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Konohiki
Samba Member
Joined: April 06, 2017
Posts: 6
Location: Logan Utah
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 Posted: Sun Nov 03, 2019 10:48 am Post subject: Re: Lowering a Bay FAQ |
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| BYeaton wrote: |
| Konohiki wrote: |
| Mahalo bheaton ya both sides I think I’m just gonna go full meal deal airride and narrow the rear |
 Well why didn't you say so! Post pics please |
Hey bheaton this a great example of the only way to do things right is to do them yourself. I bought this 69’ already lowered. Nates beam 3.25 HS plates on stockers with 185/60/14’s on the back. So yesterday I unbolted the HS plates and realized they were on there wrong. Put them back on properly and the 5 spokes went on no problem. Putting nates adjustable springplates on see how it sits then I’ll decide if I’m going full meal deal. |
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Konohiki
Samba Member
Joined: April 06, 2017
Posts: 6
Location: Logan Utah
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| Posted: Sun Nov 03, 2019 11:00 am Post subject: Re: Lowering a Bay FAQ |
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| gumbajv wrote: |
Before narrowing the rear and going to air suspension ( which will give less than a stellar ride) you might look into have the wheels widened.
As a reference, on my '68 d/c with a re-drilled rear hubs (to 5x130), stock spring plates (lowered a few inches) and slightly rolled fenders I run a 9x17 3 pc. Fuchs with a 245/40/17 tire. The backspacing is 6" and I use a 1/8" spacer. Camber is 2 degrees. I've used a couple of different 911 rear shocks, including RSR race shocks, custom Wevo/Ohlins adjustable shocks w/coil over helper springs, and I have a pair of a Smart Racing/Fox shocks which are nitrogen filled and adjustable. The least expensive route would be a used pair of 911 Bilstein shocks to start, then have them re-valve to your liking if needed.
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If you read my post Making the wheels wider would not solve the problem. I’ve done airride many times and done properly is better than stellar ride |
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busmania
Samba Member
Joined: October 13, 2006
Posts: 1934
Location: Here
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| Posted: Sun Nov 17, 2019 7:02 pm Post subject: Re: Lowering a Bay FAQ |
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I have run into a problem. I’ve been driving around shockless since I finished lowering a couple months ago. I’ve decided it’s time to install shocks. However, I can’t get them to fit. If I put them on the stud on the lower control arm, they can’t swing up due to the brake line and bracket. If I try to fit them on the list stud first but at the correct orientation pointing up, the angle is such that the shock won’t slide into the trailing arm stud. I’ve compressed the shock as much as I can. Any ideas?
Question, is the trailing arm stud actually a stud? Can I remove it and just use a bolt instead of the stud? Or do I need to do something more drastic like tear everything down to the trailing arms?
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busmania
Samba Member
Joined: October 13, 2006
Posts: 1934
Location: Here
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| Posted: Tue Nov 19, 2019 8:42 am Post subject: Re: Lowering a Bay FAQ |
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Anyone? Did I screw up by not installing shocks before installing everything? Anyone have creative fixes? Or are my options to take apart the hubs down to the trailing arms (will I have to get it realigned?). Or drop the beam a couple inches? What’s the least work to get these shocks installed? In searching, removing the shock stud seems like too much work especially with the arm still on the car.
The bus drives great without shocks but not great enough to feel comfortable on the highway (hitting dips which cause the bus to bounce at speed is kind of frightening). |
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cdennisg
Samba Member
Joined: November 02, 2004
Posts: 20278
Location: Sandpoint, ID
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| Posted: Tue Nov 19, 2019 9:54 am Post subject: Re: Lowering a Bay FAQ |
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I have not had a bay with a narrowed beam, that is why I have not responded. But I seem to recall folks narrowing the lower shock mount for this situation.
Remove the stud, cut off some (1/2") of the cast-in mount, drill deeper into the arm, re-tap the hole and reinsert the stud.
This is all assuming your issue is a lack of vertical alignment between top and bottom mounts.
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Brian_e
Samba Member
Joined: July 28, 2009
Posts: 3293
Location: Rapid City, SD
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| Posted: Tue Nov 19, 2019 1:47 pm Post subject: Re: Lowering a Bay FAQ |
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| cdennisg wrote: |
I have not had a bay with a narrowed beam, that is why I have not responded. But I seem to recall folks narrowing the lower shock mount for this situation.
Remove the stud, cut off some (1/2") of the cast-in mount, drill deeper into the arm, re-tap the hole and reinsert the stud.
