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SyncroChrick
Samba Member
Joined: January 10, 2005
Posts: 1010
Location: San Francisco, CA
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 Posted: Tue Nov 20, 2018 11:48 am Post subject: Re: rebuilding the the front heater box |
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Done! Somehow it's a very satisfying job.
Just a couple notes for future reference if anyone finds this thread:
-I found a very good video online:
https://youtu.be/h7wgsznvcCE
-The pipe insulation tape from Home-Depot that was recommended in this thread is perfect for the job. I don't think you could find anything better. |
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dasilva
Samba Member
Joined: July 27, 2020
Posts: 69
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| Posted: Fri Aug 06, 2021 4:04 pm Post subject: Re: rebuilding the the front heater box |
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This seems like the most applicable front heater box thread to resurrect!
I'm putting the clips on the box. Mostly successful.
Except for two clips:
Has anyone else run into this issue? Best I can think of is 'opening,' the clip with a pair of pliers, and then 'closing' once it is slipped on.....
It feels odd to have to do this. It needs some force, but I've got all the other clips on by hand.
Any advice or thoughts would be appreciated.
Thanks! |
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Vanagon Nut
Samba Member
Joined: February 08, 2008
Posts: 10370
Location: Sunshine Coast B.C.
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| Posted: Mon Nov 29, 2021 10:37 am Post subject: Re: 1984 Doka Heater Box |
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So are people using foam or felt to seal the flaps? Is camper tape the same as closed cell residential application foam tape?
This locally available tape:
https://www.canadiantire.ca/en/pdp/heavy-duty-felt-strip-1-2-x-58-in-0460825p.html
might be close to 1/8" thick but I'm not sure. It might be 5 mm thick. ( 0.197" )
Thanks,
Neil.
| Bman wrote: |
..... if like me this has never been done for your 30+ year old rig, its worth the $12 investment to get 1.25" x 3/16" (.25") self adhesive camper tape to complete this job, your here anyway right?
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_________________
1981 Westy DIY 15º ABA
1988 West DIY 50º ABA
VE7TBN |
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jlrftype7
Samba Member
Joined: July 24, 2018
Posts: 3576
Location: Chicago
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| Posted: Mon Nov 29, 2021 10:14 pm Post subject: Re: 1984 Doka Heater Box |
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| Vanagon Nut wrote: |
So are people using foam or felt to seal the flaps? Is camper tape the same as closed cell residential application foam tape?
This locally available tape:
https://www.canadiantire.ca/en/pdp/heavy-duty-felt-strip-1-2-x-58-in-0460825p.html
might be close to 1/8" thick but I'm not sure. It might be 5 mm thick. ( 0.197" )
Thanks,
Neil.
| Bman wrote: |
..... if like me this has never been done for your 30+ year old rig, its worth the $12 investment to get 1.25" x 3/16" (.25") self adhesive camper tape to complete this job, your here anyway right?
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I used the Camper tape, it has a good track record here on the Samba with the flap overhauls
_________________
'68 Westy- my first VW and vehicle/Bus- long gone.- sold it to a traveling Swiss couple....
'67 Type 3 Fastback, my 2nd car- gone
'69 Semi-Auto Stick Shift Beetle-gone
2017 MINI Coopers, our current DDs
‘84 Tin Top - Hilga....Auto |
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Vanagon Nut
Samba Member
Joined: February 08, 2008
Posts: 10370
Location: Sunshine Coast B.C.
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| Posted: Tue Nov 30, 2021 9:41 am Post subject: Re: 1984 Doka Heater Box |
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| jlrftype7 wrote: |
| Vanagon Nut wrote: |
So are people using foam or felt to seal the flaps? Is camper tape the same as closed cell residential application foam tape?
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I used the Camper tape, it has a good track record here on the Samba with the flap overhauls |
Ok cool, thanks. Found some 1-1/4" x 3/16" camper tape. It seems to compress more than than a similar sealing tape I'd cut to about the same thickness; the plastic retainers now snap down well. Hopefully, mulitple layers of that 3/16" tape will work to seal box to body. I now have a life time supply of it. 
The tape initially had an odd smell to it but that seems to be abating. i.e. I hope that smell doesn't crop up when heated.
Neil.
