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swirlmarks
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Joined: August 19, 2022
Posts: 2
Location: NC
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 Posted: Wed Dec 07, 2022 6:47 pm Post subject: 1995 Eurovan Cruise Control Diagnosis Tutorial |
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I found a test procedure for diagnosing issues with the Eurovan's cruise control (CC), but it seems to be for later models with the 12 pin connector. My 1995 Eurovan has the 9 pin connector and I was able to modify the directions from the above test procedure to work on my van (with a lot of trial and error). Hopefully this helps some other folks out:
First of all, chances are that if your CC isn't working on your Eurovan (or T4), there may be a vacuum leak. You can try to follow the instructions in the Bentley manual to check for a vacuum leak, however this didn't work for me. I think the more effective way is to use jumper wires to activate the vacuum pump to draw vacuum on the system. Instructions for this are in step #6 of the tutorial.
If you do find a vacuum leak, it may be that your vacuum lines, vacuum pump seals, throttle diaphragm, or your brake and/or clutch vent valves. From my research, it seems like the vacuum line to the engine bay or pump are more common to fail, especially if your van is from a particularly dry climate.
If you need a vacuum pump, search the Hella part # instead of the VW part # on the bottom of the pump. These pumps were put on several cars in the 90s (Volvos, Jaguars, other VWs, etc), so chances are you'll be able to find something cheap on eBay.
The test for the cruise control (adapted from the linked tutorial) is as follows:
Supplies:
-Multimeter with 12V DC setting
-3 jumper wires with spade ends (one of the spade ends will need to be cut to a narrow triangular shape to fit in to the small black connector with the blu/grn wire).
-Screwdriver (to remove glove box)
-10mm wrench (for removing CC Module bracket if needed)
Remove glove box. Look under the dash where the glove box was and you will see a silver box (CC Module) with a 9 pin connector. Unplug connector (it may be easier to unbolt the bracket that the CC Module is attached to and then unplug). Next, you will be putting the multimeter probes on the connector terminals as follows:
1. On/off switch test - positive probe on blu/blk wire and negative probe on brown wire. - ignition on cruise control switch on - 12v.
2. Set button test - positive probe on red/yellow wire and negative probe on brown wire - ignition on - 12v when pushing the button.
3. Resume button test - positive probe on white wire and negative probe on brown wire - 12v when pushing resume button.
4. Brake pedal test - positive probe on brown wire and negative probe on blk/red wire - ignition on cruise control - 12v - depress brake pedal - no reading - letting go of brake the 12v reading re-appears. (Clutch pedal the same)
5. Speed reading device test (My speedo works, so I haven't tested this.) - raise l/front wheel - positive probe on blu/wht wire and negative probe on brown wire - turn wheel forward, voltage should alternate between 0-4 volts and high 7-12 volts. If the speedometer works you can skip this test.
6. Out of the same type of solid wire make three little jumpers. Put these jumpers in from the blu/grn wire to blu/blk wire, grn/wht wire to brown wire and brn/red wire to brown wire. you will be connecting/disconnecting the brn/red to brown jumper wire to activate/deactivate the CC vacuum pump, so try to make this easy to connect/disconnect. Now switch on the ignition switch and cruise control switch. Gas pedal will go to the floor when the vacuum pump goes on. Switch off the cruise control switch - the pedal must return slowly. Switch the cruise control back on and the gas pedal will go back down to the floor. Press the clutch and the gas must return from the floor. Press the brake and the gas must return from the floor, by releasing the clutch and/or the brake the gas must return to the floor. While it is all still running pull the jumper that is connecting red/brn wire to brown wire, the vacuum pump will stop, gas will remain on the floor - wait - gas should stay pressed to the floor. This indicates no vacuum leaks. By switching the cruise control switch off the gas will return from the floor, the brake and/or the clutch pedal will have the same effect, by replacing the jumper the vacuum pump will restart.
If your system is holding vacuum and the wiring/steering column switch/etc. work, the issue is likely the CC Module. The module can be rebuilt by Module Masters.
Anyway, hope that helps. If anyone has any tips for making this tutorial better, leave a comment and I will edit.
