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SBD Samba Member
Joined: October 24, 2012 Posts: 3269 Location: SOUTH DAKOTA
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Posted: Mon May 04, 2020 8:19 pm Post subject: Re: What did you do yesterday on your buggy? |
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Yesterday I actually got my Kelmark fired up again for the first time since September of 2018. Loooong story of a simple repair in the driveway and complications/one thing leading to many, many others. And the story is far from over. _________________ "Just $99 down and $64 a month for 36 months buys you a brand new Volkswagen Beetle!"
mark tucker wrote: |
I wouldent waste $ or thyme on building a small motor. build it big so it dosent have to work hard.remember it's only as fast as your foot alows it to be unless you build a small turd then it just stinks as it squishes up through your toes when you step on it. |
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Q-Dog Samba Member
Joined: April 05, 2010 Posts: 8700 Location: Sunset, Louisiana
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Posted: Wed May 06, 2020 4:33 am Post subject: Re: What did you do yesterday on your buggy? |
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Replaced a stuck wheel cylinder and did a springtime once-over. Need to replace rear tires and polish the wheels. Steering wheel and front bumper are getting crusty. Snapped a photo.
_________________ Brian
'69 Dune Buggy
'69 Beetle Convertible
'70 Beetle |
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andygere Samba Member
Joined: January 31, 2014 Posts: 600 Location: Central Coast, CA
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Posted: Wed May 20, 2020 8:21 pm Post subject: Re: What did you do yesterday on your buggy? |
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After dealing with sloppy shifting in my Manxter long enough, I finally tackled the shift rod bushing and coupler. I had asked my engine builder to take care of it before installing my new engine and transaxle, but he “forgot”. No time like the present to get it done myself. TheSamba yielded good advice as always, the best being to fabricate a simple PVC tool for extracting and installing the shift rod. If you take this job on, make this tool.
It makes the job relatively easy and you can do it without help.
The bushing was barely there, and the clip was gone.
The coupler didn’t look too bad, but was completely sloppy. When I took it apart, the rubbers were really soft and chewed up, and the cheap hollow cross shaft was bent and flattened. Total junk, and not an original VW cage, so nothing worth saving. I went with a CB Rhino Coupler which is a nice unit, with firm (non-urethane) rubbers and a nice stainless bolt with nylock nut. Worth the $12.
It all went together nicely, with the bushing greased and no play in the shaft at either end. I bolted up my original Hurst VW shifter and spend an hour or so trying to get it adjusted. I could get 3-4 or 1-2 but not both, and reverse sometimes. I had cleaned and greased it, and it appeared to be working nicely, but the rivets had stretched and the white nylon plates were sliding around as I actuated the shifter. I decided this was a big part of the problem, so I ordered the repair plate from Bruce https://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=813234 and will rehab my original Hurst. Knowing that may take me a little while, I ordered the EMPI copy so the car would be ready for my daughter’s “Drive By” high school graduation next week. That came today, and I installed it and was able to adjust it in about 5 minutes. The quality and finish is nothing close to the original Hurst, but it shifts really crisply, and for the price really isn’t bad. It did arrive with a cracked base cover, not sure if was the shipping or the product, but it’s being handled at no cost.
My son helped me bleed a bit of air out of the hydraulic clutch and we went for a quick spin to see how it shifted. Wow is all I can say, what fun. Crisp, precise, like a sports car. I’m a happy camper. |
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tcmia Samba Member
Joined: April 30, 2019 Posts: 212 Location: Cleveland TN
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Posted: Thu May 28, 2020 5:24 pm Post subject: Re: What did you do yesterday on your buggy? |
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Yesterday I finished the oval third brake light that goes into the hard top.
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YDBD Samba Member
Joined: February 25, 2017 Posts: 891 Location: Bavaria, Germany
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Posted: Sat Jul 04, 2020 11:20 pm Post subject: Re: What did you do yesterday on your buggy? |
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After putting in a narrowed beam over winter finally got an alignment done. The Germans don't mess around-all four corners computer spec'd out.