_________________
1981 Westy DIY 15º ABA
1988 West DIY 50º ABA
VE7TBN |
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Vanagon Nut
Samba Member
Joined: February 08, 2008
Posts: 10370
Location: Sunshine Coast B.C.
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| Posted: Thu Dec 02, 2021 9:15 pm Post subject: Re: rebuilding the the front heater box |
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It occurred to me that the rear air control flap on air cooled box could easily be swapped over to the "Transporter" type box but that's not the case; doing so would require mods to the "Transporter" box. For my needs, I see no reason to do that were it feasible.
Pics showing some differences between the air cooled (w/fan) and "Transporter" boxes. The cable securing brackets on each box are different.
Neil.
Air cooled box on the right
Looking up from bottom. The air cooled box did not have the foot heat flaps originally. Transporter box on left shown with rear air block off plate removed.
_________________
1981 Westy DIY 15º ABA
1988 West DIY 50º ABA
VE7TBN |
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jlrftype7
Samba Member
Joined: July 24, 2018
Posts: 3576
Location: Chicago
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| Posted: Fri Dec 03, 2021 11:45 am Post subject: Re: 1984 Doka Heater Box |
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| Vanagon Nut wrote: |
| jlrftype7 wrote: |
| Vanagon Nut wrote: |
So are people using foam or felt to seal the flaps? Is camper tape the same as closed cell residential application foam tape?
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I used the Camper tape, it has a good track record here on the Samba with the flap overhauls |
Ok cool, thanks. Found some 1-1/4" x 3/16" camper tape. It seems to compress more than than a similar sealing tape I'd cut to about the same thickness; the plastic retainers now snap down well. Hopefully, mulitple layers of that 3/16" tape will work to seal box to body. I now have a life time supply of it.
The tape initially had an odd smell to it but that seems to be abating. i.e. I hope that smell doesn't crop up when heated.
Neil. |
It shouldn't, I have 1 1/2 years now with that Tape installed, no ill smells from it at all...  What's scary is that 1 1/2 years have gone by since I did the heaterbox rebuild..... 
_________________
'68 Westy- my first VW and vehicle/Bus- long gone.- sold it to a traveling Swiss couple....
'67 Type 3 Fastback, my 2nd car- gone
'69 Semi-Auto Stick Shift Beetle-gone
2017 MINI Coopers, our current DDs
‘84 Tin Top - Hilga....Auto |
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jlrftype7
Samba Member
Joined: July 24, 2018
Posts: 3576
Location: Chicago
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| Posted: Fri Dec 03, 2021 11:49 am Post subject: Re: rebuilding the the front heater box |
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| Vanagon Nut wrote: |
It occurred to me that the rear air control flap on air cooled box could easily be swapped over to the "Transporter" type box but that's not the case; doing so would require mods to the "Transporter" box. For my needs, I see no reason to do that were it feasible.
Pics showing some differences between the air cooled (w/fan) and "Transporter" boxes. The cable securing brackets on each box are different.
Neil.
Air cooled box on the right
Looking up from bottom. The air cooled box did not have the foot heat flaps originally. Transporter box on left shown with rear air block off plate removed.
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So I understand it better, you refer to the Transporter Box, meaning, the Original Non-electric equipped Heater Boxes on the very early years of the Vanagon?
Or was there always a fan assist heaterbox like a Deluxe Model versus a Base Model Air Cooled Vanagon that had no fan?. I'm still not clear on that.... 
_________________
'68 Westy- my first VW and vehicle/Bus- long gone.- sold it to a traveling Swiss couple....
'67 Type 3 Fastback, my 2nd car- gone
'69 Semi-Auto Stick Shift Beetle-gone
2017 MINI Coopers, our current DDs
‘84 Tin Top - Hilga....Auto |
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Vanagon Nut
Samba Member
Joined: February 08, 2008
Posts: 10370
Location: Sunshine Coast B.C.
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| Posted: Fri Dec 03, 2021 1:02 pm Post subject: Re: rebuilding the the front heater box |
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| jlrftype7 wrote: |
| Vanagon Nut wrote: |
Pics showing some differences between the air cooled (w/fan) and "Transporter" boxes.
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... I have 1 1/2 years now with that Tape installed, no ill smells from it at all...
