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esde Samba Member

Joined: October 20, 2007 Posts: 6181 Location: central rust belt
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Posted: Fri Jan 20, 2023 7:41 pm Post subject: Re: Replacing Convertible Support Rails Explained |
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Rather than add to this post, which seems to be mostly questions and pictures with dead links, I've started a new thread on the 65 convertible I'm fixing. Pictures and descriptions are here
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=776759 _________________ modok wrote:
Bent cranks are silent but gather no moss. I mean, ah, something like that. |
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esde Samba Member

Joined: October 20, 2007 Posts: 6181 Location: central rust belt
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Posted: Wed Jan 18, 2023 8:39 pm Post subject: Re: Replacing Convertible Support Rails Explained |
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SOoooo,
I'm getting ready to install new floor pans, heater channels, and support rails on a 65 beetle. The original parts were pretty well rotted away, so not much evidence on how things were originally. I currently have the Klassic Fab channels bolted to the Wolfsburg West rails and floor pans to make sure the holes all line up. I assume the factory had the rails welded to the heater channels, can anyone comment on the number of welds and spacing? It feels like drilling the rails so I can plug weld would be the right way, but for all I know Karmann just stitch welded the edges. Any help is appreciated.
SD _________________ modok wrote:
Bent cranks are silent but gather no moss. I mean, ah, something like that. |
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buntist Samba Member
Joined: August 26, 2019 Posts: 162
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Posted: Mon Mar 08, 2021 8:16 pm Post subject: Re: Replacing Convertible Support Rails Explained |
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Has anyone found reinforcement rails with a bulge in the front on the passenger side? This is where the wire harness runs.
WW just told me theirs doesn’t have one.
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Temo Samba Member

Joined: April 11, 2006 Posts: 321 Location: Upland, Ca
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Posted: Wed Jul 01, 2020 9:59 pm Post subject: Re: Replacing Convertible Support Rails Explained |
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I'm replacing the heater channels on a '72 SB convertible.
Do you recommend that keep the doors?
If my pillars are rusted away, doesn't that mess up the proper fitting of the door?
Is there a measurement that I can go by?
Thanks. _________________ Temo.
2021 Tiguan R
2017 Tiguan
2015 Passat TDI
'72 Convertible Under Construction |
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jeffff Samba Member

Joined: February 23, 2006 Posts: 1044 Location: Alberta, Canada
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Posted: Fri Apr 24, 2020 4:07 pm Post subject: Re: Replacing Convertible Support Rails Explained |
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Would it be possible to just replace the support rails (weld them to the bottom of the channel) without seperating the body? Assuming of course the heater channels aren't rusty as well...unlikely but you never know haha.
The picture above makes it look like the support rails are not only welded but attached, in a groove. |
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far rider  Samba Member

Joined: August 30, 2005 Posts: 900 Location: Rutland, VT
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Posted: Thu Oct 25, 2018 12:19 pm Post subject: Re: Replacing Convertible Support Rails Explained |
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Wire harness ran thru it. _________________ 67 zenith blue sunroof
Contentment; when what you have is what you want. |
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Daverham Samba Member

Joined: August 27, 2009 Posts: 1397 Location: USA
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Posted: Thu Oct 25, 2018 11:23 am Post subject: Re: Replacing Convertible Support Rails Explained |
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After digging around the web a bit more, I believe I've found that the tube would contain the wiring harness. Odd to me, since a hardtop car doesn't even have that support rail... so I don't know why the wiring harness wouldn't just go in the same place as it does on the hardtops... unless it goes through the roof maybe! |
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Daverham Samba Member

Joined: August 27, 2009 Posts: 1397 Location: USA
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Posted: Thu Oct 25, 2018 10:59 am Post subject: Re: Replacing Convertible Support Rails Explained |
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This is a really helpful image. But what's that little tube running through the bottom part of the rail?
Heater channel is up top... is the lower part something to do with charcoal canister? The defrost doesn't go through there does it?
-- |
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far rider  Samba Member

Joined: August 30, 2005 Posts: 900 Location: Rutland, VT
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Posted: Fri Feb 24, 2017 5:24 am Post subject: Re: Replacing Convertible Support Rails Explained |
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Sounds good to me. I think if you do a search you'll find that's been done alteady. If I had to do mine over I think I would leave the doors in, maybe even tack them in place to be sure the end gap would be exact. I used internal bracing and was off a bit in the end. Another thing I would do different is when I replaced the front clip I used the fenders to line up bolt holes. My mistake was not also putting on the hood to get exact curvature. Good luck. Big job for sure but it can be done. _________________ 67 zenith blue sunroof
Contentment; when what you have is what you want. |
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ADDA Samba Member
Joined: December 27, 2011 Posts: 19 Location: Geordieland UK
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Posted: Wed Feb 08, 2017 10:05 am Post subject: Re: Replacing Convertible Support Rails Explained |
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I appreciate this is an old thread however I'm in the process of restoring my 63. I'm having some serious problems with door gaps on driver side about 15mm more at the top and 10mm more at the bottom compared to the passenger side isn't too bad and I can live with it. I was thinking of removing the body install new floorpans then chop out heater channels etc tack in new heater channels and marry up body and chassis then line body up with doors and when looks fine tack everything up brace and unbolt it and weld the heater channels and sill strengtheners that then put it back together .
If this car was in US it would of been cut up years ago whereas in UK early convertibles are hard to come by....and parts. |
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YodaBug Samba Member
Joined: February 07, 2016 Posts: 1 Location: Cincinnati
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far rider  Samba Member