_________________ '56 pan Dune Buggy since '69
don't live in the past...but when I did:
'67 bug
'64 baja
'60 dune buggy
'73 Personenkraftwagen Type 182 "Thing" |
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dustymojave Samba Member
Joined: January 07, 2007 Posts: 5802 Location: Lake LA, Mojave Desert, SoCal
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Posted: Mon Jul 06, 2020 4:54 pm Post subject: Re: What did you do yesterday on your buggy? |
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I cannot imagine WHY you would put in a narrowed beam. But then I guess the car is all about car shows on the lawn now and NOT about getting used offroad as it was under your dad's ownership nor about how it handles on the pavement even. _________________ Richard
Offroading VW based cars since 1965
Tech Inspection 1963 - 2012 SCCA/SCORE/HDRA/MORE/MDR +
Retired from building Bajas, Fiberglass Buggies and Rails in the Mojave Desert. Also Sprints & Midgets, Dry Lakes, Road Race cars. All types New and Vintage
SoCalBajas Member
Kicked Cancer's A$$...1st and 2nd round...Fight ain't over yet. |
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joescoolcustoms Samba Member
Joined: August 08, 2006 Posts: 9054 Location: West By God Virginia
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Posted: Mon Jul 06, 2020 7:48 pm Post subject: Re: What did you do yesterday on your buggy? |
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dustymojave wrote: |
I cannot imagine WHY you would put in a narrowed beam. But then I guess the car is all about car shows on the lawn now and NOT about getting used offroad as it was under your dad's ownership nor about how it handles on the pavement even. |
Some people don't get the fact there are other ways to build a buggy than just for off road. Just like the old saying, "There are two types of people in the World. Those who think there are, and those who think there are not."
Narrowed beam on a buggy? Why not? The 4th buggy I built, I narrowed a beam for it. Wanted the inside the fender line look for the tires. And I achieved it. The blue buggy was built for a particular look I was after, in paint, drivability, handling, beach, racing, stance.
Here is your lawn shot.
It did win awards for paint, best in class, best of show, people's choice and others.
But it handled like it was on rails on the highway. Now has over 30,000 miles on it traveling all over the East US. On the track, it ate up Watkins Glen International Raceway. On the street, lots of Pony Cars surprised off the stop light for a quick burst.
Here is a track shot.
Off road with a narrowed beam, why not? The owner's Wife ran it on a BugEASTia Run on the NC Outer Banx and drove it like she stole it all over the Sugar Sand and rough ruts on the North part of the beach. Many times on the East US beaches. It is very capable off road.
Here it is with the 7th buggy and 12th buggy I have built.
It would be a cool thing it we could enjoy other people's builds with them, in furthering the hobby we like instead of criticizing them. _________________ Bad News Racing 2018 NORRA 1000 3rd in Class
Best Day Ever Racing 2022 NORRA 1000 2nd in Class and first All Female team to complete the race
Everyone is gifted. Some just do not open the package.
Looks like it was painted with a live chicken,polished with a brick and buffed with a pine cone |
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YDBD Samba Member
Joined: February 25, 2017 Posts: 891 Location: Bavaria, Germany
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Posted: Mon Jul 06, 2020 9:23 pm Post subject: Re: What did you do yesterday on your buggy? |
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dustymojave wrote: |
I cannot imagine WHY you would put in a narrowed beam. But then I guess the car is all about car shows on the lawn now and NOT about getting used offroad as it was under your dad's ownership nor about how it handles on the pavement even. |
Richard,
The WHY is that the tires have to be under the fenders here in Germany to pass the inspection to be road legal. It just makes sense, the buggy hasn't been off road since 2006, and I'm tired of swapping tires/wheels just for inspection every year. There are no sand dunes here and no place to drive off road-all dirt roads are managed by private or forest authorities. Most of our pictures show the buggy in sand, which is much more exciting than plain street pictures, we drove it a LOT on the street in the 70's as well. The buggy has been street legal in California, Okinawa, Japan and now Germany; I must abide by the law (or never be able to drive the buggy, I'm pretty lucky to have plates at all in Germany) and make decisions on where I can drive. If I was taking to the dunes at all it probably would not have been swapped out.
I respect your years of offroading and know that there are rules even in offroading to be legal. The heyday of the 70s homemade cars is long gone oh and I get about 1 car show a year, usually a "treffen"-since there is a drive after the "show" part.
p.s. thanks Joe-those are some fantastic buggies and lawn shots. _________________ '56 pan Dune Buggy since '69
don't live in the past...but when I did:
'67 bug
'64 baja
'60 dune buggy
'73 Personenkraftwagen Type 182 "Thing" |
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dustymojave Samba Member
Joined: January 07, 2007 Posts: 5802 Location: Lake LA, Mojave Desert, SoCal
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Posted: Thu Jul 09, 2020 4:18 pm Post subject: Re: What did you do yesterday on your buggy? |
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WOW!!!!
Are some of us a little touchy?
Now you've hurt my feeling ASS-uming that I was being negative.
Did I ANYWHERE in my previous post say that YDBD is in ANY WAY WRONG?
Nope.
So calm your revs there.
