Full flow without external cooler??

[oprn]

[oprn]

[oprn]

Here is something else to think about and this is pure theory. I don't deny that there is some mixing happening, like has been said there is oil going down about 2" into the sump in the center and oil going back up in the center about 2", and when you drop the oil out to change it there is no inconsistency in color... but I personally do not believe the motion of the vehicle contributes significantly...

What about engine vibration? Is that not the principle that ultra sonic cleaners work on? Could that be setting up little eddy currents in the sump? Maybe in conjunction with the motion in the center, eventually the oil all gets mixed?
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We had the stone age, the bronze age, the industrial age and now we are in the age of mass deception and mind control for corporate profit. (The mass media age)

[Paul Jr]

No it’s not but the heated oil isn’t returning directly to the lower sump. This in my mind is getting sloshed around with the oil that is in the case itself, while at the same time the pump at what flow rate? Is pulling oil from down in the lower add on sump, I would think and can prove easily that with that percentage of open space where the sump is attached that sloshing and mixing is still effecting the oil down low.

Just try it with two coffe cups taped together, one black one with creamer for a 5 min ride home from Dunkin’ Donuts. No other movement like the pulling of oil from the sump was required but yet I still had coffe with creamer added in both cups when I got home?

The open hole between the cups seems to let sloshing occur in both cups but as I suspected it’s just at a slower rate without the action of a sump pulling that fluid from the lower cup.

My Mom is going to kill me when she realizes I drilled a hole in her cup and duckt taped them together.

I suspect with the shape of the inside of my sump and the oil pulling from the pick up in combination with the open hole at the percentage it is compared to the overall size of the sump it would mix faster.

Try driving with one of those tanks open on the top and let’s see how long it takes before we see sloshing, for you description open the hatch and see how much water you loose with every motion that forces inertia to act on the water.

Last night we tried with two pans and two basters to simulate the sump but we were not able to get a good enough spread out return of the dyed cooking oil in my opinion to represent the radical return pattern I would expect you would have inside the case. While trying this one and not having enough hands My Girlfriend helped me and she pointed out one other thing that should add and we most likely should be taking into account.
Which is the movement of the internals and thier effect on both the returning oil as well as the oil in the case as we are not just relying on the oil in the sump only?

I can only imagine this would also have a large impact on everything?

[Paul Jr]

[oprn]

Love the engaging if grey matter this is producing!

I too thought that an add on sump would do a lot to cool the engine oil but to my disappointment reality did not support my expectations. A few degrees yes, possibly but not enough to really positively document as an improvement so why did it not work as expected? This is what the agitation of the brain cells is all about here, trying to understand why not.

Yes both tanks are missing the lids, there is a 8" open hole so I did lose a bit of water on the way home but the motion is only on the surface. If there is no water/air interface there is virtually no motion. I would be willing to bet the farm on there being no airspace in your add on sump. The amount of motion you can get is directly proportional to the size of that air/liquid interaction area.

The minnows at the surface of the lake are going for a ride in a storm but the catfish on the bottom ain't feeling a thing. He's too far away from where the action happens. The oil in the crankcase is doing a dance in the corners and at the stop lights but nothing is happening in the add on sump. Too far from the surface.
_________________
We had the stone age, the bronze age, the industrial age and now we are in the age of mass deception and mind control for corporate profit. (The mass media age)

[oprn]

Gotta get a handle on this insomnia...
_________________
We had the stone age, the bronze age, the industrial age and now we are in the age of mass deception and mind control for corporate profit. (The mass media age)

[oprn]

[Paul Jr]

Again your not taking into account the interaction of the pick up tube?
It’s not taking its oil from the case. This alone is ensuring the oil moves in a timely manner from the sump while the other forces are acting on the oil being returned to the oil that is being vilently sloshed and blown around the case by inertia and windage.

Get that oil temp from someplace other than the sump and I think we will see that the 30 to 35 degree difference between his sump and his case is making much more of a difference in the temperature of the oil delivered to the bearings than you are trying to have us believe.

[txoval]

There is only one point of oil suction (supply), which is at the bottom of the sump.

From first start up, the first oil going to the bearings is then at the top of the case oil level. Now, does that first slug of oil stay together? Absolutely not, but as the oil makes it’s way back to the suction point it enters a cooler holding area (sump). How much this helps? I have no idea, but there is some cooling effect.

I do agree that if the sump to case connection (surface area) was larger the two would have similar temps…but this would negatively effect cooling

[Chickensoup]

[QRP]

[KEGZ]

[oprn]

[Paul Jr]

I will have to side with those who claim there is more mixing and wiegh heavily on it helps much more than your willing to admit.
You seem to be missing too much in your theory.

[richierich]

I have an external 13 row cooler on my Split Panel. I'm running a Mocal Sandwich plate in the external filter mount and there is a thermostat on the line out of the cooler which trips the fan at 92°. All stainless braided hose and AN8 fittings.

I can tell you that I did run the bus with the motor (2276 on 48 IDA's, C45 cam, super pro heads) for a while before fitting the cooler and on a long freeway run in summer, it would trip the save my bug dipstick light.

Since I fitted the cooler, havent seen the save my bug light.

[RandyV]

[oprn]

[Paul Jr]

[Chickensoup]