| Author |
Message |
kiwipip
Samba Member
Joined: July 23, 2018
Posts: 76
Location: New Zealand
|
 Posted: Mon Nov 21, 2022 11:35 pm Post subject: Re: My 57 Dove Blue Kombi |
 |
|
| Dubskii wrote: |
Finishing touch with the rubber boots.
|
Where about did you get the rubber boots from ? |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
Dubskii
Samba Member
Joined: March 03, 2010
Posts: 385
Location: So Cal
|
| Posted: Tue Nov 22, 2022 4:58 pm Post subject: Re: 57 Kombi |
|
|
| cdennisg wrote: |
OK, the engine cranks over fine, but does not fire at all. 8 month old gas should still make fire. If it were 8 years old, that would be different.
Time to check for spark. My guess would be that the points have corroded a little and are not making proper contact. That, or the inside of the distributor cap is corroded and needs to be cleaned or replaced. These are simple things that cost nothing. |
Still won’t fire up. Dist cap, all wires to the coil are clean and I have an electronic ignition. Baffled…sometimes I turn the key and it only turns over once even with a new battery (voltmeter shows 12.5v). Also, tapped the bowl as suggested. Nothing.
_________________
69 Sunroof Deluxe - Montana Red/Cloud White (Sold)
57 Kombi - Dove Blue http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=648240
WTB Early Dove Blue Bus Driver's Side Door
WTB Joe Heishman VW Arlington, VA License Plate Frame or Other Memorabilia |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
cdennisg
Samba Member
Joined: November 02, 2004
Posts: 20275
Location: Sandpoint, ID
|
| Posted: Tue Nov 22, 2022 8:14 pm Post subject: Re: 57 Kombi |
|
|
| Dubskii wrote: |
| cdennisg wrote: |
OK, the engine cranks over fine, but does not fire at all. 8 month old gas should still make fire. If it were 8 years old, that would be different.
Time to check for spark. My guess would be that the points have corroded a little and are not making proper contact. That, or the inside of the distributor cap is corroded and needs to be cleaned or replaced. These are simple things that cost nothing. |
Still won’t fire up. Dist cap, all wires to the coil are clean and I have an electronic ignition. Baffled…sometimes I turn the key and it only turns over once even with a new battery (voltmeter shows 12.5v). Also, tapped the bowl as suggested. Nothing. |
OK, gotta back up again.
"turns over once". So the engine turns over once with the starter, then stops turning? Or it fires once, then nothing? Big difference.
_________________
nothing |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Dubskii
Samba Member
Joined: March 03, 2010
Posts: 385
Location: So Cal
|
| Posted: Tue Nov 22, 2022 10:15 pm Post subject: Re: 57 Kombi |
|
|
Sorry. It never fires. Sometimes it cranks and cranks and cranks and nothing. Sometimes it cranks once and nothing. Either scenario it seems like the new battery runs out of juice but when I check with a voltmeter I have 12+volts.
_________________
69 Sunroof Deluxe - Montana Red/Cloud White (Sold)
57 Kombi - Dove Blue http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=648240
WTB Early Dove Blue Bus Driver's Side Door
WTB Joe Heishman VW Arlington, VA License Plate Frame or Other Memorabilia |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
sub-hatchtim
Samba Member
Joined: September 19, 2006
Posts: 2610
Location: Phoenix AZ
|
| Posted: Tue Nov 22, 2022 11:33 pm Post subject: Re: My 57 Dove Blue Kombi |
|
|
| kiwipip wrote: |
| Dubskii wrote: |
Finishing touch with the rubber boots.
|
Where about did you get the rubber boots from ? |
WW has them
https://www.wolfsburgwest.com/cart/DetailsList.cfm?ID=111951195A
_________________
58' pg/sg silo fridge westy
58 Dove blue singlecab
76 911S |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
cdennisg
Samba Member
Joined: November 02, 2004
Posts: 20275
Location: Sandpoint, ID
|
| Posted: Wed Nov 23, 2022 7:32 pm Post subject: Re: 57 Kombi |
|
|
| Dubskii wrote: |
| Sorry. It never fires. Sometimes it cranks and cranks and cranks and nothing. Sometimes it cranks once and nothing. Either scenario it seems like the new battery runs out of juice but when I check with a voltmeter I have 12+volts. |
12 volts at the battery? What about at the coil (key on)? Also at the starter while hitting the key? Something ain't right. I am predicting a bad ignition switch. Could be wrong.
