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vamram Samba Member
Joined: March 08, 2012 Posts: 7300 Location: NOVA
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Posted: Mon Jan 23, 2023 5:47 pm Post subject: Re: 1974 vw beetle will not idle |
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I had an issue with the metal gaskets not sealing properly when I first ran the engine of my daily driver, back in April 2020. Perhaps the mating surface weren't completely flat between the new heads and old castings. I swapped to fiber ones and no problems since. _________________ Eventually, "we are what we pretend to be.’”
Give peace a chance - Stop Russian-Soviet Aggression!!
'74 Super 9/16 - present, in refurb process.
'73 Super - 6/18 - Present - Daily Driver!
'75 Super Le Grande...waiting it's turn in line behind '74.
Click to view image
Save the Supers!! |
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ashman40 Samba Member
Joined: February 16, 2007 Posts: 15982 Location: North Florida, USA
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Posted: Wed Jan 25, 2023 2:47 am Post subject: Re: 1974 vw beetle will not idle |
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Savannahgood12 wrote: |
So i just tried to do spark test again and noticed the wire coming from coil would only spark when you first try and crank the car over is this normal or should it send a constant spark while trying to crank the engine? |
Trying to understand what you are describing here? The spark from the ignition coil is never "constant". As the distributor rotates and the points close then open the coil will fire. So for each two rotations of the crank (720deg) the coil will fire 4x (one for each cylinder). As you crank the engine you should see pulses of sparks from the coil as the distributor rotates and the points open. If you hold the coil HT wire close to ground you should see 2 sparks for each rotation of the crank; 4 sparks for each rotation of the distributor.
A common problem is the coil voltage dropping while the starter is pulling current from the battery. If the voltage drops too low (below 10.0v) the coil may stop sparking all together. This can be a challenge to troubleshoot since all test while the engine is not cranking appear to work normally. Test the voltage at the ignition coil #15 to see what the voltage reading is with just the ignition ON and while the starter is cranking the engine. You should expect to see a voltage drop while the starter is cranking but nothing below 10.0v less you run the chance the coil stops sparking all together. This would not explain why only 2 cylinders were no sparking.
Savannahgood12 wrote: |
I also noticed I still have an air leak on the driver side were the intake connects to the head(the cold side) I read online if you have a bad enough air leak the spark will be weak and can cause them not to fire. I ordered new metal gaskets hopefully they will be here soon and that is my issue. |
This is a leak even after tightening the intake nuts at the head? How did you find the leak still exists if the cylinders on this side are not working/firing? If spraying the intake to head gasket with carb cleaner or starting fluid while idling makes a difference it answers the question of you having a very large leak that may be preventing the cylinders from firing. _________________ AshMan40
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'67 Beetle #1 {project car that never made it to the road }
'75 Beetle 1200LS (RHD Japan model) {junked due to frame rot}
'67 Beetle #2 {2019 project car - Wish me luck!} |
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Savannahgood12 Samba Member
Joined: January 21, 2023 Posts: 28 Location: Jacksonville
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Posted: Wed Jan 25, 2023 11:17 pm Post subject: Re: 1974 vw beetle will not idle |
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ashman40 wrote: |
Savannahgood12 wrote: |
So i just tried to do spark test again and noticed the wire coming from coil would only spark when you first try and crank the car over is this normal or should it send a constant spark while trying to crank the engine? |
Trying to understand what you are describing here? The spark from the ignition coil is never "constant". As the distributor rotates and the points close then open the coil will fire. So for each two rotations of the crank (720deg) the coil will fire 4x (one for each cylinder). As you crank the engine you should see pulses of sparks from the coil as the distributor rotates and the points open. If you hold the coil HT wire close to ground you should see 2 sparks for each rotation of the crank; 4 sparks for each rotation of the distributor.
A common problem is the coil voltage dropping while the starter is pulling current from the battery. If the voltage drops too low (below 10.0v) the coil may stop sparking all together. This can be a challenge to troubleshoot since all test while the engine is not cranking appear to work normally. Test the voltage at the ignition coil #15 to see what the voltage reading is with just the ignition ON and while the starter is cranking the engine. You should expect to see a voltage drop while the starter is cranking but nothing below 10.0v less you run the chance the coil stops sparking all together. This would not explain why only 2 cylinders were no sparking.