This is all assuming your issue is a lack of vertical alignment between top and bottom mounts. |
This is correct.
The lower stud is held in with a pin. Drill the pin out, pull the stud out, cut 1/2"-3/4" off the arm, drill the stud hole deeper, press the stud back in. Then redrill the pin hole, and press a new pin in. This will make the shock sit near verticle, and they should be much easier to get on.
Brian
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cdennisg
Samba Member
Joined: November 02, 2004
Posts: 20278
Location: Sandpoint, ID
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| Posted: Tue Nov 19, 2019 2:17 pm Post subject: Re: Lowering a Bay FAQ |
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| Brian_e wrote: |
| cdennisg wrote: |
I have not had a bay with a narrowed beam, that is why I have not responded. But I seem to recall folks narrowing the lower shock mount for this situation.
Remove the stud, cut off some (1/2") of the cast-in mount, drill deeper into the arm, re-tap the hole and reinsert the stud.
This is all assuming your issue is a lack of vertical alignment between top and bottom mounts. |
This is correct.
The lower stud is held in with a pin. Drill the pin out, pull the stud out, cut 1/2"-3/4" off the arm, drill the stud hole deeper, press the stud back in. Then redrill the pin hole, and press a new pin in. This will make the shock sit near verticle, and they should be much easier to get on.
Brian |
Thanks for the clarification. I didn't realize they were pressed in as I have never had to remove one.
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busmania
Samba Member
Joined: October 13, 2006
Posts: 1934
Location: Here
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| Posted: Tue Nov 19, 2019 2:21 pm Post subject: Re: Lowering a Bay FAQ |
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| Thank you. Can I not just cut the stud down and retread it rather than removing the stud? What am I missing? |
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cdennisg
Samba Member
Joined: November 02, 2004
Posts: 20278
Location: Sandpoint, ID
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| Posted: Tue Nov 19, 2019 2:24 pm Post subject: Re: Lowering a Bay FAQ |
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| busmania wrote: |
| Thank you. Can I not just cut the stud down and retread it rather than removing the stud? What am I missing? |
That won't change the shock angle. You need to remove material from the lower trailing arm where the side of the shock bushing rests against it. It will move the bottom of the shock toward the outside of the car.
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busmania
Samba Member
Joined: October 13, 2006
Posts: 1934
Location: Here
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| Posted: Tue Nov 19, 2019 2:26 pm Post subject: Re: Lowering a Bay FAQ |
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Ah, I see. I missed the remove material from the trailing arm part. Damn! How much do I need to remove? 1/2”? 1”?
Edit. Ignore. I reread previous post. Appreciate the help! |
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busmania
Samba Member
Joined: October 13, 2006
Posts: 1934
Location: Here
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| Posted: Tue Nov 19, 2019 2:34 pm Post subject: Re: Lowering a Bay FAQ |
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| Where would I source new pins? |
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cdennisg
Samba Member
Joined: November 02, 2004
Posts: 20278
Location: Sandpoint, ID
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| Posted: Tue Nov 19, 2019 2:34 pm Post subject: Re: Lowering a Bay FAQ |
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Here is a gallery photo of the area. These are not modified, but the photo shows the little pin and the area that needs to be removed/clearanced to gain room.
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cdennisg
Samba Member
Joined: November 02, 2004
Posts: 20278
Location: Sandpoint, ID
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| Posted: Tue Nov 19, 2019 2:36 pm Post subject: Re: Lowering a Bay FAQ |
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| busmania wrote: |
| Where would I source new pins? |
Should just be a roll pin/tension pin. Most good hardware stores will have them.
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busmania
Samba Member
Joined: October 13, 2006
Posts: 1934
Location: Here
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| Posted: Tue Nov 19, 2019 2:54 pm Post subject: Re: Lowering a Bay FAQ |
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| Any thoughts on instead of using the stud again, tapping the trailing arm to accept a bolt in its place? |
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cdennisg
Samba Member
Joined: November 02, 2004
Posts: 20278
Location: Sandpoint, ID
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| Posted: Tue Nov 19, 2019 2:57 pm Post subject: Re: Lowering a Bay FAQ |
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I suppose it could work, but it will be just as much work as using the stud and anew pin.
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busmania
Samba Member
Joined: October 13, 2006
Posts: 1934
Location: Here
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| Posted: Thu Nov 21, 2019 8:50 am Post subject: Re: Lowering a Bay FAQ |
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Sometimes I wish I was afraid to ask questions! Got the shocks installed with no cutting. All I had to do was remove the brake line from the frame and put the shock on lower stud first then swing it up. The brake line bracket was still in the way but the shock pulls away enough to get it around. Man I feel like an idiot! When I originally tried installing the shocks, I guess I assumed there would be no way to work it around the brake bracket.
