Author |
Message |
cdennisg Samba Member
Joined: November 02, 2004 Posts: 20278 Location: Sandpoint, ID
|
Posted: Sat Nov 11, 2017 2:39 pm Post subject: Re: Specs. of tire, wheel, and suspension - Lowered Buses |
|
|
The wheels with a beetle offset are tough to use on a lowered bus without narrowing the front, or using tiny tires. Stock bus wheels will fit much better.
You could try a 185/50R15 tire up front. 195/60r15 is perfect for the rear. _________________ nothing |
|
Back to top |
|
|
nvmipis1 Samba Member
Joined: August 25, 2012 Posts: 246 Location: riverside , ca.
|
Posted: Sun Nov 12, 2017 2:21 am Post subject: Re: Specs. of tire, wheel, and suspension - Lowered Buses |
|
|
Front is 165/50/15
Rear is 195/60/15
Rides like a champ! And not tubbed! |
|
Back to top |
|
|
cdennisg Samba Member
Joined: November 02, 2004 Posts: 20278 Location: Sandpoint, ID
|
Posted: Sun Nov 12, 2017 10:11 am Post subject: Re: Specs. of tire, wheel, and suspension - Lowered Buses |
|
|
^^^ Narrowed beam? _________________ nothing |
|
Back to top |
|
|
nvmipis1 Samba Member
Joined: August 25, 2012 Posts: 246 Location: riverside , ca.
|
Posted: Sun Nov 12, 2017 10:27 am Post subject: Re: Specs. of tire, wheel, and suspension - Lowered Buses |
|
|
Yes...4inch |
|
Back to top |
|
|
EeVeeWee Samba Member
Joined: April 02, 2015 Posts: 836 Location: Amersfoort, Netherlands
|
Posted: Wed Jan 10, 2018 1:50 am Post subject: Re: Specs. of tire, wheel, and suspension - Lowered Buses |
|
|
I can't find it till now, so I will ask here.
Does anybody know the standard stroke of a 1967 stock front beam?
With other words, when the bus is lifted, how much space must there be above the front wheels?
To be sure they will never touch the metal of the bus. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
EeVeeWee Samba Member
Joined: April 02, 2015 Posts: 836 Location: Amersfoort, Netherlands
|
Posted: Thu Jan 11, 2018 8:17 am Post subject: Re: Specs. of tire, wheel, and suspension - Lowered Buses |
|
|
EeVeeWee wrote: |
I can't find it till now, so I will ask here.
Does anybody know the standard stroke of a 1967 stock front beam?
With other words, when the bus is lifted, how much space must there be above the front wheels?
To be sure they will never touch the metal of the bus. |
OK question is not clear maybe.
What is the stroke before the arm hits the mechanical stop upwards (without the rubber) from completely down? |
|
Back to top |
|
|
mandraks Samba Member
Joined: November 28, 2004 Posts: 7050 Location: Lawrenceville, Ga
|
Posted: Thu Jan 11, 2018 8:53 am Post subject: Re: Specs. of tire, wheel, and suspension - Lowered Buses |
|
|
EeVeeWee wrote: |
OK question is not clear maybe.
What is the stroke before the arm hits the mechanical stop upwards (without the rubber) from completely down? |
i think this could be determined with the help of a calculator, measuring tape and a straight edge. _________________ regards
Uli
----------------------------------------
'53 3-Fold Oval, L35 Metallic Blue, looking for a narrow hatch panel |
|
Back to top |
|
|
EeVeeWee Samba Member
Joined: April 02, 2015 Posts: 836 Location: Amersfoort, Netherlands
|
Posted: Thu Jan 11, 2018 9:44 am Post subject: Re: Specs. of tire, wheel, and suspension - Lowered Buses |
|
|
mandraks wrote: |
EeVeeWee wrote: |
OK question is not clear maybe.
