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Carburetor or FI?
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biotex
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 04, 2020 3:22 pm    Post subject: Carburetor or FI? Reply with quote

I'm getting the itch to install a Toyota engine in my rail. Not because I need it, but because it looks like a fun project. I have two engines at my disposal. A 1999 1Z 1.8L complete running car, and a very low mileage 20R. I believe it is a late 80's carbureted engine only, but it is complete with the engine wiring harness still attached.

I'm trying to decide which would be a better fit. I think the 20R has a cast iron block but could be wrong.

I have a bus 002 transmission that will be used.

Thoughts?
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cbeck
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 04, 2020 3:47 pm    Post subject: Re: Carburetor or FI? Reply with quote

Didn't putting a 20r head on a 22r longblock used to be the hot setup? Is lc engineering still around? Searched. https://www.lcengineering.com/ Don't know if they do a 20r. Back in the late 80's my buddy had a stage 4 22r, 300hp in a sr5. That thing was a rocket.
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no1clyde
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 04, 2020 4:30 pm    Post subject: Re: Carburetor or FI? Reply with quote

Here is my Toyota story, ran awesome too.

https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=577601&highlight=

Ed
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biotex
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 07, 2020 7:53 am    Post subject: Re: Carburetor or FI? Reply with quote

no1clyde wrote:
Here is my Toyota story, ran awesome too.

https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=577601&highlight=

Ed


Very nice! I read the entire thread. You have built the exact combo I am about to do myself. I was just worried about the 1ZZFE engine combination, but now after reading your experience, I'm not.

I guess I will start a build thread so I can tap into the awesome knowledge base here.

I have the cruiser buggy because I'm 6'3" and wanted the extra leg room plus I can use the extra space behind the seats for storage instead of the pickup bed option. I figured the weight distribution would be better, but this is my first attempt, so what do I know...
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biotex
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 07, 2020 10:44 am    Post subject: Re: Carburetor or FI? Reply with quote

no1clyde wrote:
Here is my Toyota story, ran awesome too.

https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=577601&highlight=

Ed


How did you add a VSS?
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no1clyde
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 07, 2020 11:27 am    Post subject: Re: Carburetor or FI? Reply with quote

biotex wrote:
no1clyde wrote:
Here is my Toyota story, ran awesome too.

https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=577601&highlight=

Ed


How did you add a VSS?


I used a pulse generator in the speedometer cable between the left front wheel and the speedometer.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Ed
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biotex
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 07, 2020 11:35 am    Post subject: Re: Carburetor or FI? Reply with quote

How did you add a VSS?[/quote]

I used a pulse generator in the speedometer cable between the left front wheel and the speedometer.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Ed[/quote]

Thanks, Only the drums and backing plate is stock on mine. I'll have to research this and see if it is possible to run a cable speedo at the wheel in my situation.
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77charger
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 07, 2020 5:42 pm    Post subject: Re: Carburetor or FI? Reply with quote

I had a 2275 with dual webbers ran great rarely troubles and carbs for most part were right on but over sharp whoops it could flood out.Carbs were set for off road and normal offroad stuff zero issues.

But went to a 3.5 honda with EFI and i will say its night and day difference in the fuel management same whoops dont affect it way smoother at any speed when i hit the gas and mpg is very close vw did better on long runs with a steady foot honda does better under hard runs.

Power is obvious from engine size but camparison im giving is from carb to efi.
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 07, 2020 6:05 pm    Post subject: Re: Carburetor or FI? Reply with quote

biotex wrote:
How did you add a VSS?


I used a pulse generator in the speedometer cable between the left front wheel and the speedometer.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Ed[/quote]

Thanks, Only the drums and backing plate is stock on mine. I'll have to research this and see if it is possible to run a cable speedo at the wheel in my situation.[/quote]

With Combo spindles...Probably a "No go" for the speedo cable. I had Foddrill custom build a combo spindle drilled for speedo cable for a race car back in the late 80s so the driver would know how fast he was going and how many miles he had gone for Baja races. Long before GPS. Worked fine. I don't know if anybody building combo spindles will do that anymore though. You COULD have a regular combo spindle drilled if you can find a machinist to do it with non-CNC mahinery. Hole has to be drilled most of the way in from the outer end of the spindle shank, then another hole drilled in to that at an angle from the inboard side of the spindle, so the cable goes in to the spindle behind the kingpin bearing. Then the inside of the angle where the 2 holes meet has to be rounded so the cable can make it around the bend without kinking, cutting, or breaking.
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 08, 2020 12:18 pm    Post subject: Re: Carburetor or FI? Reply with quote

To me carbs for off roading is a question of 'less complexity = less problems'
In the middle of nowhere I can repair a carb failure and go back home with the car
with an EFI ?
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biotex
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 08, 2020 1:50 pm    Post subject: Re: Carburetor or FI? Reply with quote

dustymojave wrote:
biotex wrote:
How did you add a VSS?


I used a pulse generator in the speedometer cable between the left front wheel and the speedometer.


Ed


Thanks, Only the drums and backing plate is stock on mine. I'll have to research this and see if it is possible to run a cable speedo at the wheel in my situation.[/quote]

With Combo spindles...Probably a "No go" for the speedo cable. I had Foddrill custom build a combo spindle drilled for speedo cable for a race car back in the late 80s so the driver would know how fast he was going and how many miles he had gone for Baja races. Long before GPS. Worked fine. I don't know if anybody building combo spindles will do that anymore though. You COULD have a regular combo spindle drilled if you can find a machinist to do it with non-CNC mahinery. Hole has to be drilled most of the way in from the outer end of the spindle shank, then another hole drilled in to that at an angle from the inboard side of the spindle, so the cable goes in to the spindle behind the kingpin bearing. Then the inside of the angle where the 2 holes meet has to be rounded so the cable can make it around the bend without kinking, cutting, or breaking.[/quote]

So yes the combo spindles make it a no go. I do find a ring that bolts to the cv joint and a mount for the tranny to add the sensor. The parts are cheap enough. But looking at it it appears that the boot would get in the way. Anyone running this setup?
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biotex
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 08, 2020 1:56 pm    Post subject: Re: Carburetor or FI? Reply with quote

lelef wrote:
To me carbs for off roading is a question of 'less complexity = less problems'
In the middle of nowhere I can repair a carb failure and go back home with the car
with an EFI ?


Good point. Where I will be going I could have to walk 20 miles to find help. Those Toyota engines are pretty reliable but it s a trade off.
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 11, 2020 12:52 pm    Post subject: Re: Carburetor or FI? Reply with quote

The 20R and 22R have cast iron blocks if I remember right making them heavy, does the 1Z have a aluminum block? if so thats the one I would use. Don't get me wrong I loved the 20R that was in my 76 Celica GT, it ran great and I wish I had kept it.

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