Savannahgood12 wrote: |
I also noticed I still have an air leak on the driver side were the intake connects to the head(the cold side) I read online if you have a bad enough air leak the spark will be weak and can cause them not to fire. I ordered new metal gaskets hopefully they will be here soon and that is my issue. |
This is a leak even after tightening the intake nuts at the head? How did you find the leak still exists if the cylinders on this side are not working/firing? If spraying the intake to head gasket with carb cleaner or starting fluid while idling makes a difference it answers the question of you having a very large leak that may be preventing the cylinders from firing. |
Yes after tightening the intake nuts I still have a leak . Tbh once I tighten them up the first time and the car started to idle again I didn’t check to see if the leak was still there as I assumed it was gone( I know stupid ). So once I read online that an air leak could possibly cause them not to fire I went back out to check and when I spray starter fluid around the intake on driver side (cold side ) the engine would rev up . I ordered new intake gaskets /boots and they will be here this weekend I also went ahead and pulled the engine since it’s pretty quick and from what I’ve been told a lot easier to replace the intake gasket with it out |
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Savannahgood12 Samba Member
Joined: January 21, 2023 Posts: 28 Location: Jacksonville
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Posted: Wed Jan 25, 2023 11:22 pm Post subject: Re: 1974 vw beetle will not idle |
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Here’s the pics I took after pulling it out today . I’m going to take all the Tin off clean and repaint them while I wait for gaskets to arrive |
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ashman40 Samba Member
Joined: February 16, 2007 Posts: 15982 Location: North Florida, USA
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Posted: Wed Jan 25, 2023 11:40 pm Post subject: Re: 1974 vw beetle will not idle |
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If you are planning to pull the head tin go ahead and torque all 8 cylinder head nuts on each side. Follow the torque sequence/pattern to evenly apply the torque. This should ensure there is no pressure leaking out between the cylinder and head sealing surfaces. _________________ AshMan40
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'67 Beetle #1 {project car that never made it to the road }
'75 Beetle 1200LS (RHD Japan model) {junked due to frame rot}
'67 Beetle #2 {2019 project car - Wish me luck!} |
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Savannahgood12 Samba Member
Joined: January 21, 2023 Posts: 28 Location: Jacksonville
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Posted: Thu Jan 26, 2023 12:25 am Post subject: Re: 1974 vw beetle will not idle |
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ashman40 wrote: |
If you are planning to pull the head tin go ahead and torque all 8 cylinder head nuts on each side. Follow the torque sequence/pattern to evenly apply the torque. This should ensure there is no pressure leaking out between the cylinder and head sealing surfaces. |
Will do that thanks |
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heimlich VWNOS.com
Joined: November 20, 2016 Posts: 6595 Location: Houston, Texas
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Posted: Thu Jan 26, 2023 8:28 am Post subject: Re: 1974 vw beetle will not idle |
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You can start the engine outside of the car. This will help you find all the issues before installing it. _________________ www.vwnos.com [email protected]
Classic Brands. Classic Quality.
Not all parts are made the same. NOS OE/OEM parts made mainly in West Germany, Early Germany, and Early Brazil are where VW produced the best quality parts and best fitting products.
5% Off your order with coupon code: 5%OFF
Restored Distributors Available (<--Click here) |
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Savannahgood12 Samba Member
Joined: January 21, 2023 Posts: 28 Location: Jacksonville
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Posted: Thu Jan 26, 2023 6:37 pm Post subject: Re: 1974 vw beetle will not idle |
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heimlich wrote: |
You can start the engine outside of the car. This will help you find all the issues before installing it. |
I need an extra transmission or bellhousing to do this right ? |
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heimlich VWNOS.com
Joined: November 20, 2016 Posts: 6595 Location: Houston, Texas
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Posted: Thu Jan 26, 2023 6:57 pm Post subject: Re: 1974 vw beetle will not idle |
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Savannahgood12 wrote: |
heimlich wrote: |
You can start the engine outside of the car. This will help you find all the issues before installing it. |
I need an extra transmission or bellhousing to do this right ? |
That would make it easier, yes. If you plan on owning your car a long time it would be good to have. _________________ www.vwnos.com [email protected]
Classic Brands. Classic Quality.
Not all parts are made the same. NOS OE/OEM parts made mainly in West Germany, Early Germany, and Early Brazil are where VW produced the best quality parts and best fitting products.
5% Off your order with coupon code: 5%OFF
Restored Distributors Available (<--Click here) |
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Savannahgood12 Samba Member
Joined: January 21, 2023 Posts: 28 Location: Jacksonville
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Posted: Thu Jan 26, 2023 11:30 pm Post subject: Re: 1974 vw beetle will not idle |
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heimlich wrote: |
Savannahgood12 wrote: |
heimlich wrote: |
You can start the engine outside of the car. This will help you find all the issues before installing it. |
I need an extra transmission or bellhousing to do this right ? |
That would make it easier, yes. If you plan on owning your car a long time it would be good to have. |
What’s the alternative if I don’t have an extra ? |
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ashman40 Samba Member
Joined: February 16, 2007 Posts: 15982 Location: North Florida, USA
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Savannahgood12 Samba Member
Joined: January 21, 2023 Posts: 28 Location: Jacksonville
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Posted: Mon Jan 30, 2023 4:05 pm Post subject: Re: 1974 vw beetle will not idle |
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Ok so I am finally back for an update. First i just want to thank everyone here who replied and tried helping me without you guys I would have been clueless. I replaced intanke manifold gaskets and rubber boots reinstalled engine back into car and BOOM what do you know shes firing on all 4 again
Never would have guessed an air leak could cause only half the engine to run . |
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Savannahgood12 Samba Member
Joined: January 21, 2023 Posts: 28 Location: Jacksonville
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Posted: Mon Jan 30, 2023 4:08 pm Post subject: Re: 1974 vw beetle will not idle |
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I almost forgot I also re torqued the cylinder heads so who knows that could have also fixed the problem. |
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Starbucket Samba Member
Joined: April 30, 2007 Posts: 4025 Location: WA
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Posted: Mon Jan 30, 2023 4:25 pm Post subject: Re: 1974 vw beetle will not idle |
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Savannahgood12 wrote: |
Ok so I am finally back for an update. First i just want to thank everyone here who replied and tried helping me without you guys I would have been clueless. I replaced intanke manifold gaskets and rubber boots reinstalled engine back into car and BOOM what do you know shes firing on all 4 again
Never would have guessed an air leak could cause only half the engine to run . |
Never would have guessed an air leak could cause only half the engine to run
.[/quote] Look at your intake, you have a pipe with the carb. in the middle of it, you have two cyl.s sucking on one end for the air/fuel and two sucking with a big air leak between them and the carb., which two do you think will get the fuel? So not so hard. |
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