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PITApan
Samba Member
Joined: November 09, 2014
Posts: 1058
Location: Northern Colorado
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 Posted: Tue Mar 03, 2015 4:07 pm Post subject: |
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| drakonis wrote: |
yeah bracket of course. pulley? cable? coupling nut? what are these for? the carbs?
i just installed a new throttle cable/solid wire a week ago. |
Thermostat bracket. Thermostat cable to connect to flap operating rod (you can fab one), coupling nut to connect cable to thermostat. Who you getting the 'stat from? Cable runs over a pulley bolted to the side of the block. Check your block, maybe it's there?
Last edited by PITApan on Tue Mar 03, 2015 4:09 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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PITApan
Samba Member
Joined: November 09, 2014
Posts: 1058
Location: Northern Colorado
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| Posted: Tue Mar 03, 2015 4:08 pm Post subject: |
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| is there some way to delete a post so when I screw one up...? |
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drakonis
Samba Member
Joined: June 15, 2012
Posts: 251
Location: Granite Falls, WA
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| Posted: Tue Mar 03, 2015 4:22 pm Post subject: |
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Powdercoat fab will sell me just the parts i need. ill be calling them tomorrow and making sure i get everything i need. i have the flaps and they work good. just need all the rest of the stuff. wifes gonna kill me when she sees how much im spending. well over a grand on all this stuff. aircooled alone is 1100 so far with all the needed parts. lol.
_________________
71 Bay. "ketchikan" |
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jtauxe 
Samba Member
Joined: September 30, 2004
Posts: 5780
Location: Los Alamos, New Mexico
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| Posted: Tue Mar 03, 2015 4:36 pm Post subject: |
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| PITApan wrote: |
| is there some way to delete a post so when I screw one up...? |
As long as you don't wait too long, yes, you can delete posts. Note that when you are logged in, you will see some extra buttons on the upper right of YOUR posts: edit, and X.
The X deletes the post.
_________________
John
"Travelling in a fried-out Kombi, on a hippie trail, head full of zombie..." - Colin Hay and Ron Strykert
http://vw.tauxe.net
1969 Transporter, 1971 Westfalia, 1976, 1977, 1976, 1977, 1971, 1973, 1977 Westfalias,
1979 Champagne Sunroof, 1974 Westfalia Automatic, 1979 Transporter, 1972 Sportsmobile, 1973 Transporter Wild Westerner, 1974 Westfalia parts bus, 1975 Mexican single cab *FOR SALE*, 1978 Irish 4-door double cab RHD
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Brian
Samba Moderator
Joined: May 28, 2012
Posts: 8340
Location: Oceanside
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| Posted: Tue Mar 03, 2015 4:40 pm Post subject: |
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| PITApan wrote: |
| is there some way to delete a post so when I screw one up...? |
Any mod can do it too.
_________________
Wash your hands
'69 Bug
'68 Baja Truck
'71 Bug
'68 Camper
Only losers litter |
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Tcash
Samba Member
Joined: July 20, 2011
Posts: 12844
Location: San Jose, California, USA
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| Posted: Tue Mar 03, 2015 5:10 pm Post subject: |
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| drakonis wrote: |
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so i got locked out of my original post. why i dont know. its not a general problem. Its my current problem that im trying to get answers from. well what ever. Ill consult somewhere else then. If i get locked out of my own post. not cool. |
PM Sent
Tcash |
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Tcash
Samba Member
Joined: July 20, 2011
Posts: 12844
Location: San Jose, California, USA
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| Posted: Tue Mar 03, 2015 6:03 pm Post subject: CHT Sticky |
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CHT Sticky is a good idea.
Let's look at the Stats?
CHT search results as, Topic title and message text. 26 pages at 50 post a page equals 1300 threads. To dig threw.
CHT search results as, Title only. 3 pages at 50 post a page equals 150 threads. To dig threw.
In both search results CHT Nirvana comes up as number one with 13 pages. Only next to, How hot is too hot? (Cylinder Head Temps) with 6 pages.
I would say this is a hot topic! 
Tcash |
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kkjellquist
Samba Member
Joined: June 04, 2013
Posts: 752
Location: Asheville, NC
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| Posted: Thu Apr 02, 2015 6:58 am Post subject: |
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Saw the following on a road trip this past weekend. Dakota Digital w/ basic #3 plug install.
