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turbo1600 Samba Member
Joined: May 07, 2020 Posts: 20 Location: renmark
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Posted: Tue May 17, 2022 3:57 am Post subject: maybe weird problem with instrument cluster, ?1973 kombi bay |
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been trying to get some action happening with this instrument cluster, NO lights at all come on, oil, charge etc..
weird thing is EVERY single connection has 12vpos on them, even the large metal backing cover which i think isnt right.
anybody know what might be goin on ? |
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vwwestyman Samba Member
Joined: April 24, 2004 Posts: 5680 Location: Manhattan, Kansas, USA
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Posted: Tue May 17, 2022 7:23 am Post subject: Re: maybe weird problem with instrument cluster, ?1973 kombi bay |
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Is this a right hand drive bus? In the pic, it also looks like the cluster is upside-down which is throwing me all off!
Anyway, it doesn't look like it is grounded. There are two tabs (bottom of cluster, top in pic), one of which should be used to provide ground to the main structure of the back plate. The other piggy-backs ground to something else-probably the light for the heater controls.
The two smaller backing plates (left side in pic, each has two bulbs) should have +12v power to them, and ground being provided by the wire allows the light to turn on (exception being the alternator light, it turns off when it has +12v on both sides of the bulb). Make sure that one of the black wire tabs isn't touching the main backing plate.
Then I bet when you ground the large backing plate, most of your lights will work!
If the lights in the two smaller plates aren't working, then somehow +12v isn't getting to them; check the black wire that joins them together.
Unless something crazy happened, I can't imagine that every single bulb has burned out, but it is worth checking them to rule out.
As far as getting +12v at every single connection, the only way that would happen that I can think of is either if someone really messed up the wiring, or you've got some setting goofed up on your multimeter or you're using it incorrectly. (Is the memory button pushed? Occasionally I'll do that and throw myself off.) Perhaps you're seeing +12v going through the bulb filaments to the ungrounded plate. _________________ Dave Cook
President, Wild Westerner Club
1978 Champagne Edition Westy, repowered to '97 Jetta TDI
1973 Wild Westerner
My Thing |
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SGKent Samba Member
Joined: October 30, 2007 Posts: 41031 Location: Citrus Heights CA (Near Sacramento)
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Posted: Tue May 17, 2022 7:25 am Post subject: Re: maybe weird problem with instrument cluster, ?1973 kombi bay |
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I don't see a ground (solid brown) wire either. _________________ “Most people don’t know what they’re doing, and a lot of them are really good at it.” - George Carlin |
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ToolBox Samba Member
Joined: January 27, 2004 Posts: 3439 Location: Detroit, where they don't jack parts off my ride in the parking lot of the 7-11
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Posted: Tue May 17, 2022 8:46 am Post subject: Re: maybe weird problem with instrument cluster, ?1973 kombi bay |
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I vote missing groud wire also. |
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Wildthings Samba Member
Joined: March 13, 2005 Posts: 50259
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Posted: Tue May 17, 2022 2:18 pm Post subject: Re: maybe weird problem with instrument cluster, ?1973 kombi bay |
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The metal housing having voltage showing on it would be a sure sign of a bad or missing ground. This should not affect the oil pressure light and possible others, so you may have more than one thing wrong. |
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turbo1600 Samba Member
Joined: May 07, 2020 Posts: 20 Location: renmark
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Posted: Tue May 17, 2022 4:21 pm Post subject: Re: maybe weird problem with instrument cluster, ?1973 kombi bay |
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vwwestyman wrote: |
Is this a right hand drive bus? In the pic, it also looks like the cluster is upside-down which is throwing me all off!
Anyway, it doesn't look like it is grounded. There are two tabs (bottom of cluster, top in pic), one of which should be used to provide ground to the main structure of the back plate. The other piggy-backs ground to something else-probably the light for the heater controls.
The two smaller backing plates (left side in pic, each has two bulbs) should have +12v power to them, and ground being provided by the wire allows the light to turn on (exception being the alternator light, it turns off when it has +12v on both sides of the bulb). Make sure that one of the black wire tabs isn't touching the main backing plate.
Then I bet when you ground the large backing plate, most of your lights will work!
If the lights in the two smaller plates aren't working, then somehow +12v isn't getting to them; check the black wire that joins them together.
Unless something crazy happened, I can't imagine that every single bulb has burned out, but it is worth checking them to rule out.