Last edited by swirlmarks on Wed Dec 07, 2022 6:53 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Saturn
Samba Member
Joined: April 06, 2019
Posts: 192
Location: San Francisco
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| Posted: Sat Dec 10, 2022 5:19 pm Post subject: Re: 1995 Eurovan Cruise Control Diagnosis Tutorial |
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| swirlmarks wrote: |
| If anyone has any tips for making this tutorial better, leave a comment and I will edit. |
First, thank you for putting this together and posting it on the forum. Looks to have been a fair amount of thinking and work in figuring in this out for the older model systems. Then you took the time to write it up and post it which is definitely another hurdle.
My Comments:
1) Add supporting photos or even wiring diagrams
These will help in putting context with the tutorial. Might also want to consider including part numbers if they are easily available.
2) Break point 6 up into more of a step format than narrative
#1-5 are set up as steps and #6 is a whole lot of information at once. Also, showing what the jumpers you made look like so there is an idea of what how long the wire should be. The description in the supplies section is good, this would augment it.
3) Testing the vacuum system
I have retrofitted pretty much the same CC system into my 1993 Volvo 240. When setting up the vacuum lines, I used a Mityvac hand pump to make sure the lines and components were not leaking. Needed to adjust one of the pedal switches correctly for the vacuum to hold. Also when the pump runs it does make noise so it is hard to located a leak when it is operating (my experience with my Volvo).
4) Vacuum pump
From the diagram in the Bentley Book, the vacuum pump does looks like the same one. (Volvo P/N 1273226) If you need one and frequent junkyards, these pumps on Volvo 240 (1989-1993) are mounted on the firewall next to the drivers side hood hinge and are easily accessible.
5) Pedal vent switches
Those look to be the same one found in late 240 Volvos as well. As pointed out above, if those are not adjusted correctly, then the system will not retain a vacuum.
Take these as suggestions, relating my experiences with working with and diagnosing cruise control systems.
Bentley Diagram
When I was replacing the heater core in my 1995 EVC, the silver CC module can be seen in the bottom right corner.
Creating a jumper wire to test the cooling system warning light
The vaccum pump in a Volvo 240
Testing the integrity of the vacuum lines in my Volvo 240
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swirlmarks
Samba Member
Joined: August 19, 2022
Posts: 2
Location: NC
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| Posted: Mon Dec 12, 2022 9:47 am Post subject: Re: 1995 Eurovan Cruise Control Diagnosis Tutorial |
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| Saturn wrote: |
| swirlmarks wrote: |
| If anyone has any tips for making this tutorial better, leave a comment and I will edit. |
My Comments:
1) Add supporting photos or even wiring diagrams
These will help in putting context with the tutorial. Might also want to consider including part numbers if they are easily available.
2) Break point 6 up into more of a step format than narrative
#1-5 are set up as steps and #6 is a whole lot of information at once. Also, showing what the jumpers you made look like so there is an idea of what how long the wire should be. The description in the supplies section is good, this would augment it.
3) Testing the vacuum system
I have retrofitted pretty much the same CC system into my 1993 Volvo 240. When setting up the vacuum lines, I used a Mityvac hand pump to make sure the lines and components were not leaking. Needed to adjust one of the pedal switches correctly for the vacuum to hold. Also when the pump runs it does make noise so it is hard to located a leak when it is operating (my experience with my Volvo).
4) Vacuum pump
From the diagram in the Bentley Book, the vacuum pump does looks like the same one. (Volvo P/N 1273226) If you need one and frequent junkyards, these pumps on Volvo 240 (1989-1993) are mounted on the firewall next to the drivers side hood hinge and are easily accessible.
5) Pedal vent switches
Those look to be the same one found in late 240 Volvos as well. As pointed out above, if those are not adjusted correctly, then the system will not retain a vacuum.
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Thank you for the tips and the additional info! Yes, I completely agree with you on all points. Stay tuned for V2 of the tutorial which will have better descriptions and some pictures. |
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eurovanpilot
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Joined: October 21, 2021
Posts: 26
Location: CA
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| Posted: Mon Dec 12, 2022 11:05 am Post subject: Re: 1995 Eurovan Cruise Control Diagnosis Tutorial |
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Wow nice! I don't know if mine works yet because I bought it needing some work. Glad to see you access the module without removing the dash even though I will need at some point to do some other work.