On the way out, fully loaded, 2 adults, 1 kid, canoe, 3 bikes.....
4 gear, flat road...350-370...up hills creeping up towards 400 and I would back off.
One the way back, same load, but add steady 10-20 mphs.....yes, it sucked w/ a canoe on top.
Same gearing and roads and temps were a solid 10 degrees higher. Outside temp was probably 20 degrees higher.
Just curious if what I am thinking is correct. Wind resistance is the #1 force you are fighting on a flat road. So in a 20 mph head wind is it a direct conversion and the engine feels like it's going 20mph faster, or close to that?
_________________
1977 Sage Green Deluxe Campmobile - "Turtel"
(1978 2L FI, Pertronix, Hydraulic Lifters)
Turtel - http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=561195
Pisgah Bus Rally - New Year's Day
http://pisgahbusrally.blogspot.com/ |
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airschooled
Air-Schooled
Joined: April 04, 2012
Posts: 12721
Location: on a bike ride somewhere
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| Posted: Thu Apr 02, 2015 7:17 am Post subject: |
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Sort of. You're fighting a load. The engine doesn't care if it's a hill, headwind, camping gear, under inflated tires, or mother-in-law. It can't tell, and it won't hold a grudge against the last one either.
A load doesn't correlate well to going faster. If the engine were to speed up, the power produced, efficiency, and cooling would all change. So unless you have a dyno built in to your bus, we can only safely say the bus was working harder and therefore hotter.
You're temperature readings were also taken on the same road but backwards; a slight incline could have been giving you different numbers. I would not worry about it so much, unless you routinely start seeing higher numbers.
Outside temps usually show up on a gauge, but I've also had anomaly days where 100*+ outside didn't see 400*, and I've had 45* days show 410*. Load is much more of a player, I think.
I guess my point is, the title of this thread is "CHT Nirvana." I have found this elusive place, and it does not come from staring at a gauge. Why, 10* could be the difference in having your windows down vs. up! 
Robbie
_________________
Learn how your vintage VW works. And why it doesn't!
One-on-one tech help for your Volkswagen:
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kkjellquist
Samba Member
Joined: June 04, 2013
Posts: 752
Location: Asheville, NC
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| Posted: Thu Apr 02, 2015 7:32 am Post subject: |
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| asiab3 wrote: |
| I would not worry about it so much, unless you routinely start seeing higher numbers. |
Not too worried...just kind of confirming what I have learned about CHTs.
My wife, on the other hand, can't keep her eyes off the DD and seems convinced the bus will burst into flames at 405! Should have put the gauge by my left knee!
_________________
1977 Sage Green Deluxe Campmobile - "Turtel"
(1978 2L FI, Pertronix, Hydraulic Lifters)
Turtel - http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=561195
Pisgah Bus Rally - New Year's Day
http://pisgahbusrally.blogspot.com/ |
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eastfalia4now
Samba Member
Joined: June 18, 2013
Posts: 28
Location: Brookton Village, NY
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| Posted: Sun May 10, 2015 6:41 pm Post subject: |
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I installed an Auber SYL-2813 as a dual channel CHT gauge a few weeks back and am loving it so far.
This little guy really seems to fit the bill. Dual channel, hi/lo alarms, will trigger a relay at a temp you specify. It works with all the different thermocouple types. Can be used for oil pressure, CHT, EGT, Boost, etc. Oh, and it's cold junction compensated. All for about $87 shipped. My type J thermocouple wire cost $20 so that's dual CHT monitors for under 100 bucks. Not bad. Now if I could just do a decent job of mounting it...
Here's the link. http://www.auberins.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=5_21&products_id=357
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70turtle
Samba Member
Joined: May 18, 2012
Posts: 2
Location: Arizona
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Tcash
Samba Member
Joined: July 20, 2011
Posts: 12844
Location: San Jose, California, USA
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| Posted: Tue Sep 15, 2015 12:45 pm Post subject: |
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| johnsilverlakes wrote: |
Hello,
I'm nearing the end of a 2.0 rebuild and I've decided to add a Dakota Digital CHT. I really don't want to mount the sending unit under the plug. It may be the best for accuracy, but I think mounting it under the outer cylinder head bolt on #3 would be good too. The engine is on the stand and waiting for completion...Now would be a good time...Has anyone experienced good or bad results with this location?