My 1st ride in a VW-based buggy was at an SCCA Sports car road race at Willow Springs Raceway. My dad was a hotrodder before he got into sports cars. The 1st race car I ever sat in was built for dirt. It was a Belly Tank for speed record racing at places like El Mirage and Bonneville. As a professional race car fabricator, I not only built cars that won their respective classes in the Baja 1000, I also built road race cars and Super Modified cars with 800 hp engines hanging outside of the frame. My older brother had a drag car while I was planning my 1st offroad car. And at that, I wobbled back and forth for a while between building a an offroad buggy and a formula car.
And I KNOW that not every car is a race car. And that not every Manx-Type buggy is built for racing the Baja 1000.
And I know that there are a million ways to build a buggy. One of the things I love about VWs is that no 2 are alike. I NEVER tell anybody that their car MUST be built how I would build it. But I also don't let my wife's panties get wrapped around the axle if someone else would build their car different than I would build it. GEEZ!
YDBD has explained why he opted for a narrower than stock beam. Keeping the tires under the fenders makes sense to me. Especially in a place where it rains so much more than it does here in SoCal.
Personally I would approach the issue differently, like adding to the fender width or choosing wheels with less positive offset, and making sure there are no spacers behind them. And choosing front tires that aren't so wide. There are LOTS of ways to achieve the desired end. I have a pair of bubble center Centerline wheels set aside for the front of my Glitterbug to achieve the front width I want. That doesn't mean that I am saying that YDBD is wrong.
Joe...I have a great deal of respect for your buggy builds and what you do with those cars. Have I EVER told you that you were doing it wrong? Hell no. Even though, or IF I felt that I would have done something differently than you did yours.
How many times have I been criticized for cutting up a '58 Bug into a Baja. LOTS of times, maybe not by you but by plenty of others who are appalled that I would commit such a heinous crime. Not to mention how many times I've been criticized and told that it was WRONG to put a roll cage in it because some people think that with a roll cage one is absolutely GOING to hit their head on the roll cage and kill themself. (That of course assumes that I would be so stupid as to NOT wear seat belts in a car I was concerned about safety enough to go to the effort and expense of building a roll cage). But then there are the others who tell me I'm wrong for not putting a full tube frame under my bodyshell and wider beam, coilovers, or worse, A-arms. Or told me that I HAVE to have a turbo on it or better, a Chevy engine.
Just because I'm not jumping up and down cheering and blowing confetti all over the place doesn't mean that I am saying the car and the owner are WRONG.
Calm down and get over it.
I guess with some folks ya just GOTTA jump up and down and scream RAH RAH SIS Boom Bah!!! _________________ Richard
Offroading VW based cars since 1965
Tech Inspection 1963 - 2012 SCCA/SCORE/HDRA/MORE/MDR +
Retired from building Bajas, Fiberglass Buggies and Rails in the Mojave Desert. Also Sprints & Midgets, Dry Lakes, Road Race cars. All types New and Vintage
SoCalBajas Member
Kicked Cancer's A$$...1st and 2nd round...Fight ain't over yet. |
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EVfun Samba Member
Joined: April 01, 2012 Posts: 5481 Location: Seattle
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Posted: Thu Jul 09, 2020 5:11 pm Post subject: Re: What did you do yesterday on your buggy? |
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dustymojave wrote: |
WOW!!!!
Are some of us a little touchy?
Now you've hurt my feeling ASS-uming that I was being negative.
Did I ANYWHERE in my previous post say that YDBD is in ANY WAY WRONG?
[snip]
Calm down and get over it.
I guess with some folks ya just GOTTA jump up and down and scream RAH RAH SIS Boom Bah!!! |
LOL you started out, shouting "I cannot imagine WHY you would put in a narrowed beam." A little push-back and now your feelings are hurt? _________________
Wildthings wrote: |
As a general rule, cheap parts are the most expensive parts you can buy. |
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oprn Samba Member
Joined: November 13, 2016 Posts: 12730 Location: Western Canada
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Posted: Thu Jul 09, 2020 5:41 pm Post subject: Re: What did you do yesterday on your buggy? |
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It is a step backward as far as drivability goes and I asked YDBD the same question in another thread. He explained it to me then and yes that is a viable option.
I am faced with the same dilemma, I want to add disc brakes to the front and genuine Fuchs wheels. With the Chevy rims and adapters I have now the tires stick out far enough to make a mess of the Buggy. I would like to tuck them under a bit but don't really want to narrow the beam. It would be nice to trade someone a pare of 6" Fuchs for a pair of genuine 4.5" ones!