What is the stroke before the arm hits the mechanical stop upwards (without the rubber) from completely down? |
i think this could be determined with the help of a calculator, measuring tape and a straight edge. |
Of course, but maybe someone knows the answer already. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
easy e Samba Member
Joined: May 28, 2008 Posts: 3931 Location: 1 hr north of Santa Barbara
|
Posted: Thu Jan 11, 2018 2:11 pm Post subject: Re: Specs. of tire, wheel, and suspension - Lowered Buses |
|
|
EeVeeWee wrote: |
How much space must there be above the front wheels?
To be sure they will never touch the metal of the bus. |
EeVeeWee wrote: |
What is the stroke before the arm hits the mechanical stop upwards (without the rubber) from completely down? |
What is it you are actually trying to determine?
Your first quoted question makes is seem like you don't want to rub your tire on the bus' wheel well. If that's true... it all depends on wheel / tire size.
Well, and... how much it's lowered or raised.
You need to pick one variable to isolate.
Then, you're talking about the torsion arm stop (without rubber). Getting a little picky. But, this also depends on if a stock beam or adjustable.... broken leaves or all good leaves (how do you know for sure?).... old leaves or new leaves?
What is your desired measurement tolerance? +/-25 cm? +/-1 cm ??
What I'm getting at is... maybe say what you are trying to do... and it might be easier for someone to help. (because what you are asking for is odd) _________________ aka: Evan
Spreadsheet for Bus RPM, based on gearing & tire size (Excel format)
Searchable, click-navigable 1958 Bus Parts List |
|
Back to top |
|
|
mandraks Samba Member
Joined: November 28, 2004 Posts: 7050 Location: Lawrenceville, Ga
|
Posted: Thu Jan 11, 2018 2:24 pm Post subject: Re: Specs. of tire, wheel, and suspension - Lowered Buses |
|
|
EeVeeWee wrote: |
mandraks wrote: |
EeVeeWee wrote: |
OK question is not clear maybe.
What is the stroke before the arm hits the mechanical stop upwards (without the rubber) from completely down? |
i think this could be determined with the help of a calculator, measuring tape and a straight edge. |
Of course, but maybe someone knows the answer already. |
i was not trying to be a jackass (comes easy, though). regardless of your front axle being lowered or not, broken leaf springs or not, desired wheels you want to run (aka as variables)
you can quite literally figure this out with a measuring tape. even without jacking the bus up. it would be easier, though. _________________ regards
Uli
----------------------------------------
'53 3-Fold Oval, L35 Metallic Blue, looking for a narrow hatch panel |
|
Back to top |
|
|
EeVeeWee Samba Member
Joined: April 02, 2015 Posts: 836 Location: Amersfoort, Netherlands
|
Posted: Thu Jan 11, 2018 2:30 pm Post subject: Re: Specs. of tire, wheel, and suspension - Lowered Buses |
|
|
easy e wrote: |
EeVeeWee wrote: |
How much space must there be above the front wheels?
To be sure they will never touch the metal of the bus. |
EeVeeWee wrote: |
What is the stroke before the arm hits the mechanical stop upwards (without the rubber) from completely down? |
What is it you are actually trying to determine?
Your first quoted question makes is seem like you don't want to rub your tire on the bus' wheel well. If that's true... it all depends on wheel / tire size.
Well, and... how much it's lowered or raised.
You need to pick one variable to isolate.
Then, you're talking about the torsion arm stop (without rubber). Getting a little picky. But, this also depends on if a stock beam or adjustable>.... broken leaves or all good leaves (how do you know for sure?).... old leaves or new leaves?
What is your desired measurement tolerance? +/-25 cm +/-1 cm ??
What I'm getting at is... maybe say what you are trying to do... and it might be easier for someone to help. |
OK, I have a fully restored front beam with dropped spindles and also adjustable.
The position is now that there is only about 5 cm of free space above the (stock) tires. I want to buy new tires, but with nearly the same diameter.
Indeed I don't want that the tires hit the wheel wells, so I want to adjust the bus upwards (the dropped spindles have no influence on the stroke). When I know the stroke of the wheels, I can lift the bus and measure the actual space above the tires. With the dimension of the stroke, I know how much the bus has to be adjusted more upwards.