Thanks! |
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airschooled
Air-Schooled
Joined: April 04, 2012
Posts: 12721
Location: on a bike ride somewhere
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| Posted: Thu Oct 01, 2015 3:09 pm Post subject: |
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| johnsilverlakes wrote: |
Hello,
I'm nearing the end of a 2.0 rebuild and I've decided to add a Dakota Digital CHT. I really don't want to mount the sending unit under the plug. It may be the best for accuracy, but I think mounting it under the outer cylinder head bolt on #3 would be good too. The engine is on the stand and waiting for completion...Now would be a good time...Has anyone experienced good or bad results with this location?
Thanks! |
| Jake Raby, on 914 World wrote: |
Without the sensor under the plug the values that you will gather is virtually worthless. I have applied as many as 16 sensors on a single engine at once in positions all over the cylinders and heads. I saw as much as a 200 degree differential between hottest and coolest reading simultaneously.
What this proved to me was the ONLY place for that sensor was under the spark plug.
The entire head doesn't achieve a single temperature, under the plug gives the most repeatable readings. With a sensor under an exhaust stud you will have insanely high temps as exhaust gas temps run 9-1200 degrees and heat soka the entire area around the exhaust port. |
The 914 engine is similar enough to a 2L bus engine that I would consider taking this advice seriously. But I also don't follow it, as a T1 owner... Just remember that you can only compare readings with others if you have the same setup as them.
Robbie
_________________
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WhirledTraveller
Samba Member
Joined: January 09, 2008
Posts: 1399
Location: Cambridge, MA
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| Posted: Thu Oct 01, 2015 3:50 pm Post subject: |
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| Tcash wrote: |
| johnsilverlakes wrote: |
Hello,
I'm nearing the end of a 2.0 rebuild and I've decided to add a Dakota Digital CHT. I really don't want to mount the sending unit under the plug. It may be the best for accuracy, but I think mounting it under the outer cylinder head bolt on #3 would be good too. The engine is on the stand and waiting for completion...Now would be a good time...Has anyone experienced good or bad results with this location?
Thanks! |
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Under the cylinder head bolt is known to be a bad location, your readings will be quite low. You might see trends but you won't really know how hot is too hot.
Under the plug as discussed or very close by with JB weld. I prefer potted into the head very close by so as not to interfere with the plug sealing to the head. Just drill a little hole, maybe 1/4" deep, and set the thermocouple in there with a dollop of the JB. I have done the testing and the readings are very similar to the under the plug type.
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1977 Westy, Automatic. Big Valve heads, CS Cam. |
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Kylo Rich
Samba Member
Joined: November 07, 2013
Posts: 110
Location: Mesa, AZ
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| Posted: Wed Feb 24, 2016 5:31 pm Post subject: Re: CHT Nirvana |
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| ratwell wrote: |
There was post today on the Type2 mailing list showing exactly how bad the VDO CHT gauge/sender is:
http://homepage.mac.com/ratwell/VDOGauges/CHT-revisited.txt [ed url 7/24/06]
I've been bothered by them for about year because there is simply no way to know what the real temperature the heads are at but it's a really important gauge to have. Gene Berg has a great writeup on how he hates them. They can't be calibrated and even if you could adjust it the technology is too simplistic to deal with ambient temperature changes. I've been using a Fluke DMM for my own readings: it's digital, dead accurate but not dash mount friendly.
Wouldn't it be great if there was a gauge with the following features:
- 2 1/16" (52mm) round size
- accuracy WITH cold junction compensation circuitry
- affordable
I finally found such a company in Dakota Digital [ed url 7/24/06]. I discovered them a few years ago when I was looking at a magazine article about their expensive beetle instrument cluster but I never went to their website to discover all of their other products (maybe there wasn't one at the time).
Not only do their gauges meet our basic requiements, they also have:
- digital display with night dimming
- microprocessor stabilized readings
- user adjustable flashing indicator
That's right. You can program it to flash at you when the gauge reads any temperature you desire between 300-600F. This is a miracle for bus owners: you no longer have to drive by the gauge: just wait for it to flash like a real idiot light!
The gauge is $109 without harness. Their harness only goes up to 14 ft. but they will make up a cutom length for you for an extra $5 (their wiring is thermocouple all the way to the gauge). Unfortunately, their ring terminal only fits under a 1/2" bolt so I decided to make my own harness.