Will have to see when I get the 944 brakes and wheels mocked up... |
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dustymojave Samba Member
Joined: January 07, 2007 Posts: 5802 Location: Lake LA, Mojave Desert, SoCal
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Posted: Thu Jul 09, 2020 6:50 pm Post subject: Re: What did you do yesterday on your buggy? |
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EVfun wrote: |
dustymojave wrote: |
WOW!!!!
Are some of us a little touchy?
Now you've hurt my feeling ASS-uming that I was being negative.
Did I ANYWHERE in my previous post say that YDBD is in ANY WAY WRONG?
[snip]
Calm down and get over it.
I guess with some folks ya just GOTTA jump up and down and scream RAH RAH SIS Boom Bah!!! |
LOL you started out, shouting "I cannot imagine WHY you would put in a narrowed beam." A little push-back and now your feelings are hurt? |
My post was a shout
Then I'll have to whisper when I come over to the fiberglass department in the future. Must be some AWFUL TOUCHY ear drums over here. _________________ Richard
Offroading VW based cars since 1965
Tech Inspection 1963 - 2012 SCCA/SCORE/HDRA/MORE/MDR +
Retired from building Bajas, Fiberglass Buggies and Rails in the Mojave Desert. Also Sprints & Midgets, Dry Lakes, Road Race cars. All types New and Vintage
SoCalBajas Member
Kicked Cancer's A$$...1st and 2nd round...Fight ain't over yet. |
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YDBD Samba Member
Joined: February 25, 2017 Posts: 891 Location: Bavaria, Germany
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Posted: Fri Jul 10, 2020 10:38 pm Post subject: Re: What did you do yesterday on your buggy? |
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Lotsa respect for the guys on here, Richard asked why; I told him, no worries.
Currently running the stock offset wheels with disk brakes so the stance is pretty close to stock-I'd have to measure it. I have a set of Bruce Meyers signature wheels that have more offset and would put it past the stock width.
So the question is what are the drawbacks from a narrowed beam when the tire stance is the same?
In the end I am happy with the handling on the road except that I have no sway bar up front anymore so it's a little softer riding through corners and no I can't get CB to ship one to me.
Nothing got done on the buggy yesterday as I was coming back from a trip to the Elbe near Dresden.
But earlier this week I replaced the brake/tail lamps with LEDs--SOOO much brighter. Wanted to do the signal lights but it messes with the flasher can too much-any ideas? _________________ '56 pan Dune Buggy since '69
don't live in the past...but when I did:
'67 bug
'64 baja
'60 dune buggy
'73 Personenkraftwagen Type 182 "Thing" |
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oprn Samba Member
Joined: November 13, 2016 Posts: 12730 Location: Western Canada
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Posted: Sat Jul 11, 2020 6:28 am Post subject: Re: What did you do yesterday on your buggy? |
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YDBD wrote: |
So the question is what are the drawbacks from a narrowed beam when the tire stance is the same? |
It changes the angle between the center of your tire tread and the center of the ball joint. VW called it "negative steering roll radius" back in about '71 when they brought out the Super Beetle. The further away from the center of the ball joint your tire tread is the more effort it takes to steer the car and the more bumps tend to overpower your arms - higher shock loads through to the steering wheel.
YDBD wrote: |
But earlier this week I replaced the brake/tail lamps with LEDs--SOOO much brighter. Wanted to do the signal lights but it messes with the flasher can too much-any ideas? |
Just add resistors to the signal light circuit. I can't remember right off hand whether they go in series or parallel to the bulbs. |
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YDBD Samba Member
Joined: February 25, 2017 Posts: 891 Location: Bavaria, Germany
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Posted: Sat Jul 11, 2020 6:35 am Post subject: Re: What did you do yesterday on your buggy? |
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It changes the angle between the center of your tire tread and the center of the ball joint.
But that hasn't changed, everything from the trailing arm out is the same set up, and it's a king pin, no ball joint. _________________ '56 pan Dune Buggy since '69
don't live in the past...but when I did:
'67 bug
'64 baja
'60 dune buggy
'73 Personenkraftwagen Type 182 "Thing" |
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oprn Samba Member
Joined: November 13, 2016 Posts: 12730 Location: Western Canada
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Posted: Sat Jul 11, 2020 8:37 am Post subject: Re: What did you do yesterday on your buggy? |
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YDBD wrote: |
It changes the angle between the center of your tire tread and the center of the ball joint.