_________________
nothing |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Dubskii
Samba Member
Joined: March 03, 2010
Posts: 385
Location: So Cal
|
| Posted: Sat Nov 26, 2022 10:10 am Post subject: Re: 57 Kombi |
|
|
| cdennisg wrote: |
| Dubskii wrote: |
| Sorry. It never fires. Sometimes it cranks and cranks and cranks and nothing. Sometimes it cranks once and nothing. Either scenario it seems like the new battery runs out of juice but when I check with a voltmeter I have 12+volts. |
12 volts at the battery? What about at the coil (key on)? Also at the starter while hitting the key? Something ain't right. I am predicting a bad ignition switch. Could be wrong. |
12.4V at the battery, 10.4V at the coil (key on), grounding straps clean, dist. cap clean, I have an electronic ignition and a hard start relay kit to boot. I am stumped...
_________________
69 Sunroof Deluxe - Montana Red/Cloud White (Sold)
57 Kombi - Dove Blue http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=648240
WTB Early Dove Blue Bus Driver's Side Door
WTB Joe Heishman VW Arlington, VA License Plate Frame or Other Memorabilia |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
cdennisg
Samba Member
Joined: November 02, 2004
Posts: 20275
Location: Sandpoint, ID
|
| Posted: Sat Nov 26, 2022 10:26 am Post subject: Re: 57 Kombi |
|
|
| Dubskii wrote: |
| cdennisg wrote: |
| Dubskii wrote: |
| Sorry. It never fires. Sometimes it cranks and cranks and cranks and nothing. Sometimes it cranks once and nothing. Either scenario it seems like the new battery runs out of juice but when I check with a voltmeter I have 12+volts. |
12 volts at the battery? What about at the coil (key on)? Also at the starter while hitting the key? Something ain't right. I am predicting a bad ignition switch. Could be wrong. |
12.4V at the battery, 10.4V at the coil (key on), grounding straps clean, dist. cap clean, I have an electronic ignition and a hard start relay kit to boot. I am stumped... |
That coil voltage may be too low to fire the electronic ignition. Did you test the coil voltage while cranking the engine? Gotta have a helper for that one.
Electronic ignition may have failed, too. Have you checked for spark at the coil wire or a plug wire while cranking? I have had those units fail on me twice, while on road trips. Glad I had a few sets of points with me.
_________________
nothing |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Dubskii
Samba Member
Joined: March 03, 2010
Posts: 385
Location: So Cal
|
| Posted: Sat Nov 26, 2022 3:47 pm Post subject: Re: 57 Kombi |
|
|
| cdennisg wrote: |
| Dubskii wrote: |
| cdennisg wrote: |
| Dubskii wrote: |
| Sorry. It never fires. Sometimes it cranks and cranks and cranks and nothing. Sometimes it cranks once and nothing. Either scenario it seems like the new battery runs out of juice but when I check with a voltmeter I have 12+volts. |
12 volts at the battery? What about at the coil (key on)? Also at the starter while hitting the key? Something ain't right. I am predicting a bad ignition switch. Could be wrong. |
12.4V at the battery, 10.4V at the coil (key on), grounding straps clean, dist. cap clean, I have an electronic ignition and a hard start relay kit to boot. I am stumped... |
That coil voltage may be too low to fire the electronic ignition. Did you test the coil voltage while cranking the engine? Gotta have a helper for that one.
