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Crooked Designer
Samba Member
Joined: March 22, 2018
Posts: 323
Location: Chicago, IL
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 Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2022 1:56 pm Post subject: Where does blue D+ signal wire under drivers seat attach? |
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Blue D+ signal wire that runs the relay for the fridge on stock westy. PO disconnected it behind the dash. Wondering where to reconnect it.
The sleeve has the red wire with black tracer, the thicker red wire and the blue wire. Both of the other wires are still connected. The blue is coiled up and taped off. Assuming this is for the alternator warning light but could be wrong.
Note I have a Subaru conversion in a 1985 westy. I’ve read this matters. Trying to use it as the D+ trigger wire to turn on DC to DC charger under drivers seat, so if you have a better 12v+ source behind the dash fuse panel that is only on with the engine, I could jump off of that. TIA!
Forgot the photo:
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'85 Westy full camper, Subaru 2.5L, 5 speed SubiGears + 5speedbus shifter kit
Last edited by Crooked Designer on Sat Jul 02, 2022 12:23 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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skills@eurocarsplus
Samba Peckerhead
Joined: January 01, 2007
Posts: 16883
Location: sticksville, ct.
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| Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2022 8:13 pm Post subject: Re: Where does blue D+ signal wire under drivers seat attach? |
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the alternator wire for the fridge relay is in it's own sheathing, which you found. the blue clipped wire should have been a part of a 2 or 3 way junction as i recall
in order to get that relay under the seat to work and not cause your alt light to be on you need to attach that wire to a load reduction circuit. the subaru alternator doesn't have the 'sack' to power up that relay
load reduction circuits are typically black wires with a yellow tracer, but double check the wiring diagrams to be sure
_________________
| gprudenciop wrote: |
my reason for switching to subaru is my german car was turning chinese so i said fuck it and went japanese....... |
| Jake Raby wrote: |
| Thanks for the correction. I used to be a nice guy, then I ruined it by exposing myself to the public. |
| Brian wrote: |
| Also the fact that people are agreeing with Skills, it's a turn of events for samba history |
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Crooked Designer
Samba Member
Joined: March 22, 2018
Posts: 323
Location: Chicago, IL
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| Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2022 9:05 pm Post subject: Re: Where does blue D+ signal wire under drivers seat attach? |
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| skills@eurocarsplus wrote: |
the alternator wire for the fridge relay is in it's own sheathing, which you found. the blue clipped wire should have been a part of a 2 or 3 way junction as i recall
in order to get that relay under the seat to work and not cause your alt light to be on you need to attach that wire to a load reduction circuit. the subaru alternator doesn't have the 'sack' to power up that relay
load reduction circuits are typically black wires with a yellow tracer, but double check the wiring diagrams to be sure |
Thanks for the reply. Don’t need the relay to work. That is long gone as I have a truck fridge and have rewired the entire house battery system from scratch. I need that wire to turn on the Renogy DC to DC charger that is now under the drivers seat. I actually have it wired to the blue wire now but it wasn’t turning on when the engine was on so I traced the blue wire (in its sheathing with the other two wires) under the carpet and up behind the dash between the gear shift and the gas pedal. From there it takes a left and goes behind the steering column and the thick red power wire goes into the fuse panel. The thin red wire with the black tracer goes up behind the dash (instrument cluster maybe?) and the blue wire goes to a female spade connector that is not connected. Wondering how to restore 12v to this wire when engine is on and 0 when off. Hope that makes sense. Just need it to turn on DC charger.
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'85 Westy full camper, Subaru 2.5L, 5 speed SubiGears + 5speedbus shifter kit |
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skills@eurocarsplus
Samba Peckerhead
Joined: January 01, 2007
Posts: 16883
Location: sticksville, ct.
