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curtis4085
Samba Member
Joined: July 22, 2011
Posts: 4806
Location: Colorado
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 Posted: Mon Dec 31, 2012 7:27 am Post subject: 71 Panel Van Restoration - Pictures! |
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Hello Everyone. Thought I would start a thread to document my next project.
This project has no timeline and the budget is gonna probably exceed what I really want to spend. I tried adding up numbers for this build but perfection doesnt seem to have a budget. Best guess $15k. I'm bit thin on funds now so it's gonna be a slow start.
Scope of project:
New engine: 1776 with duel Delortos and upgraded exhaust. (engine in earliest stage of production, it's only on paper so far.
New shocks: Koni's of course
New wheels and tires: going OG rims and. Hankook tires RA08 ( I found the OG tires off this original bus from a guy 1500 miles away. Small world.
Rebuilt Tranny: was thinking a Rancho rebuilt one? Or have my mechanic rebuild it, or I may just replace hockey stick etc myself and call it a day. Any suggestions?
New CVS joint: German Lobros if available
New seat cover: originals are Dark Beige. Anyone know of the correct vintage
Material? Vendors? Was thinking Sewfine or WolfsburgWest for seat covers and pad. Horse hair I'm leaning towards for padding.
New door panels: the doors and locks will receive vapor barrier and sound deadner and lock rehab during this process
New headliner in cab area
New Paint: all body to be soda blasted to bare metal, any cancer replaced with new metal, should barely be any new metal. Hopefully. The cOlor will be stock Pastel White exterior and cab area, the cargo area will get painted the stock grey/off white which they painted these commercial vehicles. If anyone has this paint code please post it here.
New German body, door and window seals: German is the only choice here. All my glass is OG and deserves the best.
The under carriage is perfect but will get a recoat of Waxoil German undercoating to make it new again. All of the cavities will be treated.
New front and walk thru rubber mats. Got great deal threw CIP1. Cheaper than what manufactures sells them for. Plus free shipping.
My stero is original VW factory radio so the plan is to put period speakers in the door panels. Gotta love those 70's speaker. Not much range but boy te experience driving down the road with tunes playing threw them adds to the experience.
Upgraded headlights: new HD lights from busdepot.com
New tie rods
New engine seal
Powdercoat engine tins
New or refurbished heater boxes: are after market heater boxes as good as OG ones? I no that type 4 OG are way better than aftermarket.
Interior dome light: gonna refurbish these if at all possible.
Dash: dash pad and front facing portion of dash is mint, the metal needs stripped and paint or maybe new? Are there NOS or new metal dash available?
Heating system: rebuilt from ground up. I live in Colorado and want to use bus for daily driver when finished so it better have enough heat to keep my fellas from turning into ice cubes.
Well I may have left something off list but will update as I go. Here are few pictures with many more to follow.
Start of project... Tearing the old tired floor and seat stand mats out.
Found some rust under floor may and near brake fluid res. treated some last night. Will grind and POR-15 the rest this week.
The pictures look worse than what's really there in terms of rust. Mostly dirt and glue. The rust is mostly surface. No holes. The floor infront of driver the worst in bus. Pitting  there also a bit of rust under seat stand. Seems like the wheel well welds were not all the way caulked.
More to come....
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busdaddy
Samba Member
Joined: February 12, 2004
Posts: 53188
Location: Surrey B.C. Canada, but thinking of Ukraine
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| Posted: Mon Dec 31, 2012 8:38 am Post subject: Re: 71 Panel Van Restoration - Pictures! |
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That's a nice looking bus you lucky bastard 
| curtis4085 wrote: |
| there also a bit of rust under seat stand. Seems like the wheel well welds were not all the way caulked. .... |
The rust behind the drivers seat is very common on early buses, it's from messy brake fluid reservoir refilling or it overflowing when pushing back the pistons to install new pads.
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Rust NEVER sleeps and stock never goes out of style.
