at what kiwighia68 did to solve his problem problem
his solution is part way thought his thread, but this link point to it
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=578994&start=1545
On the other hand I had a fume problem and I too would only half fill the car until I worked out the fuel sender was faulty. So, I replaced it with another better one without the perished internal rubber. Now, the problem is gone and I can fill it up to the top anytime I wish. Since you've replaced the sender, maybe now the fuel vent peculiar to '68 is something to address.
Nicholas.
_________________
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Last edited by sputnick60 on Fri Jun 08, 2018 6:52 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Paul70Ghia
Samba Member
Joined: September 27, 2014
Posts: 154
Location: Uk
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| Posted: Thu Jun 07, 2018 10:26 pm Post subject: Re: Tubular Fuel Gauge Sender Length |
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Hi, its a few years since I changed my tank but as a thought, if I remember correctly the sender only screws in correctly in one direction - with the electrical connector pointing back towards the dash. I think the holes are offset slightly but look as though itll fit in any orientation.
Might be worth a check as fuel leaks are not good! |
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futhark
Samba Member
Joined: March 12, 2004
Posts: 184
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| Posted: Fri Jun 08, 2018 7:20 pm Post subject: Re: Tubular Fuel Gauge Sender Length |
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| sputnick60, thanks for your comments. Not only have I replaced the fuel gauge sender unit, but also the gasket between it and the tank, smearing the gasket liberally with sealer prior to installation. The leaks and fumes are much reduced compared with initial situation, but significant enough to warrant monitoring and seeking further improvement. Limiting fuel volume purchase seems to be the most effective way for controlling the problem. As far as I have been able to determine, my installation is box stock, aside from having the internal coating for the tank's interior. |
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hoghead
Samba Member
Joined: May 28, 2006
Posts: 548
Location: Chiangmai
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| Posted: Thu Sep 23, 2021 6:47 pm Post subject: Re: Tubular Fuel Gauge Sender Length |
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Still no answer to this?
It looks like there are at least three possibilities for an enclosed style OEM output, fuel sender.
Anyone know the length if each as neither CIP nor Sol Cal publish this data
From So Cal:
Part #: 211919051
Bus model years from 1968 to January 1973, with chassis VIN ending in #2132138900
Part #: 271919051B
Fuel Sender Unit, fits 66-73 Ghia & 55-67 Bus.
Part #: 311919051
Fuel Sender Unit, fits 67-73 Type 3
The Porsche 911/914 sender from CIP
P-901-741-801-00
PORSCHE 911 62-85LT 65-89 / 912 62LT 66-69 / 914 65-76
Length = 11.25"
VW sender ranges from 75 ohms empty to 10 ohms
Porsche 914 sender ranges from 70 ohms empty to 3 ohms
Aftermarket VDO is 90 to 0 Ohms
Last edited by hoghead on Fri Sep 24, 2021 1:04 am; edited 1 time in total |
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EverettB 
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Joined: April 11, 2000
Posts: 69802
Location: Phoenix Metro
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hoghead
Samba Member
Joined: May 28, 2006
Posts: 548
Location: Chiangmai
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| Posted: Fri Sep 24, 2021 1:14 am Post subject: Re: Tubular Fuel Gauge Sender Length |
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I am fabricating a custom tank for my 71 Beetle, and can to some degree, build around the sensor length.
Gauge is a 914 which has a 3-70 Ohm range.
I have now found that the 914 sensor is 11.25/285mm long
All the aftermarket VDO gauges seem to be 0-90 Ohms.
A Beetle is 10-75 Ohms, and while not ideal I can live with it.
Looks like the Bay Window Bus, early Ghia are 280mm
914 is 285mm and my best choice if I can find a good one
Others are too short
Thanks for the help |
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