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Kris Styes Samba Member
Joined: March 15, 2004 Posts: 712 Location: Freeze Your Ass Off Kansas
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Posted: Fri Aug 25, 2006 8:34 am Post subject: Thermostat Bracket Modification To Accept New Style Thermo |
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Thermostat Bracket Modification To Accept New Style Thermostat.
Coiled or bellow style thermostats are getting hard to find and pricy. VW produces a new type / style thermostat at this time. The problem with the new style thermostat is the bracket it requires to mount on the engine block. It is nearly impossible to find! Go figure!
Pictured below is how I modified the old style thermostat bracket to accept the new style thermostat. Tested and works fine.
Tools Needed:
Jigsaw with fine tooth metal cutting blade
Use of grinder
7/64 Metal bit
Total Time = 1 hour, start to painted finish.
T1 Thermostat Bracket
T1 Thermostat Bracket With Termostat Mounted
New Style Thermostat
Bottom, New Style Thermostat - Notice Lock Pin On Bottom
Using 7/64 or 1/8 Bit, Drill Hole Between "Button Weld" And Mounting Hole
Cut Away Existing "Hoop" And Angle Support So New Style Thermostat Fits Flat On Bracket.
Another View Of Cut.
Finished Bracket With New Style Thermostat Mounted. Lock Pin On Thermostat Fits Into 7/64 Hole And Provides For Some Movement For Rod Alignment.
Kris (Kanas) _________________ Nothing to say! |
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gerg a.k.a. 6volt65
Joined: April 25, 2003 Posts: 5454 Location: Monroe, LA
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Posted: Fri Aug 25, 2006 9:39 am Post subject: |
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Kris - How has this new thermo worked for you?
I have heard good and bad feedback in the past.
I pressume most of the bad was lack of a way to mount the new style in the old holder.
Very nice work! _________________ Gerg
. . . I got 99 problems and my bus ain't one . . .
'65 Sunroof Beetle
'65 Vert
'60 Singlecab |
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Kris Styes Samba Member
Joined: March 15, 2004 Posts: 712 Location: Freeze Your Ass Off Kansas
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Posted: Fri Aug 25, 2006 9:45 am Post subject: |
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Greg:
Asjusting the new system (on the block) is not much different than the bellow ones. I had to learn the top end of flap opening by trial and error (just like a bellow one)
Functions fine. Two 100 mile runs to test it. One "hot" day, the other, this AM, when it was cooler. After final adjustment on block, I can't really tell any difference between the old and new style (function).
Hope this helps.
K _________________ Nothing to say! |
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mailman Samba Member
Joined: March 24, 2005 Posts: 1663
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Posted: Fri Aug 25, 2006 4:29 pm Post subject: |
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Kris...
Great info...thanks! Two questions come to mind. What's the approximate cost of the new style thermostat? Does the new unit accept the same rod as the old style? Maybe one more....what's the temperature range on the new one? _________________ '64 Bahama Blue Beetle / steel sunroof
'64 Bahama Blue Beetle Sedan (future ragtop) |
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Kris Styes Samba Member
Joined: March 15, 2004 Posts: 712 Location: Freeze Your Ass Off Kansas
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Posted: Fri Aug 25, 2006 5:53 pm Post subject: |
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Mailman:
Good Questions. Sorry for not posting them with original post!
VW Number on new thermostat is 111 119 159 A, which is the same part number as the original thermostat. With that in mind, the new style thermostati shares the same temperature range as the original bellow type.
I purchsed two of the new style thermostats for $ 15.00 each. I have seen them as low as $ 7.50, but in catalogs, they can go for $ 40-50. There is one on SAMBA now for $ 50.00. People just don't know much about them, and with the mounting bracket issue, people are not purchasing them (I'm only guessing on this)
I used the same rod that attached to my bellow thermostat. Worked fine!
Hope this helps,
Kris (Kansas) _________________ Nothing to say! |
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johneliot Samba Member
Joined: August 29, 2005 Posts: 2189 Location: Chico, CA
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Posted: Fri Aug 25, 2006 6:08 pm Post subject: |
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I'm going from memory and this comes from other posts here, but what I have heard from others is that when the old style fails, it fails in the open position. I don't think this is true of the new style. Those in the know, chime in.
John _________________ John
There is no distinctly American criminal class - except Congress.
Mark Twain
69 bug - "The Grey Ghost" |
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Kris Styes Samba Member
Joined: March 15, 2004 Posts: 712 Location: Freeze Your Ass Off Kansas
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Posted: Fri Aug 25, 2006 6:23 pm Post subject: |
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I believe the return spring mounted on the rear of the cooler housing (hooked to flap rods) keep the flaps in the open position when and if a thermostat fails.
Anyone want to confirm?
Kris _________________ Nothing to say! |
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WickedWagens Samba Member
Joined: April 09, 2004 Posts: 190 Location: Carson City, NV
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Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2006 1:00 pm Post subject: |
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Kris if you don't mind me asking, where did you get your thermostat? _________________ 1968 Ghia Land Speed Car
G/CFALT 106.643 MPH
G/CGALT 113.131 MPH
G/CBGALT 134.606 MPH
G/CBFALT 146.715 MPH
G/CBGC 158.242 MPH
H/CPRO 93.383 MPH
H/CBGC 94.33 MPH
H/CBGALT 101.282 MPH
H/CBFALT 120.591 MPH |
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Kris Styes Samba Member
Joined: March 15, 2004 Posts: 712 Location: Freeze Your Ass Off Kansas
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Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2006 1:43 pm Post subject: |
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I got my from Wooster VW in Salina, Ks.
