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My throttle hex bar is not straight
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liquidrush
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 13, 2021 10:53 am    Post subject: My throttle hex bar is not straight Reply with quote

So I'm installing a dual carb setup and after the carbs are sitting on the manifolds I noticed that the throttle cross bar is significantly uneven. According to the instructions there's no left or right to any of the included parts. Am I missing something? It seems like a pretty straightforward installation. It's about 3/8" of an inch away from the shroud on the left side and 1 1/4" inch on the right side. The engine is stock, no stroker or anything else like that.



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Ohio Tom
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 13, 2021 11:00 am    Post subject: Re: My throttle hex bar is not straight Reply with quote

As long as it's not in a bind, it's not an issue.

With the range of manifolds available with different offsets.

And, the range of carburetor linkage plates, you can end up all kinds of crooked.

It' doesn't throw the geometry off enough to matter.
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liquidrush
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 13, 2021 11:07 am    Post subject: Re: My throttle hex bar is not straight Reply with quote

Thanks, just seems like a jacked up way of doing things.
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modok
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 13, 2021 6:54 pm    Post subject: Re: My throttle hex bar is not straight Reply with quote

I have noticed a lot of people prefer it to be straight. And many are made to be that way, but in order to do that... that means your carburetors have to be straight across from eachother, or you need a janky long spacer on one of the throttle arm.

IMO, I don't care if it's straight, as long as it works good.
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evanfrucht
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 13, 2021 10:55 pm    Post subject: Re: My throttle hex bar is not straight Reply with quote

modok wrote:
I have noticed a lot of people prefer it to be straight. And many are made to be that way, but in order to do that... that means your carburetors have to be straight across from eachother, or you need a janky long spacer on one of the throttle arm.

IMO, I don't care if it's straight, as long as it works good.

X2, the angle doesn't really matter. It just looks "wrong" but because of the ball joints it works fine.

Not really janky.

I like the CSP "twist" linkage, but some people poo-poo that one for having geometry "issues." Personally, I've been able to sync it well. It's a bit of a dance to get it set up, but it stays in sync and the clean look is unbeatable. There are a few unique tricks to get that specific linkage dialed in just right.
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 14, 2021 7:48 am    Post subject: Re: My throttle hex bar is not straight Reply with quote

evanfrucht wrote:


I like the CSP "twist" linkage, but some people poo-poo that one for having geometry "issues." Personally, I've been able to sync it well. It's a bit of a dance to get it set up, but it stays in sync and the clean look is unbeatable. There are a few unique tricks to get that specific linkage dialed in just right.


Care to explain a bit? Getting ready to set some up for IDF clones and curious.
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 14, 2021 8:07 am    Post subject: Re: My throttle hex bar is not straight Reply with quote

Lingwendil wrote:
evanfrucht wrote:


I like the CSP "twist" linkage, but some people poo-poo that one for having geometry "issues." Personally, I've been able to sync it well. It's a bit of a dance to get it set up, but it stays in sync and the clean look is unbeatable. There are a few unique tricks to get that specific linkage dialed in just right.


Care to explain a bit? Getting ready to set some up for IDF clones and curious.

Well for one, the throttle shaft arms that come with the kit have a slight amount of rotational play in the hole that's fits through the throttle shaft (at least on Dells.) You can use that play to your advantage and tighten it down where it needs to be. It helps you rotate the arm to compensate for any funny business in the angles or threaded adjustment limitations. This is particularly helpful when turning the shaft to adjust moves the throttle point either barely not enough or just a hair too much, due to the design of the linkage and the thread pitch on the rod.

