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germansupplyscott
Samba Member
Joined: May 22, 2004
Posts: 7094
Location: toronto
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 Posted: Thu Dec 01, 2022 7:45 am Post subject: Re: The Tire Sticky FAQ |
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| jbhurley92 wrote: |
| How is it crazy? |
They are a LOT larger in diameter than the stock 185R14 size. Even if they fit on the vehicle they increase the ratio of every gear by 10% or so, which for gear ratios is a big jump.
The Ecovan is a decent economy-grade summer tire if you can find a 185R14 version.
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Gregg in the 603
Samba Member
Joined: April 13, 2013
Posts: 404
Location: New Hampshire, USA
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| Posted: Thu Dec 01, 2022 7:50 am Post subject: Re: The Tire Sticky FAQ |
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| Quote: |
| Why not buy the 27x8.5 Grabber ATX? |
yo, any intel on un-sprung weight and rotating mass on these bad boys? Something tells me they're heavier and slightly bigger than my Vantra's. Which translates to more wear and tear, slower acceleration, longer braking distances and higher CHT's.
I swapped from 15's to 17's on a car once without changing total diameter. But damn did it slow everything down and lengthen stops.
My bus is already slow and hot enough! Haha.
Can anyone speak to the differences they may have noticed when swapping to General Grabbers?
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1979 Mexico Beige Westy auto
Dirty Dover, NH
Last edited by Gregg in the 603 on Thu Dec 01, 2022 8:04 am; edited 1 time in total |
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jbhurley92
Samba Member
Joined: October 02, 2019
Posts: 121
Location: NC
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| Posted: Thu Dec 01, 2022 7:58 am Post subject: Re: The Tire Sticky FAQ |
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| germansupplyscott wrote: |
| jbhurley92 wrote: |
| How is it crazy? |
They are a LOT larger in diameter than the stock 185R14 size. Even if they fit on the vehicle they increase the ratio of every gear by 10% or so, which for gear ratios is a big jump.
The Ecovan is a decent economy-grade summer tire if you can find a 185R14 version. |
That was my point a lot of people suggest going to the grabbers which are 27" in diameter while the Khumo's are 26.8" |
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jbhurley92
Samba Member
Joined: October 02, 2019
Posts: 121
Location: NC
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| Posted: Thu Dec 01, 2022 8:07 am Post subject: Re: The Tire Sticky FAQ |
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| Earl Bay wrote: |
I've heard ok and bad about the Kumho.
Not sure if the 27/8.5 fit's fine on a Bay because it may rub a bit on full lock (but may just as well not)
However a friend with a Syncro said they are more than scary in the wet.
No personal experience though |
I could see that my vanagon already handles likes shit, I could imagine these mud tires on a heavy synchro that don't handle the best in rain would be big sketch
Wondering how they'd handle on a bay with only concern is rubbing but they are .2" smaller that the grabbers |
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richparker
Samba Member
Joined: November 24, 2011
Posts: 6986
Location: Durango, CO
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| Posted: Thu Dec 01, 2022 8:19 am Post subject: Re: The Tire Sticky FAQ |
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| jbhurley92 wrote: |
How is it crazy? They are .2" smaller in diameter than the ATX. Honestly it's the pricing every tire is so expensive now.
Those grabbers are $170 ea bought my girls vantras for her can for 90 ea now they are 125.
Just checking for deals best I can |
Owning a classic car isn’t cheap. Personally shopping based upon price and buying an inferior product is not the correct way to go about things. Those tires in your link are Mud tires. They are not going to ride well, they will be noisy, they will decrease your gas millage and put more stress on your drivetrain.
If you want the Vantras, buy those. So they are $130 more than they use to be, who cares. Look at what is happening right now with inflation, everything is more expensive. I’m spending $100 more a week for the same items at the grocery store, everything is expensive now. You’re looking at a $40 difference between the mud tires and the Vantras. If you drive your bus regularly you’ll make that $40 up in a few tanks of fuel b/c those mud tires are gonna make your MPGs drop.
Shop eBay, I’m always finding good deals on tires there.
| Gregg in the 603 wrote: |
| Quote: |
| Why not buy the 27x8.5 Grabber ATX? |
yo, any intel on un-sprung weight and rotating mass on these bad boys? Something tells me they're heavier and slightly bigger than my Vantra's. Which translates to more wear and tear, slower acceleration, longer braking distances and higher CHT's.