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| Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2022 10:01 pm Post subject: Re: Where does blue D+ signal wire under drivers seat attach? |
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| Crooked Designer wrote: |
| Wondering how to restore 12v to this wire when engine is on and 0 when off. Hope that makes sense. Just need it to turn on DC charger. |
i understand that and should have been more clear
you need to tap in whatever you're trying to hook up into a load reduction circuit because the subaru alternator won't do this unless you get creative.
the load reduction circuit has power with the key on, no power when cranking and power returns when you drop the key back to the run position
the load reduction circuit only has power when the key is on/running
_________________
| gprudenciop wrote: |
my reason for switching to subaru is my german car was turning chinese so i said fuck it and went japanese....... |
| Jake Raby wrote: |
| Thanks for the correction. I used to be a nice guy, then I ruined it by exposing myself to the public. |
| Brian wrote: |
| Also the fact that people are agreeing with Skills, it's a turn of events for samba history |
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ALIKA T3
Samba Member
Joined: July 30, 2009
Posts: 6360
Location: Honolulu,Hawaii and France
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| Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2022 11:14 pm Post subject: Re: Where does blue D+ signal wire under drivers seat attach? |
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He needs the "blue" wire to be used, it tells the engine is running to the DC-DC charger. I don't think there's a simple way around it. I don't think it needs a lot, maybe the Subaru alternator is not wired properly?
Designer: Find the loom that comes from the rear of the van, find the blue wire from it, and test its end.
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skills@eurocarsplus
Samba Peckerhead
Joined: January 01, 2007
Posts: 16883
Location: sticksville, ct.
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| Posted: Sat Jul 02, 2022 12:04 am Post subject: Re: Where does blue D+ signal wire under drivers seat attach? |
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| ALIKA T3 wrote: |
| He needs the "blue" wire to be used. |
i get that. he can simply reconnect it where it was clipped under the dash. that will bring the other end that is under the seat to life however i don't think the subaru alternator is going to play nice
the reason to clip this wire is the signal isn't strong enough to close the STOCK relay for the fridge and the ALT light stays on so everyone taps into the X circuit
i'm not sure what he's trying to do or how whatever it is he's doing is supposed to work but when doing subaru's in buses with a 'house' battery the battery isolation relay would get hooked to the X circuit.
yes, the isolation relay would 'come on/close' or whatever you want to call it for a split second but would drop out while cranking (like the X circuit is supposed to do) then come back on line when you have the engine running/drop the key from start to run position
if he needs to simply "turn on" this unit with the key the load reduction circuit will do this and take it out of the loop while cranking the starter. once you stop using the starter and let the key snap back to run power will be supplied to the unit he's trying to power up
_________________
| gprudenciop wrote: |
my reason for switching to subaru is my german car was turning chinese so i said fuck it and went japanese....... |
| Jake Raby wrote: |
| Thanks for the correction. I used to be a nice guy, then I ruined it by exposing myself to the public. |
| Brian wrote: |
| Also the fact that people are agreeing with Skills, it's a turn of events for samba history |
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Crooked Designer
Samba Member
Joined: March 22, 2018
Posts: 323
Location: Chicago, IL
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| Posted: Sat Jul 02, 2022 1:06 am Post subject: Re: Where does blue D+ signal wire under drivers seat attach? |
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| ALIKA T3 wrote: |
| Designer: Find the loom that comes from the rear of the van, find the blue wire from it, and test its end. |
That was my initial question. But Skills is saying that the blue wire even when reconnected in initial config won’t work well to run DC charger. I have read this about Subaru alternator wires and the alt light never going out. Probably why it is disconnected in the first place.
Skills: where can I tap into the load reduction circuit? ‘85s have the old style dash fuse panel. Ideally I’d connect there (if possible) as it would just be connecting the blue wire to that circuit. Wondering which pin on the panel to use.
Also the way you described the load reduction circuit and x circuit were very similar. (Power on key on, pause for start/crank and then power on again with key in run) are these the same? I have my Bentley but am out of time to investigate as I’m supposed to drive Sunday and need Saturday to pack / prep.
Thanks for the help!
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'85 Westy full camper, Subaru 2.5L, 5 speed SubiGears + 5speedbus shifter kit |
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Crooked Designer
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Joined: March 22, 2018
Posts: 323
Location: Chicago, IL
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| Posted: Sat Jul 02, 2022 6:55 am Post subject: Re: Where does blue D+ signal wire under drivers seat attach? |
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I have an open spade at 10 which appears to be windshield wipers / blower. These only work when the van is on so maybe this is a good spot? Any downsides? I’m assuming the DC charger is using the 12v to operate an internal relay, so not expecting it to use a bunch of power.
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skills@eurocarsplus
Samba Peckerhead
Joined: January 01, 2007
Posts: 16883
Location: sticksville, ct.