I wonder if changing out the original capacitors be helpful in the module. |
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Saturn
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Joined: April 06, 2019
Posts: 192
Location: San Francisco
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| Posted: Tue Oct 10, 2023 10:15 pm Post subject: Re: 1995 Eurovan Cruise Control Diagnosis Tutorial |
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Circling back on this thread, I just went through the diagnostic steps outlined in the first post. Turns out there were two issues with the Cruise Control set up in my 1993 Weekender. The first one was a broken wire in the stalk switch which would not allow power to the control module and the second was a misaligned switch on the clutch pedal. When discovering the issue with the stalk controls, temporarily retrofitted a set of stalk controls out of a Volvo 240 to get the CC opertational then was able to repair the broken wire. Specific details can be found in this posting: https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=10124151#10124151
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Smedley
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Joined: October 21, 2023
Posts: 3
Location: Boston
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| Posted: Sat Oct 21, 2023 5:13 pm Post subject: Re: 1995 Eurovan Cruise Control Diagnosis Tutorial |
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This is wonderful stuff!
Troubleshooting the CC in a 1997 EV Winnebago. But, I need to have advice on the most basic of things before I get into all this material: ;0
For the life of me I can't figure out which fuse is protecting the CC system. The fusebox description inside the cover doesn't mention it and I wonder if youse guys can enlighten me! Need to start at "the beginning"...
I went out on a limb and had the module rejuvenated at Module Master but I still got nothing for CC...
Thanks!
Jim |
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EuroTec
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Joined: August 24, 2020
Posts: 382
Location: Asheville, North Carolina
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| Posted: Sat Oct 21, 2023 7:34 pm Post subject: Re: 1995 Eurovan Cruise Control Diagnosis Tutorial |
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Good write up!
I'll add this bit of info.
My 2003 EV has the cruise control built into the ECU! There's not a separate module.
_________________
If it ain't broke, don't fix it! |
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fdajani
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Joined: December 27, 2008
Posts: 6
Location: Mechanicsville, VA.
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| Posted: Mon Oct 23, 2023 8:59 am Post subject: Re: 1995 Eurovan Cruise Control Diagnosis Tutorial |
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EuroTec, thanks for mentioning that the CC on your 2003 is built into the ECU. How did you discover or verify that?
I have a 2002 and I couldn't find the module anywhere, and neither could my local VW dealership, do you know if my 2002 CC is also built into the ECU?
Thanks. |
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Zeitgeist 13
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Joined: March 05, 2009
Posts: 12115
Location: Port Manteau
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| Posted: Mon Oct 23, 2023 4:14 pm Post subject: Re: 1995 Eurovan Cruise Control Diagnosis Tutorial |
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'01 - '03 are all built into the ECU because they are drive-by-wire engines, i.e. they don't have throttle cables. The previous cabled vans use a vacuum mechanical system similar to many VWs going back to the mid-'80s.
In Vanagons I've found that the problems could nearly always be attributed to the brake/clutch vacuum switches needing cleaning and lube.
_________________
Casey--
'89 Bluestar ALH w/12mm Waldo pump, PP764 and GT2052
'01 Weekender --> full camper
y u rune klassik? |
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Saturn
Samba Member
Joined: April 06, 2019
Posts: 192
Location: San Francisco
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| Posted: Mon Oct 23, 2023 5:31 pm Post subject: Re: 1995 Eurovan Cruise Control Diagnosis Tutorial |
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| Smedley wrote: |
I need to have advice on the most basic of things before I get into all this material: ;0
For the life of me I can't figure out which fuse is protecting the CC system. The fusebox description inside the cover doesn't mention it and I wonder if youse guys can enlighten me! Need to start at "the beginning"... |
After going through through the wiring diagrams in the Bentley book, the cruise control system were revised in the 1997 model year. According to the Bentley wiring diagram (X 452) power is supplied from the Transmission Control Module (TCM) into the cruise control. First it flows through the switch on the turn signal stalk (Pin #4, black wire.) When the system is turned on, power is then directed into the Cruise Control Module. From the notations in the 1997 wiring diagram, the CCM (J217) is located on the lower driver’s side A pillar right side of the dash by the vent and not in the passenger side as in the 1992-1996 vans. (Note: edited/updated this sentence as originally the wrong component in the wiring diagram was referenced.) Since this is named/referenced the same as the 1993 diagrams, I am interpreting the CCM as a stand-alone unit and not integrated into anything else. Caveat: my experience is primarily around the 1993 & 1995 Eurovans and not the VR6 models. This most likely correlates with the removal of the dash glove box from the 1997 and newer vans. Look in there for the silver box and then you can start the diagnostic process. Note: there are one or two wires with different colored insulation between the 1993 and 1997 models.