My bus is already slow and hot enough! Haha.
Can anyone speak to the differences they may have noticed when swapping to General Grabbers? |
I love the Grabbers. I thing the ride on and off road is a lot better then the Vantras, they are quite, don’t impact my MPGs or my CHTs and they look bad ass. I don’t notice any braking, if anything they are better because they offer better grip in all conditions. I also don’t notice them Making my bus slower, but I have a 2275 T1 stroker in my bus.
| jbhurley92 wrote: |
That was my point a lot of people suggest going to the grabbers which are 27" in diameter while the Khumo's are 26.8" |
It’s not a size issue (that’s what she said), it’s a tread pattern issue. Those mud tires and in my opinion any mud tire sucks. Unless you’re consistently driving on wet or dry dirt roads.
Check out my adventure thread link in my signature line. You’ll get a good idea of how I use my bus.
Here’s a recent pic of my bus
_________________
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’71 Westy build
Adventure thread
’65 Deluxe Build
’63 Deluxe Build |
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jbhurley92
Samba Member
Joined: October 02, 2019
Posts: 121
Location: NC
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| Posted: Thu Dec 01, 2022 8:28 am Post subject: Re: The Tire Sticky FAQ |
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It’s not a size issue (that’s what she said), it’s a tread pattern issue. Those mud tires and in my opinion any mud tire sucks. Unless you’re consistently driving on wet or dry dirt roads.
Check out my adventure thread link in my signature line. You’ll get a good idea of how I use my bus.
thank you for your answer!
Maybe I'll hit up discount tire and look at the grabbers. They have the vantra's for $141 ea mount and balance I think the grabbers are $168 |
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soissisc
Samba Member
Joined: April 04, 2007
Posts: 636
Location: Western Pennsylvania
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| Posted: Thu Dec 01, 2022 8:31 am Post subject: Re: The Tire Sticky FAQ |
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I just got this in my email. Rebate on General tires at Tires-easy.com through December.
https://www.tires-easy.com/tire-rebates/general-ti...te+is+here
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68 Westy
92 Jetta (oh it is retired)
99 Eurovan
05 NBC
06 Audi A3
72 Westy (I am going to fix it up) |
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Willin
Samba Member
Joined: October 10, 2019
Posts: 109
Location: Bozeman Mt
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| Posted: Thu Dec 01, 2022 8:33 am Post subject: Re: The Tire Sticky FAQ |
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I put the Grabbers on my 73. Stock wheels.
First of all they are not 27''. If you measure radius to the ground, I get @13". And eyeballing the diameter with a tape measure, @26.5".
You can't go off what the tire companies say. I don't know how they measure, and wheel width matters.
I can only go off what I measure, versus what the stated size of a "stock" tire is. My calculations say, my rpms dropped @50 at speed. Not very much. ( I don't have a tach.)
I just got my bus aligned at a shop. I had been dealing with handling issues, and now it handles a lot better. Hopefully the tight balljoints will loosen up which will help more.
The young mechanic said "It's a bus, it's going to handle like crap no matter what" and " Those BIG tires don't help" But I also had to tell him how to adjust the rear alignment. This at the local "air-cooled vw " shop.
The Grabbers work fine. My biggest complaint is the gravel stuck in the tread sounds like gunshots after hitting the pavement. ( I am thinking of some kind of undercoating in the wheel wells.) |
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richparker
Samba Member
Joined: November 24, 2011
Posts: 6986
Location: Durango, CO
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jbhurley92
Samba Member
Joined: October 02, 2019
Posts: 121
Location: NC
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| Posted: Thu Dec 01, 2022 8:41 am Post subject: Re: The Tire Sticky FAQ |
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| richparker wrote: |
^$672 isn’t a bad price for 4 Grabbers, in this economy. My LTS was unable to get the 28x8.5 size for me, so I had to order mine off eBay and pay them $75 to mount and balance them.
Here’s the cheapest I can find them on eBay.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/153887849010?mkcid=16&...media=COPY |
Yeah I need to do tie rods and ball joints on the front was underneath it and they are ruined from sitting in a field for 20 years.