Kris _________________ Nothing to say! |
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John M. Samba Member
Joined: July 22, 2005 Posts: 3833 Location: Boulder, CO
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Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2006 1:48 pm Post subject: |
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Kris Styes wrote: |
I believe the return spring mounted on the rear of the cooler housing (hooked to flap rods) keep the flaps in the open position when and if a thermostat fails.
Anyone want to confirm?
Kris |
The new thermostats fail in the closed position, so it doesn't matter. Hope you have some way of monitoring the temps in-case it does fail and your driving with the flaps closed. That could be disastrous in just a few miles. _________________
Current: 1972 Beetle - 96V EV
Previous:
1966 Beetle - Sea Blue - 1300SP
1966 Beetle - Sea Blue - 1600SP
1974 Beetle - African Red - 1914CC
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Jeff Geisen Samba Chaplain
Joined: December 21, 2004 Posts: 1883 Location: N.W. Georgia
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Posted: Mon Aug 20, 2007 1:03 pm Post subject: |
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... agreed, the spring type thermostat fails closed. The return spring on the shutter linkage bar keeps the shutters closed when cold, keeps the fan from blowing them open too soon.
IMHO, the new style thermo gives a false savings over the bellows style, which was designed to make the cooling system fail safe. _________________ I Corinthians 4: 1 thru 5
‘63 ragtop - ‘68 single cab |
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johnanddes Satellite Wrangler
Joined: October 17, 2004 Posts: 692 Location: Orcutt CA
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Posted: Mon Aug 20, 2007 1:58 pm Post subject: |
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Dave from vw-resource.com has a mexican style installed and is pleased. Here is the link:
http://www.vw-resource.com/thermostat.html
I tihnk he did the same thing you did as far as the bracket. _________________ John
1969 documented numbers matching bug
1968 F250
Keepin the ISS from colliding with space junk |
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Jody '71 Samba Member
Joined: July 16, 2005 Posts: 2842 Location: Manassas VA
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Posted: Tue Aug 21, 2007 4:45 am Post subject: |
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So, as of now, when you go to a VW dealership and get the 111-119-159A and open the box, you get the Mexican new style?? Or can you specify the old original bellows style? The last time I ordered this part from my local dealership it was still active, but not in stock. This was the original bellows style. They had to order it, I got my order in one day. I ordered 2. They were $54.62 a piece. This was April 2006. So is the original bellows style no longer made by VW??? _________________ '66 Beetle
2011 Hyundai Elantra Touring |
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RevKevin Samba Member
Joined: April 07, 2007 Posts: 246 Location: Seattle
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Posted: Sun Aug 17, 2008 9:28 pm Post subject: |
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Any idea how many mods would be required to fit it onto the type 4 setup? |
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39coupe Samba Member
Joined: April 08, 2008 Posts: 184 Location: Gwinnett, GA
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Posted: Mon Aug 18, 2008 5:55 am Post subject: |
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What are the ramification's of removing the flaps and thermo? Can anything be harmed by doing this or is it like removing the thermo from a water cooled vehicle, it just takes longer for the engine to warm up?
I'm rather new to the Air cooled engines, I have 2 1200 engines and rebuilt 1, it had the flaps and the thermo the other has no flaps and no thermo. When I rebuilt I put the flaps in with the thermo which I probably need to replace. _________________ www.aircooledaddicts.org
Aircooled Addicts
'65 Beetle (red)
'65 Beetle (panama beige)
'65 Mustang
'39 Chevy Coupe |
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Russ Wolfe Samba Member
Joined: October 08, 2004 Posts: 25187 Location: Central Iowa
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Posted: Mon Aug 18, 2008 10:17 am Post subject: |
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The original style thermostats are available, but at about $80.
The mexican thermostats DO fail in the closed position.
I have a few good used thermostats available.
I even went to an auction a while back and bid on 3 rusted out hulks because the thermostats were still in the cars. _________________ Society is like stew. If you don't keep it stirred up, you end up with a lot of scum on the top!--Edward Abbey
Gary: OK. Ima poop. |
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capeoddboy Samba Member
Joined: November 08, 2003 Posts: 231 Location: Las Vegas
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Posted: Wed Sep 10, 2008 2:12 pm Post subject: no thermostat |
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If I have no thermostat installed ( I will install it soon ) and the spring on the flaps is installed, am I running with the flaps closed?
Also, if I take the spring off will that cure the cooling problem until I can get the proper rod and thermostat installed?
Thanks,
Tim |
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KTPhil Samba Member
Joined: April 06, 2006 Posts: 34021 Location: Conejo Valley, CA
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Posted: Wed Sep 10, 2008 2:34 pm Post subject: |
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The flap spring works to keep them open. The thermostat works against that spring when it is cold. |
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capeoddboy Samba Member
Joined: November 08, 2003 Posts: 231 Location: Las Vegas
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Posted: Wed Sep 10, 2008 2:42 pm Post subject: |
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Thanks. I thought some previous posts said the spring held the flaps closed. |
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KTPhil Samba Member
Joined: April 06, 2006 Posts: 34021 Location: Conejo Valley, CA
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Posted: Wed Sep 10, 2008 4:57 pm Post subject: |
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Well, stay tuned, because it's been 20 years since I took my Bug apart. Get a "second opinion." |
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