Anyway, so that I can reverse my idiot post and actually help someone in the future. I used 74 bug rear shocks (as mentioned somewhere in this thread but it was a long time ago, I just used a random 70’s year bug and it worked out, I assume they are mostly all the same). Below is some info on various shocks I researched in terms of travel.
Shocks referenced in this thread. YMMV.
74 beetle - NAPA # 94097. max open is 16.26". Fully compressed 10.375.
Napa part #5850 - 14" max open travel, 9.5" compressed.
Monroe part #5752 - 12.75 max, 8.625 |
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Vee Dub Nut
Samba Member
Joined: April 25, 2004
Posts: 1184
Location: Dallas, GA
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| Posted: Thu Nov 21, 2019 10:35 am Post subject: Re: Lowering a Bay FAQ |
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| busmania wrote: |
Sometimes I wish I was afraid to ask questions! Got the shocks installed with no cutting. All I had to do was remove the brake line from the frame and put the shock on lower stud first then swing it up. The brake line bracket was still in the way but the shock pulls away enough to get it around. Man I feel like an idiot! When I originally tried installing the shocks, I guess I assumed there would be no way to work it around the brake bracket.
Anyway, so that I can reverse my idiot post and actually help someone in the future. I used 74 bug rear shocks (as mentioned somewhere in this thread but it was a long time ago, I just used a random 70’s year bug and it worked out, I assume they are mostly all the same). Below is some info on various shocks I researched in terms of travel.
Shocks referenced in this thread. YMMV.
74 beetle - NAPA # 94097. max open is 16.26". Fully compressed 10.375.
Napa part #5850 - 14" max open travel, 9.5" compressed.
Monroe part #5752 - 12.75 max, 8.625 |
Glad you got it sorted! I was just reading the thread and thinking to myself, I remember it being a pain in the neck to get the front shocks on, but I definitely did not have to remove the lower shock stud or modify the arm at all. Couldn't remember what I did, then I saw your last post. Sometimes its easy to miss the forest through the trees right?
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Fightin' Texas Aggie Class of 2006
67 Beetle (TBD)
74 Transporter (EJ25 Swapped) - Build Thread: https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=...mp;start=0
See all my VW pics on Instagram @ vee_dub_nut |
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cdennisg
Samba Member
Joined: November 02, 2004
Posts: 20278
Location: Sandpoint, ID
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| Posted: Thu Nov 21, 2019 10:48 pm Post subject: Re: Lowering a Bay FAQ |
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| busmania wrote: |
Sometimes I wish I was afraid to ask questions! Got the shocks installed with no cutting. All I had to do was remove the brake line from the frame and put the shock on lower stud first then swing it up. The brake line bracket was still in the way but the shock pulls away enough to get it around. Man I feel like an idiot! When I originally tried installing the shocks, I guess I assumed there would be no way to work it around the brake bracket.
Anyway, so that I can reverse my idiot post and actually help someone in the future. I used 74 bug rear shocks (as mentioned somewhere in this thread but it was a long time ago, I just used a random 70’s year bug and it worked out, I assume they are mostly all the same). Below is some info on various shocks I researched in terms of travel.
Shocks referenced in this thread. YMMV.
4 beetle - NAPA # 94097. max open is 16.26". Fully compressed 10.375.
Napa part #5850 - 14" max open travel, 9.5" compressed.
Monroe part #5752 - 12.75 max, 8.625 |
I was under the impression that you had a narrowed beam and had issues with shock angle.
Thanks for posting up the info on what shocks will work in that situation.
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tonydanza
Samba Member
Joined: December 21, 2004
Posts: 9
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| Posted: Tue Feb 11, 2020 10:49 am Post subject: |
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what size tires are you running here?
| T-Dubya wrote: |
| beforeafter i ripped out all the little bars and the bump stops in the front and 2 splines in the back. |
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Todd V.
Samba Member
Joined: September 09, 2014
Posts: 32
Location: Whitefish, MT
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| Posted: Sat Mar 21, 2020 2:25 pm Post subject: Re: Lowering a Bay FAQ |
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Hi guy's, I have a Wagenswest lowering kit I purchased last fall. I simply don't have the time to do the work so I am selling the parts. If you are thinking of going lower I can save you time & money, here is a link to the ad:
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=2362481 |
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