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curtis4085
Samba Member
Joined: July 22, 2011
Posts: 4806
Location: Colorado
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| Posted: Mon Dec 31, 2012 8:49 am Post subject: Re: 71 Panel Van Restoration - Pictures! |
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| busdaddy wrote: |
That's a nice looking bus you lucky bastard
| curtis4085 wrote: |
| there also a bit of rust under seat stand. Seems like the wheel well welds were not all the way caulked. .... |
The rust behind the drivers seat is very common on early buses, it's from messy brake fluid reservoir refilling or it overflowing when pushing back the pistons to install new pads. |
Thank you Sir! It took me two months of talking with owner to get him to sell it. I'm super excited about this adventure.
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skills@eurocarsplus
Samba Peckerhead
Joined: January 01, 2007
Posts: 17939
Location: sticksville, ct.
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| Posted: Mon Dec 31, 2012 8:52 am Post subject: |
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| gprudenciop wrote: |
my reason for switching to subaru is my german car was turning chinese so i said fuck it and went japanese....... |
| Jake Raby wrote: |
| Thanks for the correction. I used to be a nice guy, then I ruined it by exposing myself to the public. |
| Brian wrote: |
| Also the fact that people are agreeing with Skills, it's a turn of events for samba history |
Last edited by skills@eurocarsplus on Wed Mar 13, 2013 1:19 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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curtis4085
Samba Member
Joined: July 22, 2011
Posts: 4806
Location: Colorado
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| Posted: Mon Dec 31, 2012 9:05 am Post subject: |
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| skills@eurocarsplus wrote: |
Sounds good, but if I were you (don't you love when people say that?) I would go bigger on the engine. For pennies more, you can build a nice 1904/1915 and choose your rods/crank carefully and have yourself a t4 killer. If you plan on running heater boxes, consider a nice pair of L3's
I would also consider a freeway flier transmission. I have noticed in my 71 westy vs my 71 single cab a big difference in crusing rpms. I can't prove it but I think commercial's have different gearing.
Or, go 091. With the upgrade in power, you should have no issues. I plan a 091 swap in my single at some point |
I love the suggestions...
I was looking into bigger engine but living in Colorado foothill mountains I'm worried going to big and not shedding the heat properly. I'm really not concerned with speed and will never be over loaded. Was suggested to me by engine builder that 1776 was safest bet.
Being incredibly green with the upright engines im at the mercy of the Bently and thesamba gurus to point me in the right direction.
A freeway flyer sounds awesome but probably would double the tranny budget. Thought stock tranny was $750 rebuilt threw Rancho. Freeway if I recall was double that. I could be wrong as I'm going from memory. Question? If I only plan on driving most places no faster than 60 mph is a freeway flyer a needed upgrade?
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skills@eurocarsplus
Samba Peckerhead
Joined: January 01, 2007
Posts: 17939
Location: sticksville, ct.
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| Posted: Mon Dec 31, 2012 12:02 pm Post subject: |
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| gprudenciop wrote: |
my reason for switching to subaru is my german car was turning chinese so i said fuck it and went japanese....... |
| Jake Raby wrote: |
| Thanks for the correction. I used to be a nice guy, then I ruined it by exposing myself to the public. |
| Brian wrote: |
| Also the fact that people are agreeing with Skills, it's a turn of events for samba history |
Last edited by skills@eurocarsplus on Wed Mar 13, 2013 3:04 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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curtis4085
Samba Member
Joined: July 22, 2011
Posts: 4806
Location: Colorado
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| Posted: Mon Dec 31, 2012 2:44 pm Post subject: |
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| skills@eurocarsplus wrote: |
Well, if you are ok at 60 (use a gps to validate the speedo) then don't sweat it. My single cab is begging for mercy at 60...with no load. My westy, otoh is pretty happy at 70. It should be happier with the 1904 I am putting together.
I agree, bigger isn't always better but you really are within about 100 or so of a 1904.
Heads are the same (bore size) from a 1776 to a 1904....you are a crank and rods away. I am building a 1904 out of a 1776 now. Easy peasy.....
74mm crank
5.3 rods
90.5 pistons
110 cam
36 drla's (you are going to do anyway)
Get it all balanced and go. That should put you in and above stock t4 hp and torque |
I was looking at a freeway flyer but read it could cause chronic over heating issues driving in town. Was told engine could run hot doing 45 in 4th gear. Just hearsay at this point but got me thinking. I really do not drive these old girls for speed. Just pure love and enjoyment. Doing 55mph max is fine by me. I was looking at the Rancho rebuilt trannys. Have you heard any issues with these units?