Electronic ignition may have failed, too. Have you checked for spark at the coil wire or a plug wire while cranking? I have had those units fail on me twice, while on road trips. Glad I had a few sets of points with me. |
7.7V at coil while cranking. No spark at the cool wire. Must be elect ignition. Do those have a habit of just not working one day?
_________________
69 Sunroof Deluxe - Montana Red/Cloud White (Sold)
57 Kombi - Dove Blue http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=648240
WTB Early Dove Blue Bus Driver's Side Door
WTB Joe Heishman VW Arlington, VA License Plate Frame or Other Memorabilia |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
cdennisg
Samba Member
Joined: November 02, 2004
Posts: 20275
Location: Sandpoint, ID
|
| Posted: Sat Nov 26, 2022 7:20 pm Post subject: Re: 57 Kombi |
|
|
| Dubskii wrote: |
| Must be elect ignition. Do those have a habit of just not working one day? |
Yes. Yes they do. Install a set of points and a condenser. If you wanna put a new electronic setup in there, always keep a set of points in the bus, and the tools to swap 'em in.
_________________
nothing |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
BarryL 
Samba Member
Joined: November 01, 2004
Posts: 14266
Location: Casa de Oro, California
|
| Posted: Sun Nov 27, 2022 6:52 pm Post subject: Re: 57 Kombi |
|
|
| Dubskii wrote: |
| 7.7V at coil while cranking. |
Which side of the coil did you check?
Try a jumper wire from the battery + to the coil + then crank it. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
cdennisg
Samba Member
Joined: November 02, 2004
Posts: 20275
Location: Sandpoint, ID
|
| Posted: Sun Nov 27, 2022 7:50 pm Post subject: Re: 57 Kombi |
|
|
| BarryL wrote: |
| Dubskii wrote: |
| 7.7V at coil while cranking. |
Which side of the coil did you check?
Try a jumper wire from the battery + to the coil + then crank it. |
This is a good point. just remember that when you jumper the coil, you cannot turn the engine off at the switch, gotta yank that wire off.
_________________
nothing |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Dubskii
Samba Member
Joined: March 03, 2010
Posts: 385
Location: So Cal
|
| Posted: Fri Dec 23, 2022 11:54 am Post subject: Re: 57 Kombi |
|
|
Gas in tank.
New battery.
New coil.
Spark at the distributor.
Spark at the plugs.
Ignition switch is not corroded and connections tight.
Hard start relay fuse is good.
Bridged the battery + to the starter and it spun perfectly.
Jumped battery + to coil +.
I get one turn of the engine and that is it.
Had a neighbor hook up jumper cables and still only one turn of the engine.
At a loss...
_________________
69 Sunroof Deluxe - Montana Red/Cloud White (Sold)
57 Kombi - Dove Blue http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=648240
WTB Early Dove Blue Bus Driver's Side Door
WTB Joe Heishman VW Arlington, VA License Plate Frame or Other Memorabilia |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
cdennisg
Samba Member
Joined: November 02, 2004
Posts: 20275
Location: Sandpoint, ID
|
| Posted: Fri Dec 23, 2022 12:29 pm Post subject: Re: 57 Kombi |
|
|
| Dubskii wrote: |
Gas in tank.
New battery.
New coil.
Spark at the distributor.
Spark at the plugs.
Ignition switch is not corroded and connections tight.
Hard start relay fuse is good.
Bridged the battery + to the starter and it spun perfectly.
Jumped battery + to coil +.
I get one turn of the engine and that is it.
Had a neighbor hook up jumper cables and still only one turn of the engine.
At a loss... |
Something is amiss in the starter circuit. You mention the hard start relay FUSE, but what about that relay? Does it click when you are getting no crank? It is a cheap and easy thing to replace.
EDIT: just a thought, try pulling the spark plugs to see if the engine spins freely with no compression. If not, definitely a starter issue or the engine rotating assembly is binding up somehow. If so, it points directly at a starting circuit issue.