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| Posted: Sat Jul 02, 2022 9:06 am Post subject: Re: Where does blue D+ signal wire under drivers seat attach? |
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you're on the right track
i wouldn't use the wiper/blower circuit. imho it's overloaded as it is.
when i connected my fridge relay i used the rear defrost circuit because if it blew a fuse, who really cares. the rear defrost is on a load reduction circuit
yes, X and load reduction are one in the same
make sure you tap power on the FUSED side of the circuit. if you don't and there is an issue you will cook that harness all the way to the dumpster.
if you use the unfused side, add an inline fuse as close to the fuse box as possible
_________________
| gprudenciop wrote: |
my reason for switching to subaru is my german car was turning chinese so i said fuck it and went japanese....... |
| Jake Raby wrote: |
| Thanks for the correction. I used to be a nice guy, then I ruined it by exposing myself to the public. |
| Brian wrote: |
| Also the fact that people are agreeing with Skills, it's a turn of events for samba history |
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leecat
Samba Member
Joined: September 13, 2012
Posts: 773
Location: Regina
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| Posted: Sat Jul 02, 2022 9:08 am Post subject: Re: Where does blue D+ signal wire under drivers seat attach? |
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What great timing for this thread! I have the exact same D+ connection question, only I still have the stock alternator - transplanted cabinets from an '85 into an '81.
Bentley gives you a handy "To Alternator, Terminal D+" notation on the '85 'Camper' heading (97.32b), without designating the 'T' wiring connector that it leads to.
While I can't answer to Subaru alternator oddities, I believe both Crooked and I want to hook to 'T4b' on the diagram below - but does the T1f connector exist on non-equipped-OXS vehicles? Seems that would be a great tie-in point if so. If not, I'm betting 'T4c' has space to accommodate the wire to 'T1f' and would also be a possible tie-in point?
Last edited by leecat on Sat Jul 02, 2022 11:00 am; edited 2 times in total |
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Crooked Designer
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Joined: March 22, 2018
Posts: 323
Location: Chicago, IL
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| Posted: Sat Jul 02, 2022 9:44 am Post subject: Re: Where does blue D+ signal wire under drivers seat attach? |
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| skills@eurocarsplus wrote: |
you're on the right track
i wouldn't use the wiper/blower circuit. imho it's overloaded as it is.
when i connected my fridge relay i used the rear defrost circuit because if it blew a fuse, who really cares. the rear defrost is on a load reduction circuit
yes, X and load reduction are one in the same
make sure you tap power on the FUSED side of the circuit. if you don't and there is an issue you will cook that harness all the way to the dumpster.
if you use the unfused side, add an inline fuse as close to the fuse box as possible |
Awesome. 13 is the rear defroster, correct? Which is the safe side? Bottom or top spade connectors?
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Crooked Designer
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Joined: March 22, 2018
Posts: 323
Location: Chicago, IL
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| Posted: Sat Jul 02, 2022 9:48 am Post subject: Re: Where does blue D+ signal wire under drivers seat attach? |
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| leecat wrote: |
Bentley gives you a handy "To Alternator, Terminal D+" notation on the '85 'Camper' heading (97.32b), without designating the 'T' wiring connector that it leads to.
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This exactly why I posted. Glad I’m not crazy. I’m going with the rear defroster circuit most likely on Skills suggestion, but definitely post what you find out on where it was originally supposed to connect as I’m sure others will want to know if Bentley is that vague.
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leecat
Samba Member
Joined: September 13, 2012
Posts: 773
Location: Regina
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| Posted: Sat Jul 02, 2022 10:49 am Post subject: Re: Where does blue D+ signal wire under drivers seat attach? |
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I think I'll go the Skills route too (Thanks, Skills!) - I believe I'm thinking too much 'blue wire has to be dedicated alternator circuit' instead of 'just pick up switched fused power somewhere'. I'm going to test fuse 15 (Aux heater) and use that if it's live-switched, as my aux heater is removed.
I took pics of how the original '85 van was wired for it, but it was such a godawful MacGyver mess of PO wiring, 14/2 house wire, electrical tape and marrettes that nothing could be trusted.
Last edited by leecat on Sat Jul 02, 2022 11:00 am; edited 2 times in total |
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Crooked Designer
Samba Member
Joined: March 22, 2018
Posts: 323
Location: Chicago, IL
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| Posted: Sat Jul 02, 2022 10:57 am Post subject: Re: Where does blue D+ signal wire under drivers seat attach? |
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Here’s what I did. Circuit 13 with inline fuse. Blue wire goes only to DC charger under drivers seat. Works like a champ.