Then I know the arms will hit the mechanical stops before the tires hit the wheel wells. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
easy e Samba Member
Joined: May 28, 2008 Posts: 3931 Location: 1 hr north of Santa Barbara
|
Posted: Thu Jan 11, 2018 2:31 pm Post subject: Re: Specs. of tire, wheel, and suspension - Lowered Buses |
|
|
mandraks,
Are you saying the distance from torsion arm to torsion arm stop is a universally fixed distance, independent of variables?
It sounds like that's what you're saying. _________________ aka: Evan
Spreadsheet for Bus RPM, based on gearing & tire size (Excel format)
Searchable, click-navigable 1958 Bus Parts List |
|
Back to top |
|
|
EeVeeWee Samba Member
Joined: April 02, 2015 Posts: 836 Location: Amersfoort, Netherlands
|
Posted: Thu Jan 11, 2018 2:35 pm Post subject: Re: Specs. of tire, wheel, and suspension - Lowered Buses |
|
|
mandraks wrote: |
EeVeeWee wrote: |
mandraks wrote: |
EeVeeWee wrote: |
OK question is not clear maybe.
What is the stroke before the arm hits the mechanical stop upwards (without the rubber) from completely down? |
i think this could be determined with the help of a calculator, measuring tape and a straight edge. |
Of course, but maybe someone knows the answer already. |
i was not trying to be a jackass (comes easy, though). regardless of your front axle being lowered or not, broken leaf springs or not, desired wheels you want to run (aka as variables)
you can quite literally figure this out with a measuring tape. even without jacking the bus up. it would be easier, though. |
This is roughly possible, but not very accurate so not reliable. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
easy e Samba Member
Joined: May 28, 2008 Posts: 3931 Location: 1 hr north of Santa Barbara
|
Posted: Thu Jan 11, 2018 2:44 pm Post subject: Re: Specs. of tire, wheel, and suspension - Lowered Buses |
|
|
EeVeeWee wrote: |
I have an adjustable beam with dropped spindles.
Distance between tire and wheel well = 5 cm.
I want to buy new tires, but with nearly the same diameter.
Indeed I don't want that the tires hit the wheel wells, so I want to adjust the bus upwards.
When I know the stroke of the wheels, I can lift the bus and measure the actual space above the tires.
With the dimension of the stroke, I know how much the bus has to be raised.
Then I know the arms will hit the mechanical stops before the tires hit the wheel wells. |
If your bus doesn't rub now and it rides good... your clearance above the wheel is acceptable.
If you buy a tire with slightly larger diameter... the clearance may become unacceptable and you will need to raise your bus with the adjusters.
Even if you know you will need to raise it 12 mm... do you know if that is one tooth or two teeth on the adjusters? I think you will just have to play with it.
You may be able to go 25 mm larger tire and not rub. You just have to try. _________________ aka: Evan
Spreadsheet for Bus RPM, based on gearing & tire size (Excel format)
Searchable, click-navigable 1958 Bus Parts List |
|
Back to top |
|
|
mandraks Samba Member
Joined: November 28, 2004 Posts: 7050 Location: Lawrenceville, Ga
|
Posted: Thu Jan 11, 2018 3:01 pm Post subject: Re: Specs. of tire, wheel, and suspension - Lowered Buses |
|
|
easy e wrote: |
mandraks,
Are you saying the distance from torsion arm to torsion arm stop is a universally fixed distance, independent of variables?
It sounds like that's what you're saying. |
i am also not an english native speaker, but i am pretty sure i suggested no such thing, even though this might be the case.