As far as getting +12v at every single connection, the only way that would happen that I can think of is either if someone really messed up the wiring, or you've got some setting goofed up on your multimeter or you're using it incorrectly. (Is the memory button pushed? Occasionally I'll do that and throw myself off.) Perhaps you're seeing +12v going through the bulb filaments to the ungrounded plate. |
yes its right hand drive. australian. |
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telford dorr Samba Member
Joined: March 11, 2009 Posts: 3547 Location: San Diego (Encinitas)
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Posted: Wed May 18, 2022 12:19 pm Post subject: Re: maybe weird problem with instrument cluster, ?1973 kombi bay |
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IIRC, the instrument panel is the same orientation, left or right drive.
Definitely missing the ground wire, but this won't affect gen light, oil light, or turn indicators, as these are mounted on sub-panels and supplied battery power from the ignition switch (black wire). _________________ '71 panel, now with FI
'Experience' is the ability to recognize a mistake when you're making it again - Franklin P. Jones
In theory, theory works in practice; in practice, it doesn't - William T. Harbaugh
When you're dead, you don't know you're dead. The pain is only felt by others.
Same thing happens when you're stupid. - Philippe Geluck
More VW electrical at http://telforddorr.com/ (available 9am to 9pm PST) |
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Starbucket Samba Member
Joined: April 30, 2007 Posts: 4006 Location: WA
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Posted: Wed May 18, 2022 4:08 pm Post subject: Re: maybe weird problem with instrument cluster, ?1973 kombi bay |
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Are you getting 12 volts when grounding the meter to the cluster? |
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turbo1600 Samba Member
Joined: May 07, 2020 Posts: 20 Location: renmark
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Posted: Tue May 24, 2022 3:36 am Post subject: Re: maybe weird problem with instrument cluster, ?1973 kombi bay |
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Starbucket wrote: |
Are you getting 12 volts when grounding the meter to the cluster? |
starting to get some where, found a globe with a couple meg of resistance , a faulty light socket as well. will update when i work out more. |
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NASkeet Samba Member
Joined: April 29, 2006 Posts: 2947 Location: South Benfleet, Essex, UK
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Posted: Thu May 26, 2022 12:11 pm Post subject: Re: maybe weird problem with instrument cluster, ?1973 kombi bay |
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turbo1600 wrote: |
yes its right hand drive. australian. |
In common with we British, the Australians, Kiwis (i.e. New Zealanders), South Africans and Rhodesians etc, drive on the correct side of the road (i.e. the left hand side).
telford dorr wrote: |
IIRC, the instrument panel is the same orientation, left or right drive. |
If you closely examine the RHD and LHD 1968~79 VW Type 2 instrument panels, I think you will find that they are different. It's not simply a case of turning them up-side-down to orientate the heater & ventilation control-levers so they are close to the centrally-mounted hand-brake lever; noting the the depth of the oval instrument-housing at the top & bottom are different! _________________ Regards.
Nigel A. Skeet
Independent tutor (semi-retired) of mathematics, physics, technology & engineering for secondary, tertiary, further & higher education.
Much modified, RHD 1973 VW "1600" Type 2 Westfalia Continental campervan, with the World's only decent, cross-over-arm, SWF pantograph rear-window wiper
Onetime member, plus former Technical Editor & Editor of Transporter Talk magazine
Volkswagen Type 2 Owners' Club (Great Britain)
http://www.vwt2oc.net |
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orwell84 Samba Member
Joined: May 14, 2007 Posts: 2528 Location: Plattsburgh, New York
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Posted: Thu May 26, 2022 1:44 pm Post subject: Re: maybe weird problem with instrument cluster, ?1973 kombi bay |
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Instrument wiring gets rattled around, bulbs die, wires fall off., even when we’ll sorted. All kinds of strange and random things happen. |
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telford dorr Samba Member
Joined: March 11, 2009 Posts: 3547 Location: San Diego (Encinitas)
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Posted: Fri May 27, 2022 11:48 pm Post subject: Re: maybe weird problem with instrument cluster, ?1973 kombi bay |
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Quote: |
If you closely examine the RHD and LHD 1968~79 VW Type 2 instrument panels, I think you will find that they are different. It's not simply a case of turning them up-side-down to orientate the heater & ventilation control-levers so they are close to the centrally-mounted hand-brake lever; noting the the depth of the oval instrument-housing at the top & bottom are different! |
You are correct. Poor word choice on my part. I was thinking of the gauge / speedometer subassembly (the metal plate), not the whole panel. Sorry... _________________ '71 panel, now with FI
'Experience' is the ability to recognize a mistake when you're making it again - Franklin P. Jones
In theory, theory works in practice; in practice, it doesn't - William T. Harbaugh
When you're dead, you don't know you're dead. The pain is only felt by others.
Same thing happens when you're stupid. - Philippe Geluck
More VW electrical at http://telforddorr.com/ (available 9am to 9pm PST) |
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