_________________
nothing
Last edited by cdennisg on Fri Dec 23, 2022 4:54 pm; edited 1 time in total |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Emeraldlion
Samba Member
Joined: April 13, 2005
Posts: 743
Location: Texarkana, TX
|
| Posted: Fri Dec 23, 2022 4:47 pm Post subject: Re: 57 Kombi |
|
|
Have you tried shooting starter fluid down the carb throat while cranking? Are you sure your float bowl is full? I had a situation where my float bowl was nearly dry and my pump wasn't primed(had run dry). Didn't have any extra gas to fill bowl so had to keep engine running on the starter fluid briefly until the engine pulled enough vacuum to fill the float bowl.
_________________
1967 Sunroof Beetle: tourist pass car
1961 SWR Kombi |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
cdennisg
Samba Member
Joined: November 02, 2004
Posts: 20275
Location: Sandpoint, ID
|
| Posted: Fri Dec 23, 2022 4:51 pm Post subject: Re: 57 Kombi |
|
|
| Emeraldlion wrote: |
| Have you tried shooting starter fluid down the carb throat while cranking? Are you sure your float bowl is full? I had a situation where my float bowl was nearly dry and my pump wasn't primed(had run dry). Didn't have any extra gas to fill bowl so had to keep engine running on the starter fluid briefly until the engine pulled enough vacuum to fill the float bowl. |
If the starter isn't spinning the engine, no amount of starter fluid will help.
_________________
nothing |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Emeraldlion
Samba Member
Joined: April 13, 2005
Posts: 743
Location: Texarkana, TX
|
| Posted: Fri Dec 23, 2022 7:43 pm Post subject: Re: 57 Kombi |
|
|
Ok sorry you hadn't been very clear about that. One place I thought you said it did crank. In your last post you said one turn of the engine, which is hard to distinguish whether you mean crank or firing. If you can only get one crank and nothing else then you don't even need to look at spark or fuel or air.
If you take the starter off see if it spins freely with power. If it does then the starter gear and flywheel are binding or your engine has partially seized or too tight.
Edit: read that last post again, when you said you bridges the battery and it spun perfectly do you mean the engine cranked over and over fine without issue?
_________________
1967 Sunroof Beetle: tourist pass car
1961 SWR Kombi |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
BarryL
Samba Member
Joined: November 01, 2004
Posts: 14266
Location: Casa de Oro, California
|
| Posted: Sat Dec 24, 2022 6:55 pm Post subject: Re: 57 Kombi |
|
|
| If you turn the engine using a wrench on the pulley nut what happens? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Dubskii
Samba Member
Joined: March 03, 2010
Posts: 385
Location: So Cal
|
| Posted: Sun Dec 25, 2022 9:53 am Post subject: Re: 57 Kombi |
|
|
| BarryL wrote: |
| If you turn the engine using a wrench on the pulley nut what happens? |
The engine spins freely when doing the above.
As for the relay...I ordered a new and should receive in the next day or two. Will update once that is checked off.
_________________
69 Sunroof Deluxe - Montana Red/Cloud White (Sold)
57 Kombi - Dove Blue http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=648240
WTB Early Dove Blue Bus Driver's Side Door
WTB Joe Heishman VW Arlington, VA License Plate Frame or Other Memorabilia |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
cdennisg
Samba Member
Joined: November 02, 2004
Posts: 20275
Location: Sandpoint, ID
|
| Posted: Sun Dec 25, 2022 12:25 pm Post subject: Re: 57 Kombi |
|
|
| Dubskii wrote: |
| BarryL wrote: |
| If you turn the engine using a wrench on the pulley nut what happens? |
The engine spins freely when doing the above.
As for the relay...I ordered a new and should receive in the next day or two. Will update once that is checked off. |
Other than days like today, that relay is readily available at any local parts place. Probably under fifteen bucks, too.
_________________
nothing |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