A bit hard to explain but hope I made that sort of clear.
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 14, 2021 11:05 am    Post subject: Re: My throttle hex bar is not straight Reply with quote

Has nothing to do with carburetors or linkage....Its all about offset of manifolds..... IF its free and easy and works there is no issue except for aesthetics...
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liquidrush
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 14, 2021 1:53 pm    Post subject: Re: My throttle hex bar is not straight Reply with quote

I got em all synced and tuned pretty good, every thing moves smoothly and it runs smoother than I thought it would but man, my ocd requires more symmetry with this so I'm going to add a little material to that left side bracket to move it back more in line with that right side. Of course I'll have to pull the right bracket as well to blast and paint it to match the left side. Oh well, nothing is ever easy.
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 14, 2021 2:45 pm    Post subject: Re: My throttle hex bar is not straight Reply with quote

I used the Vintage Speed center pull linkage and I will never go back to hexbar. Pricey yes, but no issues setting up, in fact very easy to sync, smooth, with minimum spring pressure.
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 14, 2021 5:41 pm    Post subject: Re: My throttle hex bar is not straight Reply with quote

The man is complaining his shaft is crooked? It is only a problem if she complains. Laughing
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 14, 2021 5:46 pm    Post subject: Re: My throttle hex bar is not straight Reply with quote

nsracing wrote:
The man is complaining his shaft is crooked? It is only a problem if she complains. Laughing


modok wrote:
IMO, I don't care if it's straight, as long as it works good.


Great quotes Wink

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liquidrush
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 15, 2021 2:20 pm    Post subject: Re: My throttle hex bar is not straight Reply with quote

Rather than cutting, welding and refinishing I machined a couple spacers for the left side bracket and used two longer bolts for it. I got it pretty straight now within about a quarter of an inch and it satisfies my ocd. I'm out in the garage running it and my wife comes out says it sounds different and what did I do. I can't hide anything from her. Anyway, with it running at idle speed it responds very well on both sides to the mixture screw and it idles well but it smells awfully rich. Are there different idle air or fuel jets for these carbs I can try? They're the empi single barrel EPC 34s.
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 15, 2021 5:52 pm    Post subject: Re: My throttle hex bar is not straight Reply with quote

Have you checked fuel pressure? Mine liked 2.5 to 3 psi. The new pump I got from archway put out about 7 psi. Could not drive down a gravel road without the nedle/float getting overpowered to the point of it loading up real bad.
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 16, 2021 4:25 am    Post subject: Re: My throttle hex bar is not straight Reply with quote

Yes, I bought a pump from the guy here. It bounces at 2psi at idle.
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 16, 2021 6:34 pm    Post subject: Re: My throttle hex bar is not straight Reply with quote

liquid, now that you have the hex bar moved back on the left side, you have to make sure that your carb "down rods" are at the same angle as seen from the side as in your 2nd photo. It looks like the left carb's rod is not as steep/close to vertical as the right carb's rod. They have to be as close to the same angle as possible, and now you'd need to make an extension for the left carb bottom heim joint to move that joint rearwards and match the steepness angle of the right rod. Theoretically you'd make that extension the same length as you extended your hex bar back.
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 16, 2021 7:05 pm    Post subject: Re: My throttle hex bar is not straight Reply with quote

Just remove the spacers. It was never a problem to begin with. You've created one.

If you want a good looking linkage... get a CSP.

It's that simple...

The CB hex bar works great. It's just looks bad... IMO Twisted Evil
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liquidrush
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 17, 2021 9:39 am    Post subject: Re: My throttle hex bar is not straight Reply with quote

Looking at csp I don't see linkage for these carbs unless you just have to work it out. I now, of course, get it with keeping the heim joint bars at the same angle. That didn't even occur to me as I was more concerned with looks. I can't help it, I require symmetry. Checking them with my digital protractor they are over 8 degrees different
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 17, 2021 10:50 am    Post subject: Re: My throttle hex bar is not straight Reply with quote

Are the carbs ICT's?
https://www.csp-shop.com/en/engine/bellcrank-linkage-csp-129-941-110ict-20594a.html
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 17, 2021 11:46 am    Post subject: Re: My throttle hex bar is not straight Reply with quote

I saw that one, it's from Britain and it seems to be out of stock in the USA. Unless anyone has one for sale.
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