So I understand it better, you refer to the Transporter Box, meaning, the Original Non-electric equipped Heater Boxes on the very early years of the Vanagon?
Or was there always a fan assist heaterbox like a Deluxe Model versus a Base Model Air Cooled Vanagon that had no fan?. I'm still not clear on that.... |
Good to know the truck canopy foam smell wasn't noticeable. In my case, the smell from that tape seems to have dissipated. I also used that truck canopy foam to seal the "forced-air" flaps.
Ah, ok, my reference was somewhat arcane.
The "Transporter" box was from a 1985 1.9 WBX panel type Vanagon. That box has a block off plate at the "passenger compartment flap" (Bentley P 80.14). That flap would normally control air from box through air passages at dash etc. to rear area. That box would obviously have been used in a single cab and possibly a Doka.
It's possible none of the late 79-80 Vanagons offered a fresh air fan option. I don't know if this applied to all markets but all the Bentley air cooled Vanagon main wiring diagrams show a separate fresh air fan diagram. The 1982 diesel main wiring diagrams show a fresh air fan. Diesel Vanagons were made during air cooled production so it would've made sense to introduce boxes with fans and room, provisions, for a heater core e.g. that box in the air cooled Vanagon had knock outs for the heater core nipples.
Another note before I forget.
When I took apart my air cooled engine heat box in 2008, it had nasty grey sealant at the mating surfaces. That sealant was a PITA to remove. So, I sealed the box join exterior with basic clear silicone. Nearly 14 years later, that silicone was still in place, easy to cut open and likely easy to remove. But, I don't know if sealant was applied to that joint at the factory.
In hindsight, I likely assumed the note re: D17 in Bentley applied to the box half joint. Looking again, I think D17 is applied to the box seal that mates to air channel on body.
1985 donor "Transporter" Vanagon
my now removed air cooled heat box. Cable brackets and heater core nipple knockouts shown:
[
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1981 Westy DIY 15º ABA
1988 West DIY 50º ABA
VE7TBN |
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danfromsyr
Samba Member
Joined: March 01, 2004
Posts: 15144
Location: Syracuse, NY
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Vanagon Nut
Samba Member
Joined: February 08, 2008
Posts: 10370
Location: Sunshine Coast B.C.
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| Posted: Wed Dec 08, 2021 9:24 pm Post subject: Re: rebuilding the the front heater box |
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re: swap from fan equipped air cooled heat box "modified" for engine conversion, to 2 lever (foot heat, defrost) water cooled box with OE heater core baffle.
Very happy I did this. Better air flow control, WAY more available heat. Sealing off the fresh air ram flaps on the old box may've contributed to the poor heat but installing the OE metal baffle is likely the biggest factor to heat improvement.
This box allows only fresh cold air to the side vents. Side vents on my '88 can provide heated air. I have to replace the fan on the '88 box so will be interested to compare the two.
The sort of "air cooled" routing/location of heat control valve cable required re-using the air cooled lever assembly to accommodate that cable. The bends that cable now takes are not ideal but so far, cable has not bent.
What I'd do differently next time:
- use narrower foam at heater core as shown in Bentley. The uncut wide truck canopy foam made for a slightly tight fit of core to box.
- ensure heater core is snug against the baffle. I hear a new rattle when going over bumps. It's likely the baffle against core.
- install a box with a fresh air control. But, using the box I already had made sense.
Felt would likely last longer than foam. However, the old foam was still in good shape. But, it didn't have high hours use. I figure the fan will fail before the foam does.
Neil.
Since I was removing/installing the dash by myself, I found this "third hand" helped me guide the dash off and on. The keen eye will note the black side vents. The original brown ones didn't seal well. Thankful I had a good used set on hand. I'll be curious to see if I can repair the brown set.
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1981 Westy DIY 15º ABA
1988 West DIY 50º ABA
VE7TBN |
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VicVan
Samba Member
Joined: July 01, 2015
Posts: 1840
Location: Vancouver Island, BC
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| Posted: Tue Dec 14, 2021 1:05 pm Post subject: Re: rebuilding the the front heater box |
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I'm changing the foam on the flaps, using the same camper tape eveyone used in this thread (3/16" thick, closed cell foam).