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redwagon
Samba Member
Joined: March 05, 2006
Posts: 220
Location: Arvada, CO
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| Posted: Mon Dec 31, 2012 3:36 pm Post subject: |
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| That's one clean panel! Did you pick it up locally? |
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skills@eurocarsplus
Samba Peckerhead
Joined: January 01, 2007
Posts: 17939
Location: sticksville, ct.
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| Posted: Mon Dec 31, 2012 3:48 pm Post subject: |
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..
_________________
| gprudenciop wrote: |
my reason for switching to subaru is my german car was turning chinese so i said fuck it and went japanese....... |
| Jake Raby wrote: |
| Thanks for the correction. I used to be a nice guy, then I ruined it by exposing myself to the public. |
| Brian wrote: |
| Also the fact that people are agreeing with Skills, it's a turn of events for samba history |
Last edited by skills@eurocarsplus on Wed Mar 13, 2013 3:04 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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secretsubmariner
Champagne Wrangler
Joined: January 08, 2011
Posts: 3109
Location: Tulsa, OK
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secretsubmariner
Champagne Wrangler
Joined: January 08, 2011
Posts: 3109
Location: Tulsa, OK
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curtis4085
Samba Member
Joined: July 22, 2011
Posts: 4806
Location: Colorado
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| Posted: Mon Dec 31, 2012 3:50 pm Post subject: |
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| redwagon wrote: |
| That's one clean panel! Did you pick it up locally? |
I did. Ft Collins... But it's been in Cali most of its life till this year. Impoted into New York April 1971.
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curtis4085
Samba Member
Joined: July 22, 2011
Posts: 4806
Location: Colorado
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| Posted: Mon Dec 31, 2012 3:55 pm Post subject: |
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| skills@eurocarsplus wrote: |
| curtis4085 wrote: |
| I really do not drive these old girls for speed. Just pure love and enjoyment. Doing 55mph max is fine by me. I was looking at the Rancho rebuilt trannys. Have you heard any issues with these units? |
well, neither do i but have some extra snap never hurts either. in a light panel (i mean, you're 600 lbs+ lighter than my westy) i wouldn't worry about it.
all i can tell you is you will want to put a gun in your mouth cruising a panel at 55 for any length of time, as they are nothing but an echo chamber.
i would put sound deadener on the firewall tin, and wrap the whole inside of the gas tank cubby. i did this on my bus, and holy shit, it is like a real car, and it dosen't ruin the look. i also did the engine bay, which gets hidden by the sound board and insulation
i never used rancho. feedback forum is your best bet |
That is great info. I have some extra Fat Mat laying around. To keep it hidden is The key. Thank you for the tips. I was thinking Of paneling the whole interior and using sound deadner under it but I hbe a hard time not wanting to keep it lOok stock.
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busdaddy
Samba Member
Joined: February 12, 2004
Posts: 53188
Location: Surrey B.C. Canada, but thinking of Ukraine
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| Posted: Mon Dec 31, 2012 4:22 pm Post subject: |
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| curtis4085 wrote: |
| I was thinking Of paneling the whole interior and using sound deadner under it but I hbe a hard time not wanting to keep it lOok stock. |
I had a 72 with the factory grey hardboard interior, can't recall the M code right now but there is ways to line them and still be stock as it was an option. I agree with Skills, unless you and your passenger wear headphones a trip longer than an hour is a real ordeal.
You say haul around the boys, planning on adding seat brackets in the back?
_________________
Rust NEVER sleeps and stock never goes out of style.
Please don't PM technical questions, ask your problem in public so everyone can play along. If you think it's too stupid post it here
Stop dead photo links! Post your photos to The Samba Gallery!
Слава Україні! |
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curtis4085
Samba Member
Joined: July 22, 2011
Posts: 4806
Location: Colorado
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| Posted: Mon Dec 31, 2012 9:54 pm Post subject: |
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| busdaddy wrote: |
| curtis4085 wrote: |
| I was thinking Of paneling the whole interior and using sound deadner under it but I hbe a hard time not wanting to keep it lOok stock. |
I had a 72 with the factory grey hardboard interior, can't recall the M code right now but there is ways to line them and still be stock as it was an option. I agree with Skills, unless you and your passenger wear headphones a trip longer than an hour is a real ordeal.