Gotta admit though a vw bus sitting on muds would be sweet looking. |
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Wildthings
Samba Member
Joined: March 13, 2005
Posts: 50353
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| Posted: Fri Dec 02, 2022 9:49 am Post subject: Re: The Tire Sticky FAQ |
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I have 27x8.5R14 matched with a 002 with slightly modified gearing. My engine rpms in forth are about the same as an 091 with stock 185r14 tires, but I have a larger gap between 3rd and 4th, so the three lower gears are a bit lower than what a stock 091 would offer.
I presently have three General Grabbers mixed with a single Maxxix Bravo 751. As a guess I believe the Maxxis will give about 50% better treadwear than the General Grabbers. It seems though that the Maxxis are not common in North America at this point. |
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NASkeet
Samba Member
Joined: April 29, 2006
Posts: 2958
Location: South Benfleet, Essex, UK
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| Posted: Fri Dec 02, 2022 12:45 pm Post subject: Re: The Tire Sticky FAQ |
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| Cap10323 wrote: |
| 78BusGA wrote: |
OK yeah after reading the reviews of the Bridgestone Blizzak LM-32 M + S, I am more convinced they'll be a temporary tire for working on the bus, unless ya'll think they'd be ok for regular driving.
 I saw that Vantra comes in the 205/55 R16 size, but on a 16" rim would they still be a good tire for a lighter kombi, or would there be another suggestion? |
The Blizzaks have a load rating of 99. The general consensus seems to be that's on the low end of acceptable.
But I'd say if you have a passenger van, they'd be fine if you do most of your driving unloaded. |
If using a 16 inch diameter wheel, the tyre which is closest in external diameter to the original factory-fitted 185 SR14 Heavy-Duty/Reinforced (i.e. 185/80 R14 Extra-Load) or 185 SR14C (i.e. 185/80 R14C) is the 195/65 R16C (a very-common commercial-van tyre size in Great Britain), which is about 1% larger. The 205/65 R16C and 215/65 R16C sizes are also common here.
It's my general impression that there is a lot of ignorance and confusion about tyre load indeces, tyre "maximum" load ratings and tyre "actual in-service" load ratings!   
The load index and corresponding "maximum" load rating, is specified for that tyre, at a particular inflation pressure, which might be much higher than the inflation pressure recommended for one's vehicle. If inflated to a lower air pressure the tyre's actual in-service load rating will be lower than the tyre's published "maximum" load rating. Hence a high load index can be deceptive and potentially hazardous if misinterpreted!
It might be wise to peruse the load rating versus inflation pressure tables at the following links for clarification:
https://tirepressure.org/tire-load-range-chart
https://tirepressure.org/tire-load-range-chart
https://tirepressure.org/general-metric-tire-load-inflation-chart
https://tirepressure.org/metric-tire-load-inflation-chart
https://tirepressure.org/p-metric-tire-load-inflation-chart
https://tirepressure.org/lt-metric-tire-load-inflation-chart
https://tirepressure.org/temporary-spare-tire-load-and-inflation-chart
https://tirepressure.org/special-trailer-tire-load-and-inflation-chart
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Regards.
Nigel A. Skeet
Independent tutor (semi-retired) of mathematics, physics, technology & engineering for secondary, tertiary, further & higher education.
Much modified, RHD 1973 VW "1600" Type 2 Westfalia Continental campervan, with the World's only decent, cross-over-arm, SWF pantograph rear-window wiper
Onetime member, plus former Technical Editor & Editor of Transporter Talk magazine
Volkswagen Type 2 Owners' Club (Great Britain)
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W1K1
Samba Member
Joined: March 04, 2004
Posts: 4921
Location: Southern AB
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| Posted: Wed Dec 14, 2022 3:44 pm Post subject: Re: The Tire Sticky FAQ |
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I have gone round and round looking at tires and comparing wheel sizes,
there are very few options in Canada for the 14" tires for the 71 Westy, CIP carries 14" Nankang. Or we can order the 27x8.5R14 General Grabber in the USA and have shipped to the border for pickup, that would be the simplest option, but looking at long term ownership .... and availability
I have been looking at the 16" wheel/tire option because at least there are a few options in 215/65-16 in light truck tires with a proper load range in 16", not so much in 15" tires, and if you happen to screw up a tire, it's not a month-long ordeal to get a new tire, or two.