Reference documents:
https://just-t4s.co.uk/downloads/cruise%20con.pdf
My suggestion on starting the troubleshooting process:
1) Test for power going to CCM. With the stalk switch in the “On” position, check for power (12V or more with the ignition on) when connecting a multimeter to Pin/Terminal 1 (blue/black wire) and Pin 8 (brown wire)?
2) If no, test for power at connector going to the stalk switch (female connector side) Pin 4 (Black wire) and body ground. If there is still not any power, then the issue is still upstream, either the fuse is blown, bad wire or issue with the TCM
If yes, first check for continuity between #4 and #1 with the main switch in the “On” position.
(This is where my switch initially failed and needed to solder in a replacement wire.) Test the other two modes by pushing switch to “Set” and then the “Resume” button while moving the multimeter lead to pin #2 and #3 respectively.
3) When yes condition happens on the stalk switch, follow the procedure outlined in the first post of this thread to check the vacuum pump and pedal switches. When I went through this on my 1993 Weekender, this is when I found the clutch pedal switch failed the test. It was out of position and would not close the switch/circuit when the pedal was at rest.
While going through one of the cruise control wiring diagrams (Mitchell for 1993 Eurovan) figure it would be worthwhile to add some color to the wires and components. There are a few disparities between what I found while working on my 1993 and what is depicted in the color of the wiring. This is limited to the connector going into the CCM and I have put in a few notes on these deltas. One of the aspects of the automatic transmission vans (pre-1997) is 12V does not originate via the main fuse panel, but rather a separate fuse (S51) supplied from the Transmission Control Module (pin #38). The manual transmission vans utilize fuse #14 (S14) for power. The original source of the 1993 wiring diagram: https://just-t4s.co.uk/downloads/25989-wiring%20diag%202.pdf
Note: In VW/Bentley wiring diagrams, fuses are notated as Sxx. Fuse in German is "Sicherung" thus the S prefix.
.
Last edited by Saturn on Thu Nov 02, 2023 1:56 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Smedley
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Joined: October 21, 2023
Posts: 3
Location: Boston
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| Posted: Wed Nov 01, 2023 7:53 pm Post subject: Re: 1995 Eurovan Cruise Control Diagnosis Tutorial |
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Late reply but Thank You Saturn!
My CCM is in fact behind the right vent in my 1997 as I've taken it out of there and sent it to Module Masters and got it back and No Joy on the CC.
I've got to find that inline fuse S51 coming out of the TCM (got to find the TCM too...) as I don't believe I have juice at the CC switch.
The transmission seems fine.
Great leads you mentioned....Thanks again!
Smed |
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Saturn
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Joined: April 06, 2019
Posts: 192
Location: San Francisco
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| Posted: Thu Nov 02, 2023 6:00 pm Post subject: Re: 1995 Eurovan Cruise Control Diagnosis Tutorial |
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| Smedley wrote: |
Late reply but Thank You Saturn!
My CCM is in fact behind the right vent in my 1997 as I've taken it out of there and sent it to Module Masters and got it back and No Joy on the CC.
I've got to find that inline fuse S51 coming out of the TCM (got to find the TCM too...) as I don't believe I have juice at the CC switch.
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Just edited my previous post as I mistakenly referenced the CCM (J213) as being where the TCM (J217) sit near the drivers side a-pillar.
The S51 fuse is for the 1993-96 5-cylinder vans with automatic transmissions and not the VR6s. Included that image as an example of identifying a fuse on the wiring diagrams.
This is the wiring diagram for the 1997 set up:
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Smedley
Samba Member
Joined: October 21, 2023
Posts: 3
Location: Boston
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| Posted: Sat Nov 04, 2023 6:51 am Post subject: Re: 1995 Eurovan Cruise Control Diagnosis Tutorial |
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Thanks again Saturn!
From the looks of that 1997 wiring diagram there's NO fuse directly associated with the CC. Can that be?
It's warming up this weekend here in Boston. I'm gonna check for voltage in and around the CC switch and also sleuth out the brake switch and the vacuum switch pedal situation...
Smed |
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