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leecat
Samba Member
Joined: September 13, 2012
Posts: 773
Location: Regina
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| Posted: Sat Jul 02, 2022 10:58 am Post subject: Re: Where does blue D+ signal wire under drivers seat attach? |
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| Nice! Thank you for posting this thread. |
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skills@eurocarsplus
Samba Peckerhead
Joined: January 01, 2007
Posts: 16883
Location: sticksville, ct.
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| Posted: Sat Jul 02, 2022 11:11 am Post subject: Re: Where does blue D+ signal wire under drivers seat attach? |
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| Crooked Designer wrote: |
| Which is the safe side? Bottom or top spade connectors? |
for this circuit you need to turn the key on. remove fuse. the side with power key on is the UN fused side. you tap into the side that has NO power with the fuse removed, that is the fused side
i can't speak to non campers but the connector for the alt wire 'branching point' was kind of buried as i recall, and a pain to find
_________________
| gprudenciop wrote: |
my reason for switching to subaru is my german car was turning chinese so i said fuck it and went japanese....... |
| Jake Raby wrote: |
| Thanks for the correction. I used to be a nice guy, then I ruined it by exposing myself to the public. |
| Brian wrote: |
| Also the fact that people are agreeing with Skills, it's a turn of events for samba history |
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ALIKA T3
Samba Member
Joined: July 30, 2009
Posts: 6360
Location: Honolulu,Hawaii and France
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| Posted: Sat Jul 02, 2022 11:54 am Post subject: Re: Where does blue D+ signal wire under drivers seat attach? |
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I had to fix a lot of burnt mess on an 82 aircooled westy a couple months ago.
The loom that comes from the rear has the blue wire, find the loom.
Drop the fuse and relay panel to do so, and follow the blue wire that comes from the alternator and you'll find the connector. Ariane thread, simple.
Here's a pic from an old IG story I posted at the time:
On this picture, the wire comes from the left that I marked ALT. It has a single spade connector. Then it goes to the big connector. From there, it's piggy backed out to the Westfalia relay (now GW battery system: to the DC-DC charger), since it has its own separate harness, it will need a connector for that. The opposite side of the bigg back also has a blue one, it goes to the instrument cluster I recall.
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Silicone Steering Boots and 930 Cv boots for sale in the classifieds.
Syncro transmission upgrade parts in the Classifieds.
Subaru EJ22+UN1 5 speed transmission
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=416343
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leecat
Samba Member
Joined: September 13, 2012
Posts: 773
Location: Regina
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| Posted: Sat Jul 02, 2022 12:21 pm Post subject: Re: Where does blue D+ signal wire under drivers seat attach? |
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Thanks Alika!
I recognize the connector just above your index finger, so that 4-pin connector must be buried close by. I'll trace back from T14/13 at the cluster if I have to, looks like the one re: Bentley.
I think once more into the dash will make it about the lucky 100th time I've been in there. Woooooo! |
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ALIKA T3
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Joined: July 30, 2009
Posts: 6360
Location: Honolulu,Hawaii and France
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| Posted: Sat Jul 02, 2022 5:22 pm Post subject: Re: Where does blue D+ signal wire under drivers seat attach? |
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| leecat wrote: |
Thanks Alika!
I recognize the connector just above your index finger, so that 4-pin connector must be buried close by. I'll trace back from T14/13 at the cluster if I have to, looks like the one re: Bentley.
I think once more into the dash will make it about the lucky 100th time I've been in there. Woooooo! |
Keep in mind that's an 82, I don't recall seeing that crap on my 85, they prolly modified it a bit but the logic is the same: trace the wire starting from the loom.
_________________
Silicone Steering Boots and 930 Cv boots for sale in the classifieds.
Syncro transmission upgrade parts in the Classifieds.
Subaru EJ22+UN1 5 speed transmission
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=416343
Syncro http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=4...num+gadget |
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sdp65
Samba Member
Joined: March 07, 2002
Posts: 124
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| Posted: Sat Jul 02, 2022 9:03 pm Post subject: Re: Where does blue D+ signal wire under drivers seat attach? |
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| which dc/dc charger did you get? I have a renogy dc/dc hooked up to the starter battery/alternator and it uses the volts off the starter battery to connect/disconnect. I did not use the blue wire from the original aux bat relay under the drivers seat. |
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