Joined: August 30, 2005 Posts: 900 Location: Rutland, VT
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Posted: Tue Sep 22, 2015 1:50 pm Post subject: |
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Support rails are in. Finally got the body work done. 63 beryl green convertible finally in a coat of paint.
_________________ 67 zenith blue sunroof
Contentment; when what you have is what you want. |
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far rider  Samba Member

Joined: August 30, 2005 Posts: 900 Location: Rutland, VT
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Posted: Tue Sep 23, 2014 9:17 am Post subject: |
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Yeah, I'd leave what's there and drive/enjoy it. Good luck! _________________ 67 zenith blue sunroof
Contentment; when what you have is what you want. |
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Mike Fisher Samba Member

Joined: January 30, 2006 Posts: 18027 Location: Eugene, OR
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Posted: Tue Sep 23, 2014 7:28 am Post subject: |
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The square tubing tucks & looks fine. The C channel cross bar that is bolted on is the only part I might change. If the doors gaps are not rubbing/chipping the paint, then they are fine too. Paint the pans top & bottom with Master Series or POR 15. _________________ https://imgur.com/user/FisherSquareback/posts
69 FI/AT square Daily Driver
66 sunroof,67,70,71,71,71AT,72,72AT,73 Parts
two 57 oval ragtops sold
'68 Karmann Ghia sold
Society is like stew. If you don't keep it stirred up you end up with a lot of scum on the top! - Russ_Wolfe/Edward Abbey |
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laguest Samba Member
Joined: July 05, 2011 Posts: 43
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Posted: Mon Sep 22, 2014 6:31 pm Post subject: |
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Thanks far rider, great info
The driver door has the same gap, the passenger a bit smaller at the bottom. I can take some pics and post later in the week. The guy I bought it from said he spent time trying to get the gaps even with the top down. The shop said with the top down they should be off a bit as you need to make the gap equal with the top up?
Looked behind the back and seat and its solid.
Had my wife stood on the door jam on the passenger side and jump up and down a bit, I didn't see anything flex, I then did the same (206 lbs) and she said nothing moved when looking at where the support rails are supposed to be. |
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far rider  Samba Member

Joined: August 30, 2005 Posts: 900 Location: Rutland, VT
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Posted: Sun Sep 21, 2014 4:21 am Post subject: |
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I am not a professional but have worked on several convertibles. So what follows is just my ideas.
It's hard to tell without seeing the car but the repair seems ok. Do your door gaps seem equal top to bottom? On driver and pass side?
As far as the body lines off on the passenger door and the door dropping a bit that could be from when the original support rails went south and the body went a little out of align. Then the replacement metal was installed without realigning the body.
There is some adjustment in the door, did you try adjusting it?
What happens if you stand or put some good weight oh the threshold with the door open? If you see or feel the threshold give/sag, not good. If there is no movement, good. If the latter is the case I would drive the car as is and not worry. You'll never win 'most original' but who cares:)
Just an FYI; as you now know, Original vert pans would not have the Jack point on the pan. It would be in the support rail. Other than that the pans are the same. So not a big thing, just jack the car from other points.
Another major problem area on convertibles is the luggage area behind the back seat. Did you look under the rug there? Usually rusty.
Too bad the seller didn't point out the repairs. _________________ 67 zenith blue sunroof
Contentment; when what you have is what you want. |
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laguest Samba Member
Joined: July 05, 2011 Posts: 43
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Posted: Sat Sep 20, 2014 9:24 pm Post subject: |
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Here is a link to the bottom of the 67 vert we just picked up.
http://gallery.guestfamily.com/1967-Blue
Like I said in my other post we are not hard core bug people so we missed the fact that the reinforcement rails didn't get installed. They put in this extra support instead.
Trying to figure out if we leave it in, or have them weld in new support rails. I wont know the cost for the work until next week sometime.
While we like this bug if this is going to be an issue or cost us a ton of $$ then maybe its better to unload it, take a loss and find something a bit more solid.
Any advice would be appreciated.
Thanks |
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laguest Samba Member
Joined: July 05, 2011 Posts: 43
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Posted: Sat Sep 20, 2014 11:53 am Post subject: |
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Thanks, they didn't say anything at the shop about the car sagging. They did say that the passenger door does not align. When you open that door it drops down a bit.
I am going to try and take a bunch of pics and post them.
Whats a good way to see if the car is sagging right now?
Thanks again! |
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far rider  Samba Member

Joined: August 30, 2005 Posts: 900 Location: Rutland, VT
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Posted: Sat Sep 20, 2014 11:17 am Post subject: |
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Heres a cut away of a heater channel and support rail. Never done it but I think you could replace support rails without removing body if your heater channels are solid. Good luck _________________ 67 zenith blue sunroof
Contentment; when what you have is what you want. |
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far rider  Samba Member

Joined: August 30, 2005 Posts: 900 Location: Rutland, VT
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Posted: Sat Sep 20, 2014 11:13 am Post subject: |
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I agree. if the car sits good now, no sag, doors open and shut fine I'd leave it and drive it. Your home rails might even be stronger than replacements. _________________ 67 zenith blue sunroof
Contentment; when what you have is what you want. |
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