My question is, is someone running 16"s on an early bay and what's your take on running 16's vs 14's, and what wheel is going to work without rubbing?
the 7.5" wide from Go westy seems like a jump compared to the stock 5.5", and I'm okay with steel wheels too
GO WESTY. BLACK. 16 x 7.5". 5/112 bolt pattern. Offset (ET) 23. Fits bay window Buses 1971-1979
and how long are we going to have a 14" tire option before the tire manufacturers pull the plug?
there seems to be a lot of 15" wheels but not a lot of tire options for them either in the 215/65-15 with a proper load rating, or am I looking at the wrong size?
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1973 super
1965 squareback 1500E
1971 bay window westy- subi swap |
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cdennisg
Samba Member
Joined: November 02, 2004
Posts: 20279
Location: Sandpoint, ID
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| Posted: Wed Dec 14, 2022 7:51 pm Post subject: Re: The Tire Sticky FAQ |
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| W1K1 wrote: |
I have gone round and round looking at tires and comparing wheel sizes,
there are very few options in Canada for the 14" tires for the 71 Westy, CIP carries 14" Nankang. Or we can order the 27x8.5R14 General Grabber in the USA and have shipped to the border for pickup, that would be the simplest option, but looking at long term ownership .... and availability
I have been looking at the 16" wheel/tire option because at least there are a few options in 215/65-16 in light truck tires with a proper load range in 16", not so much in 15" tires, and if you happen to screw up a tire, it's not a month-long ordeal to get a new tire, or two.
My question is, is someone running 16"s on an early bay and what's your take on running 16's vs 14's, and what wheel is going to work without rubbing?
the 7.5" wide from Go westy seems like a jump compared to the stock 5.5", and I'm okay with steel wheels too
GO WESTY. BLACK. 16 x 7.5". 5/112 bolt pattern. Offset (ET) 23. Fits bay window Buses 1971-1979
and how long are we going to have a 14" tire option before the tire manufacturers pull the plug?
there seems to be a lot of 15" wheels but not a lot of tire options for them either in the 215/65-15 with a proper load rating, or am I looking at the wrong size? |
I am an hour south of the border here in North Idaho. If I can help with getting tires around here for you, let me know.
I run the 27x8.5r14LT Starfire SF 510 on my 68 single cab. Great tire, made by cooper, and available at my local tire dealer. Last I looked they were still just over a hundred bucks each.
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germansupplyscott
Samba Member
Joined: May 22, 2004
Posts: 7094
Location: toronto
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| Posted: Thu Dec 15, 2022 7:38 am Post subject: Re: The Tire Sticky FAQ |
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Sick photo, beauty Bus.
The Grabber is available in Canada but this is a bad time of year to buy 185R14C tires. (In my supplier ordering screen I see only 4x available nationally) I mean, every time is a bad time for Bus tires here because the Canadian distributors don't care about servicing this market segment, I know this from years of trying to convince anyone in the tire industry in Canada who'd listen, that we need a reliable supply of proper tires. They don't care! But early to mid summer is a lot better. The other suggestion for Canadians is to look in Quebec - their market seems to be discrete from the rest of the country and they have different products available than the rest of the country.
Or the offer of Idahoan help might be great!
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pittwagen
Samba Member
Joined: November 08, 2005
Posts: 766
Location: North of the 49th parallel
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| Posted: Thu Dec 15, 2022 8:25 am Post subject: Re: The Tire Sticky FAQ |
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Don't forget about Canada Customs and what the will and will not allow with respect to tires. As well, Canada now has free trade agreements with the UK and EU so tires there may be an option. Shipping may be costly though.
It would be worthwhile to contact Canada Customs and see what they say. If the tires are made in the US, importing into Canada should be covered by CUSMA or whatever its called.
I live in Metro Vancouver and many of us have mailboxes in the US. For me it is 45 minute trip down to Sumas, WA. to avoid the higher shipping costs from the US to Canada. There may be limits on the size of the order though. FYI. |
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W1K1
Samba Member
Joined: March 04, 2004
Posts: 4921
Location: Southern AB
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| Posted: Thu Dec 15, 2022 9:52 am Post subject: Re: The Tire Sticky FAQ |
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We are only an hour from the Coutts/Sweet Grass border in Montana so pickup is not an issue.