It's not squishy enough for the black plastic tabs to hold in place. If I clip them in the metal flap, the spring force of the foam unclips them out. Am I missing something?
(This was supposed to be the easy part...)
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'90 Little Blue Truck, 2WD auto, FAS GenV 2.0 NA (AVH) |
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Zeitgeist 13
Samba Member
Joined: March 05, 2009
Posts: 12115
Location: Port Manteau
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| Posted: Tue Dec 14, 2021 5:14 pm Post subject: Re: rebuilding the the front heater box |
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That foam appears to be twice as thick as the stuff I've used in the past. I think that's your problem; too thick and not enough squish.
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Casey--
'89 Bluestar ALH w/12mm Waldo pump, PP764 and GT2052
'01 Weekender --> full camper
y u rune klassik? |
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Vanagon Nut
Samba Member
Joined: February 08, 2008
Posts: 10370
Location: Sunshine Coast B.C.
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| Posted: Tue Dec 14, 2021 5:33 pm Post subject: Re: rebuilding the the front heater box |
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Can't see if you did this but.....
I started hole with small drill bit then turned a med, then larger than hole bit CW, CCW, repeat, to make sure material was cleared away from hole. Trying not to pinch an foam bits between prongs and hole helps too.
Neil.
Holes look a bit like ass but you get the idea
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1981 Westy DIY 15º ABA
1988 West DIY 50º ABA
VE7TBN |
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VicVan
Samba Member
Joined: July 01, 2015
Posts: 1840
Location: Vancouver Island, BC
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| Posted: Tue Dec 14, 2021 11:30 pm Post subject: Re: rebuilding the the front heater box |
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Thanks for the tips. I bought the pipe insulation mentioned elsewhere, and made the holes for the plastic clips bigger. Snug fit now, much better.
All flaps have been rebuilt. Just waiting for the heater core to arrive. Who knew that a pandemic of the century and floods of the decade and Christmas season would delay parcels.
Air recirculation flaps:
Putting back the bottom (?) cover, the one with the flaps for the, umm, well the larger flaps:
A few drops of oil in each cable housing
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'90 Little Blue Truck, 2WD auto, FAS GenV 2.0 NA (AVH) |
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VicVan
Samba Member
Joined: July 01, 2015
Posts: 1840
Location: Vancouver Island, BC
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| Posted: Sat Dec 18, 2021 6:30 pm Post subject: Re: rebuilding the the front heater box |
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Done! Glad the heater box feels new.
New Gowesty heater core
Added a lube tube for the blower bearing, thank you Steve M for the idea:
Bench-testing the new Jeep resistor, thank you Dave H for the idea:
If your tabs for the lower flaps are damaged, here's a cheap and effective fix. Just cut a piece of thick paper or cardboard to suit. The tab is now held firmly and isn't going anywhere.
Tada !
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'90 Little Blue Truck, 2WD auto, FAS GenV 2.0 NA (AVH) |
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DuncanS
Samba Member
Joined: October 17, 2013
Posts: 4583
Location: New Hampshire
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| Posted: Sun Dec 19, 2021 6:45 am Post subject: Re: rebuilding the the front heater box |
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Well done.
Duncan |
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dhaavers
Samba Member
Joined: March 19, 2010
Posts: 7756
Location: NE MN (tinyurl.com/dhaaverslocation)
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| Posted: Mon Dec 20, 2021 5:22 am Post subject: Re: rebuilding the the front heater box |
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Nice work, & great documentation of the lube tube install... Progress!
- Dave
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86 White Wolfsburg Westy Weekender
"The WonderVan"
<EDITED TO PROTECT INNOCENT PIXELS> |
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VicVan
Samba Member
Joined: July 01, 2015
Posts: 1840
Location: Vancouver Island, BC
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| Posted: Mon Dec 20, 2021 10:38 am Post subject: Re: rebuilding the the front heater box |
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| dhaavers wrote: |
Nice work, & great documentation of the lube tube install... Progress!
- Dave |
Hopefully ot helps others down the road!
I've renewed the washer fluid tubes while I had the dash out, and for the lube tube I've reused a portion of the washer fluid tube that was still OK. Hence the beautiful "caramel" colour.
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'90 Little Blue Truck, 2WD auto, FAS GenV 2.0 NA (AVH) |
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