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Ben Middleton
Samba Member
Joined: April 11, 2016
Posts: 219
Location: England, UK
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 Posted: Tue Jun 28, 2022 1:09 pm Post subject: Re: Horn wiring repair |
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Yes that's correct, I'm missing #13 and my bearing is the 74-79 variant. These are two definite differences but I don't know whether they're causing any issues. Where does the #13 seal fit on the column tube? At the bottom?
I wasn't getting 12v to the horn so I hooked up an auxiliary battery to test it. I took a wire from one terminal on the horn to the auxillary battery, left the other terminal connected to the bottom of the column tube and then grounded the battery to the body of the car. When I pressed the horn, it worked. I assumed, therefore, that the grounding down to the bottom of the column tube must be working correctly; but when I check the continuity between the column and the tube when the button is pressed, it doesn't register anything.
I have now repaired the wire to the positive terminal of the horn. I get 11v at the fuse box but this drops to about 10v at the horn. When I press the horn nothing happens.
😵💫 |
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mikewire
Samba Member
Joined: March 22, 2010
Posts: 805
Location: San Antonio, TX
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| Posted: Tue Jun 28, 2022 2:03 pm Post subject: Re: Horn wiring repair |
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| Ben Middleton wrote: |
Yes that's correct, I'm missing #13 and my bearing is the 74-79 variant. These are two definite differences but I don't know whether they're causing any issues. Where does the #13 seal fit on the column tube? At the bottom?
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Yes at the bottom of the column housing tube, you can see it in the Early Bay horn diagram posted. As long as you have the plastic clamping ring (#14), even without the seal, I think you may be OK...the seal simply keeps water and dust from coming up between the column housing and plastic ring. The plastic ring is what isolates the column housing from the rest of the bus, and that's the important part.
I'm not sure if the Late Bay bearing could be causing your issues, I'm struggling to come up with a reason why it would, so right now I would put that idea on hold, but keep it close.
I can say for certain that I have no 'plastic coated washers' on my support bracket, nothing to worry about there.
| Ben Middleton wrote: |
I wasn't getting 12v to the horn so I hooked up an auxiliary battery to test it. I took a wire from one terminal on the horn to the auxillary battery, left the other terminal connected to the bottom of the column tube and then grounded the battery to the body of the car. When I pressed the horn, it worked. I assumed, therefore, that the grounding down to the bottom of the column tube must be working correctly; but when I check the continuity between the column and the tube when the button is pressed, it doesn't register anything.
I have now repaired the wire to the positive terminal of the horn. I get 11v at the fuse box but this drops to about 10v at the horn. When I press the horn nothing happens.
😵💫 |
Ok good test, nice method of procedure, I think you are on to something there.
So, help me understand where you are at here by checking this...with the ignition ON (not starting or running), unplug the connectors on the horn, do you have 12v(ish) to the connectors? If you do (and you should, that is normal) then there's some things to check. if not, then there's other things to check.
Most of this has been stated already, just a different approach.
Anyway if you do have 12v, then I would work from the horn up the column. Work from the horn, one of the wires is going to go up into the area under the column and attach to the tab at the bottom of the column housing. It's hard to see with the steering junction in the way, but it should look like the picture previously posted:
If that looks good, then go up to the steering wheel. You mentioned you have the Late Bay bearing...do you have the spring and supporting ring?
_________________
-Mike
@countdowngarage
@bigskyeuro
1972 VW Kombi 9 Passenger Deluxe w/ 2.0L F.I. VWAC swap
1965 VW Beetle Deluxe Bahama Blue |
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Ben Middleton
Samba Member
Joined: April 11, 2016
Posts: 219
Location: England, UK
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| Posted: Wed Jun 29, 2022 2:02 am Post subject: Re: Horn wiring repair |
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Thanks for all the help! I do get power to the terminals with the ignition on and the terminals disconnected (only the one though, the other is given power once they are connected). I'm getting about 10v.