But that hasn't changed, everything from the trailing arm out is the same set up, and it's a king pin, no ball joint. |
In your case that could be true if your rims are stock offset but most guys narrow the beam to fit wider tires and different offsets under the fenders. I just assumed that is what you did. If not then no it would only effect the track width and how it follows in the ruts left by other heavier vehicles
My apologies!. |
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dustymojave Samba Member
Joined: January 07, 2007 Posts: 5802 Location: Lake LA, Mojave Desert, SoCal
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Posted: Tue Jul 14, 2020 4:39 pm Post subject: Re: What did you do yesterday on your buggy? |
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oprn wrote: |
YDBD wrote: |
So the question is what are the drawbacks from a narrowed beam when the tire stance is the same? |
It changes the angle between the center of your tire tread and the center of the ball joint. VW called it "negative steering roll radius" back in about '71 when they brought out the Super Beetle. The further away from the center of the ball joint your tire tread is the more effort it takes to steer the car and the more bumps tend to overpower your arms - higher shock loads through to the steering wheel.
... |
Another term for that is "scrub radius".
A line drawn through the center of the kingpin or through the ball centers of the pair of ball joints will strike the ground surface outboard of where a plumb bob suspended from either the top of the kingpin or upper ball joint or from the lower end of the kingpin or lower ball joint would touch the ground. The difference between those 2 points is called "king pin inclination" whether the suspension uses king pins or not. That angled line is necessary for the steering to work and self center at the end of a turn.
The distance from that point where the king pin line meets the ground to the center line of the tire is "scrub radius". That works with kingpin inclination and caster to self center the steering.
More scrub radius means more steering effort, more steering feedback, and a larger turning radius. It also puts more stress on suspension and steering components and thus wears things out faster and makes it more difficult to maintain alignment. In offroad use, it makes things more likely to break. One of the reasons I'm not real fond of real wide wheels and tires on the front of a VW based vehicle for pavement OR offroad use.
Narrowing the beam doesn't create more scrub radius. But wider wheels or wheels with more offset outboard DOES create more scrub radius.
Tall tires used for offroad reduce scrub radius. Low profile tires and/or small diameter wheels (net effect - small OD of tires) increase scrub radius.
Scrub radius CAN BE negative, if the king pin line meets the ground outboard of the tire center. That will then again, increase steering effort. _________________ Richard
Offroading VW based cars since 1965
Tech Inspection 1963 - 2012 SCCA/SCORE/HDRA/MORE/MDR +
Retired from building Bajas, Fiberglass Buggies and Rails in the Mojave Desert. Also Sprints & Midgets, Dry Lakes, Road Race cars. All types New and Vintage
SoCalBajas Member
Kicked Cancer's A$$...1st and 2nd round...Fight ain't over yet. |
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MrGoodtunes Samba Member
Joined: May 14, 2012 Posts: 852 Location: South Florida
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Posted: Tue Jul 14, 2020 5:29 pm Post subject: Re: What did you do yesterday on your buggy? |
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This pic shows a small positive steering roll radius (distance between wheel centerline to kingpin/balljoint axis pivot point). The smaller this distance, the better most vehicles will handle. But as it goes to zero, tire tread will scrub while turning steering wheel when park'd; makes for really hard steering when doing parking maneuvers, especially with wide front tires.
Last edited by MrGoodtunes on Wed Jul 29, 2020 9:07 am; edited 1 time in total |
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MrGoodtunes Samba Member
Joined: May 14, 2012 Posts: 852 Location: South Florida
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Posted: Mon Jul 27, 2020 5:28 pm Post subject: Re: What did you do yesterday on your buggy? |
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Changed my buggy's oil, using one of those big 5 gallon containers (for the 1st time) and a funnel I purchased 'cuz I knew the big jug might need some help versus the good old 1 quart jars that are getting harder to find and sort of expensive. Funnel was no help, until I made an extension for it with a short section of flexible clear vinyl tubing:
BTW upon removing rear left wheel (required for changing oil filter on my build), surprise; lower shock bolt had no nut! Found one in my stash (along with washers). Hope it does the job; it's not original German, so maybe not as strong?
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EVfun Samba Member
Joined: April 01, 2012 Posts: 5481 Location: Seattle
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Posted: Tue Jul 28, 2020 4:39 am Post subject: Re: What did you do yesterday on your buggy? |
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MrGoodtunes wrote: |
This pic shows a small positive steering roll radius (distance between wheel centerline to kingpin/balljoint axis pivot point). The smaller this distance, the better most vehicles will handle. |
What is the scrub radius of a stock Bug? I'm more curious about the K&L front end, but both would be good to know. _________________
Wildthings wrote: |
As a general rule, cheap parts are the most expensive parts you can buy. |
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