You say haul around the boys, planning on adding seat brackets in the back? |
This vehicle will be just for tooling around town. Long trips will break out the Westfalia.
I really need to get some pictures of a Panel with the interior all stock paneled. Mine only has the panel over the slider. Paint code for the panel and cargo grey and pictures and I'm set.
On a different note I'm considering a turnkey 1776 super torque engine from Chico. Might have said that earlier. I'm awaiting all the finally specs and pricing but am almost sold as he comes highly recommended. Of anyone out there has a Anibol engine PM me your experience.
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curtis4085
Samba Member
Joined: July 22, 2011
Posts: 4806
Location: Colorado
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| Posted: Tue Jan 01, 2013 10:10 pm Post subject: |
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Started attacking the rust issues today. Wanted to go easy so i used a drill with a abrasive stripping disk. THere is some pitting in the floor but no threw spots/holes.
The Dash is cleaning up nice. Lots of elbow grease and probably couple more hours before the plastic is all clean. I will have to pull the metal portion of the dash to paint at some point.
The bare metal will get the Por-15 treatment and then rattle canned to match *Temp- till the real paint day... Soda blast all to bare metal and repaint same Pastel White is the unltimate goal.
Next step is get some 3M adhesive remover to get the glue off the pedestal. I have the fresh air deflector out for deep cleaning.
New floor mat in the mail for the front cab area...just realized I could use a walk thru mat as well. The current mats where original and on there last leg.
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curtis4085
Samba Member
Joined: July 22, 2011
Posts: 4806
Location: Colorado
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| Posted: Wed Jan 02, 2013 1:21 pm Post subject: |
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Well looks like I am pulling the trigger on a turnkey for the Panel Van..
Chico in California is the builder.... Anibal Chico whom i have been discussing the specs for the build is very helpful. He has taken the time to fill me in with all aspects of the build. Am looking forward to there great work being in my new bus.
Here is a video of what it will look like when it arrives. Mine will be a 1776 cc.
Question for the collective thesamba gurus.. upgrading from a 1776 to the 1900 cc whats the biggest pros and cons besides a couple more horses. Im gonna be running 36 duel Dellortos. was told the 1776 im getting has same torque just 4-5 hp less.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=qHqkySDlJyI
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skills@eurocarsplus
Samba Peckerhead
Joined: January 01, 2007
Posts: 17939
Location: sticksville, ct.
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| Posted: Wed Jan 02, 2013 1:36 pm Post subject: |
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..
_________________
| gprudenciop wrote: |
my reason for switching to subaru is my german car was turning chinese so i said fuck it and went japanese....... |
| Jake Raby wrote: |
| Thanks for the correction. I used to be a nice guy, then I ruined it by exposing myself to the public. |
| Brian wrote: |
| Also the fact that people are agreeing with Skills, it's a turn of events for samba history |
Last edited by skills@eurocarsplus on Wed Mar 13, 2013 3:04 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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curtis4085
Samba Member
Joined: July 22, 2011
Posts: 4806
Location: Colorado
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| Posted: Wed Jan 02, 2013 2:09 pm Post subject: |
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| skills@eurocarsplus wrote: |
Without knowing the specs on the engine, no one can guess....
Cam?
Heads?
Compression ratio?
Crank?
Rods?
I mean...you can turbo a 1600 and eat a 2180.... |
the engine virtually the same. same cam, same heads, same crank, same rods, the only thing different in this build would be piston size.
the 1776 Im getting has upgraded heads port polish and bigger valves, same as the bigger engine.
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curtis4085
Samba Member
Joined: July 22, 2011
Posts: 4806
Location: Colorado
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| Posted: Wed Jan 02, 2013 3:16 pm Post subject: |
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Below is a spread sheet on a Dyno of same setup just bigger pistons. the one in picture is running 40 Webers mine will be running 36 Dellortos. I am being told by Anibol from Chico the I should get around 95 HPS and 115 torque.
My biggest question is why do some go for a larger engine like a 1914 if a 1776 will almost put out the same horse power?
https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&pid=gmail&a...VUzzaW_O2A
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