I have fitted the wire beneath the cover exactly as it is in that photo, minus the rubber piece.
I do have the supporting ring and the spring.
My steering column did have some surface rust on it, all the way up. Maybe this is causing the earthing connection to fail? |
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mikewire
Samba Member
Joined: March 22, 2010
Posts: 805
Location: San Antonio, TX
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| Posted: Wed Jun 29, 2022 7:55 am Post subject: Re: Horn wiring repair |
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| Ben Middleton wrote: |
Thanks for all the help! I do get power to the terminals with the ignition on and the terminals disconnected (only the one though, the other is given power once they are connected). I'm getting about 10v.
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Nice - your battery is probably just low, you'll want to get it on a charger. You should be seeing 12.x volts with a fully charged battery.
| Ben Middleton wrote: |
I have fitted the wire beneath the cover exactly as it is in that photo, minus the rubber piece.
I do have the supporting ring and the spring.
My steering column did have some surface rust on it, all the way up. Maybe this is causing the earthing connection to fail? |
If all is in place and there's no ground short on that side, then that part of the circuit is probably fine. The only variable here is the late Bay bearing, it needs to make contact with the base of the shaft housing, and contact the ring and spring, then those contact the underside of the steering wheel.
And surface rust won't matter, the entire piece of metal is conductive.
At this point, if you take the wire coming up and out of the middle of the steering shaft and touch the connector to any bare metal spot, like the steering wheel nut, the horn should sound. If it doesn't then there's an issue with that wire going down the shaft and connecting to the bolt on the steering box.
@Ben - this is an old thread started by another user...and we're going back and forth troubleshooting...if you still have issues after this, it would be courteous and best practice to start a new thread (referencing this thread) for your specific issue. You may get more and better help as well. 
_________________
-Mike
@countdowngarage
@bigskyeuro
1972 VW Kombi 9 Passenger Deluxe w/ 2.0L F.I. VWAC swap
1965 VW Beetle Deluxe Bahama Blue |
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onehappykombi
Samba Member
Joined: March 26, 2017
Posts: 150
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| Posted: Sun Jun 04, 2023 5:58 pm Post subject: Re: Horn Early Repair |
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[quote="Tcash"]68-74 VIN 214 2 164060
the beloved horn ground wire tab
| 70Crew wrote: |
There are 2 wires you need to connect on the steering column. The bottom end of this wire has a large loop wire terminal that fits around one of the 4 hex head M8 bolts that connect the steering column to the coupling disk and top of the gear box. There is a small gap (D) between the coupling disk and top of the gearbox which allows you to feed that wire (E) from the column and around the corner to one of the hex head bolts (F). I attached it on the bottom, under a nut, so that the contact was metal to metal rather than nut to rubber. I’m not 100% sure that is how it was done from the factory but it makes sense to me (anyone out there know better?).
Bentley says you are supposed to install the column tube first and then the steering column from underneath. That was not possible without a lift so I installed the entire assembly from the top. I did it alone and the only part that was remotely difficult was attaching the aforementioned column tube ground wire.
Good luck and holler if you have any questions.
Chris
(MiOdy81) |
Is it possible to remove that M8 nut to replace the ring terminal ? (Shown as F)
Is it possible to do it with the steering box in place ?
Thank you
_________________
'56 Early Split & '69 Early Bay
Overlanding the USA
Camper special engine build |
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busdaddy
Samba Member
Joined: February 12, 2004
Posts: 51113
Location: Surrey B.C. Canada, but thinking of Ukraine
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| Posted: Sun Jun 04, 2023 6:14 pm Post subject: Re: Horn Early Repair |
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| onehappykombi wrote: |
Is it possible to remove that M8 nut to replace the ring terminal ? (Shown as F)
Is it possible to do it with the steering box in place ? |
Shouldn't be a problem, there's enough room to get a wrench on the head from below, the nut and pin are on the lower side so not out of reach.
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