I was thinking that you can measure the distance between the trailing arm and the bump stop. that is your max travel for the trailing arm.
then you measure the distance above the wheel.
a little bit of math that figures in the length of the trailing arm and you can figure out whether the max travel of the trailing arm will result in the tire hitting the wheel well.
for this math to work the other variables are in fact not important. Then again i am not a mathematician. _________________ regards
Uli
----------------------------------------
'53 3-Fold Oval, L35 Metallic Blue, looking for a narrow hatch panel
Last edited by mandraks on Thu Jan 11, 2018 3:17 pm; edited 1 time in total |
|
Back to top |
|
|
easy e Samba Member
Joined: May 28, 2008 Posts: 3931 Location: 1 hr north of Santa Barbara
|
|
Back to top |
|
|
EeVeeWee Samba Member
Joined: April 02, 2015 Posts: 836 Location: Amersfoort, Netherlands
|
Posted: Thu Jan 11, 2018 3:48 pm Post subject: Re: Specs. of tire, wheel, and suspension - Lowered Buses |
|
|
mandraks wrote: |
easy e wrote: |
mandraks,
Are you saying the distance from torsion arm to torsion arm stop is a universally fixed distance, independent of variables?
It sounds like that's what you're saying. |
i am also not an english native speaker, but i am pretty sure i suggested no such thing, even though this might be the case.
I was thinking that you can measure the distance between the trailing arm and the bump stop. that is your max travel for the trailing arm.
then you measure the distance above the wheel.
a little bit of math that figures in the length of the trailing arm and you can figure out whether the max travel of the trailing arm will result in the tire hitting the wheel well.
for this math to work the other variables are in fact not important. Then again i am not a mathematician. |
It sounds easy, but it's a bit more complicated.
When the wheel was directely mounted to the end of upper arm, it would be easier.
In practise the wheel is mounted in the middle of two arms, so the angle of the wheel axe stays the same, while the arm turns around.
With vectors it can be calculated, but together with the measurement inaccuracy it will not be very accurate as I already indicated. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
mandraks Samba Member
Joined: November 28, 2004 Posts: 7050 Location: Lawrenceville, Ga
|
Posted: Thu Jan 11, 2018 4:36 pm Post subject: Re: Specs. of tire, wheel, and suspension - Lowered Buses |
|
|
EeVeeWee wrote: |
...
It sounds easy, but it's a bit more complicated.
When the wheel was directely mounted to the end of upper arm, it would be easier.
In practise the wheel is mounted in the middle of two arms, so the angle of the wheel axe stays the same, while the arm turns around.
With vectors it can be calculated, but together with the measurement inaccuracy it will not be very accurate as I already indicated. |
gotcha, sounds like you don't want to crawl under your bus. So much easier if somebody else crawls under theirs. It is not that difficult, really. I have faith you can do it. _________________ regards
Uli
----------------------------------------
'53 3-Fold Oval, L35 Metallic Blue, looking for a narrow hatch panel |
|
Back to top |
|
|
EeVeeWee Samba Member
Joined: April 02, 2015 Posts: 836 Location: Amersfoort, Netherlands
|
Posted: Fri Jan 12, 2018 1:37 am Post subject: Re: Specs. of tire, wheel, and suspension - Lowered Buses |
|
|
mandraks wrote: |
EeVeeWee wrote: |
...
It sounds easy, but it's a bit more complicated.
When the wheel was directely mounted to the end of upper arm, it would be easier.
In practise the wheel is mounted in the middle of two arms, so the angle of the wheel axe stays the same, while the arm turns around.
With vectors it can be calculated, but together with the measurement inaccuracy it will not be very accurate as I already indicated. |
gotcha, sounds like you don't want to crawl under your bus. So much easier if somebody else crawls under theirs. It is not that difficult, really. I have faith you can do it. |
When nobody knows the answer and only smart asses react, I will find it out, don't worry. And the argument about crawling is also BS, I have access to a pit. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
mandraks Samba Member
Joined: November 28, 2004 Posts: 7050 Location: Lawrenceville, Ga
|
Posted: Fri Jan 12, 2018 8:14 am Post subject: Re: Specs. of tire, wheel, and suspension - Lowered Buses |
|
|
EeVeeWee wrote: |
When nobody knows the answer and only smart asses react, I will find it out, don't worry. And the argument about crawling is also BS, I have access to a pit. |
pit is actually a most excellent way to work on a bus, or any other car really. _________________ regards
Uli
----------------------------------------
'53 3-Fold Oval, L35 Metallic Blue, looking for a narrow hatch panel |
|
Back to top |
|
|
|