If you purchase a new 14mm ring terminal or re-use your VDO terminal, buy a suitable length of k-type thermocouple from your local electronics surplus for 50 cents/ft. you be in CHT Nirvana for only a little more money than the VDO setup but for a lot more value.
I've tested this gauge simultaneously against the Fluke between 200-420F in the bus and the Dakota Digital gauge was only 5F higher throughout that temperature range so I know it doesn't wander. Because it's got the CJC circuitry, the gauge itself is also immune to freezing/heating and I tested that also in the house.
They also make matching OT and OP gauges. They aren'y exactly cheap but if you want to be warned when the oil temp is too high or the oil pressure is too low without driving by the gauges, these are the gauges for you.
It gets better: Dakota Digital uses VDO senders so you can re-use your senders with their gauges. I haven't bought either or these two gauges to prove it but that's what they tell me. Some of their gauges have programmable temperature ranges for maximum sender compatibility.
Their gauges are the old style with the mounting bracket on the back unlike the more modern VDO spin-loc hardware. Because of that I recommend you use the VDO rubber mounting plate instead of the metal plates.
Isn't this awesome? I chose the blue display with the black bezel.
Don't throw out your VDO gauges! VDO makes some really nice mounting hardware you can re-use.  |
WOW!!! This is an incredible write-up and assisted me in getting over a very tough decision that has been daunting for many years.
I am going to go with the Dakota Digital CHT and OT gauges. I have one small question however. The site offeres two options when purchasing the CHT gauge (see in link).
I can get the Cylinder Head Temp Sensor in 14 or 18 feet like you said or choose the Cylinder Head Temperature Sender Length 18' for 14mm spark plugs? I wasnt aware there would be a choice. I am not aware of which would be best fit for my rig. Any thoughts or advice?
http://www.dakotadigital.com/index.cfm/page/ptype=...prd348.htm
One other small question since you have the gauges - will they fit a 52 MM gauge pod?
You're amazing, buddy! thanks for the offer of advice.
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1982 Westy "Adeline" 2.3, Air-cooled, Dual Weber Carbs - Left my job of 10 years to hit the road full-time. Instagram @KyloRich |
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pittwagen
Samba Member
Joined: November 08, 2005
Posts: 765
Location: North of the 49th parallel
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| Posted: Wed Feb 24, 2016 7:38 pm Post subject: Re: CHT Nirvana |
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| So I can use my VDO sending apparatus and wiring and replace my VDO CHT gauge with the Dakota Digital unit and no more BS with temperature correction etc? Correct? |
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Randy in Maine
Samba Member
Joined: August 03, 2003
Posts: 34890
Location: The Beach
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| Posted: Thu Feb 25, 2016 3:18 pm Post subject: Re: CHT Nirvana |
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No. The sender has to put out what the gauge expects to see.
Buy the 18' sender from Dakota Digital. |
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scrivyscriv
Samba Electrician
Joined: October 04, 2011
Posts: 2922
Location: Memphis
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| Posted: Fri Feb 26, 2016 8:48 am Post subject: Re: CHT Nirvana |
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| pittwagen wrote: |
| So I can use my VDO sending apparatus and wiring and replace my VDO CHT gauge with the Dakota Digital unit and no more BS with temperature correction etc? Correct? |
Thats what ratwell says...
| Kylo Rich wrote: |
| ratwell wrote: |
It gets better: Dakota Digital uses VDO senders so you can re-use your senders with their gauges. I haven't bought either or these two gauges to prove it but that's what they tell me. Some of their gauges have programmable temperature ranges for maximum sender compatibility. |
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Robert in Memphis
Dünkelgrügen 1967 Java Green bug thread
Engine rebuild thread
If you're ever in the Memphis area, you are welcome to stop by for advice and help. |
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airschooled
Air-Schooled
Joined: April 04, 2012
Posts: 12721
Location: on a bike ride somewhere
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| Posted: Fri Feb 26, 2016 9:24 am Post subject: Re: CHT Nirvana |
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Yes you can use the VDO sender, as they are both K-Type thermocouples. It is unear weather VDO wire is thermocouple wire though, so confirm this before ordering. I think DD is the only one offering the correct thermocouple wire in the length for our buses.
Robbie
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Learn how your vintage VW works. And why it doesn't!
One-on-one tech help for your Volkswagen:
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