I just wonder about long term availability VS just switching to 16" wheels and tires now, and being able to buy tires locally, or if we are on a road trip and have an issue.
I know I can get the K02's or Grabbers in 16 inch easily enough
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1973 super
1965 squareback 1500E
1971 bay window westy- subi swap |
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cdennisg
Samba Member
Joined: November 02, 2004
Posts: 20279
Location: Sandpoint, ID
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| Posted: Thu Dec 15, 2022 10:01 am Post subject: Re: The Tire Sticky FAQ |
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Recently I looked at the tires on one of the modern small vans. Pretty sure it was a Ford Transit. It had 16" tires that were have load rated. I think they were 205/65's maybe? Might have to look into that again, but if they are readily available in that size it might be a good option for you.
EDIT: a real hasty search shows the Ford transit originally used a 215/55r16 tire. Might be a little small in overall diameter. But they are load rated. Maybe a 215/65r16 would work? They end up around 27" diameter, but are fairly wide.
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NASkeet
Samba Member
Joined: April 29, 2006
Posts: 2958
Location: South Benfleet, Essex, UK
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| Posted: Fri Dec 23, 2022 1:24 pm Post subject: Re: The Tire Sticky FAQ |
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| cdennisg wrote: |
Recently I looked at the tires on one of the modern small vans. Pretty sure it was a Ford Transit. It had 16" tires that were have load rated. I think they were 205/65's maybe? Might have to look into that again, but if they are readily available in that size it might be a good option for you.
EDIT: a real hasty search shows the Ford transit originally used a 215/55r16 tire. Might be a little small in overall diameter. But they are load rated. Maybe a 215/65r16 would work? They end up around 27" diameter, but are fairly wide. |
I would be surprised if a Ford Transit were factory-fitted with 215/55 R16 tyres! The 195/65 R16C or 205/65 R16C commercial-van tyres seem much more likely. In Great Britain, 65-Series commercial-van tyres on 16 inch wheels, have been used on the Ford Tourneo (minibus version of the Ford Transit) for many years.
I intend to used either 205/65 R16C or 215/65 R16C commercial-van tyres on 7 x 16 inch Mercedes C-Class alloy wheels (37 mm offset) on my 1973 VW "1600" Type 2 with 1911 cc, VW 412 LE, VW Type 4 style engine.
_________________
Regards.
Nigel A. Skeet
Independent tutor (semi-retired) of mathematics, physics, technology & engineering for secondary, tertiary, further & higher education.
Much modified, RHD 1973 VW "1600" Type 2 Westfalia Continental campervan, with the World's only decent, cross-over-arm, SWF pantograph rear-window wiper
Onetime member, plus former Technical Editor & Editor of Transporter Talk magazine
Volkswagen Type 2 Owners' Club (Great Britain)
http://www.vwt2oc.net |
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cdennisg
Samba Member
Joined: November 02, 2004
Posts: 20279
Location: Sandpoint, ID
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| Posted: Fri Dec 23, 2022 2:11 pm Post subject: Re: The Tire Sticky FAQ |
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| NASkeet wrote: |
| cdennisg wrote: |
Recently I looked at the tires on one of the modern small vans. Pretty sure it was a Ford Transit. It had 16" tires that were have load rated. I think they were 205/65's maybe? Might have to look into that again, but if they are readily available in that size it might be a good option for you.
EDIT: a real hasty search shows the Ford transit originally used a 215/55r16 tire. Might be a little small in overall diameter. But they are load rated. Maybe a 215/65r16 would work? They end up around 27" diameter, but are fairly wide. |
I would be surprised if a Ford Transit were factory-fitted with 215/55 R16 tyres! The 195/65 R16C or 205/65 R16C commercial-van tyres seem much more likely. In Great Britain, 65-Series commercial-van tyres on 16 inch wheels, have been used on the Ford Tourneo (minibus version of the Ford Transit) for many years.
I intend to used either 205/65 R16C or 215/65 R16C commercial-van tyres on 7 x 16 inch Mercedes C-Class alloy wheels (37 mm offset) on my 1973 VW "1600" Type 2 with 1911 cc, VW 412 LE, VW Type 4 style engine. |
Like I said, it was a hasty search. But that is what popped up on tire rack when searching a 2014 Ford Transit Connect LWB uses a 215/55r16. It jumps up to a 235 on some later years and models.
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