Actual labor rates for AC VW repairs

[dan macmillan]

Recently " yudogg " posted the question about "$250 for a Tune up?"
That is definitely over the top. I remembered that I have an actual MOTOR Time and Parts guide from 1972, so I looked it up.

Tune up minor for a T1 is .8 hours. this includes
New points, new condenser and plugs, set the timing and adjust the idle.

Tune up Major for a T1 is 2.1 hours. This includes
Compression test, install new plugs, R&R dist to check advance and shaft bushings, install new points and condenser, adjust timing, adj carb, clean battery terminals, service air cleaner, check coil and clean fuel pump insert.

Tune up major and Overhaul carb(s) 4.1 hours.

Valve adjust is an extra .7 hours

I do not know the shop rate where he is but where I work it is $75.00 per hour. (I see less than a third of that.) That gets you 3.3 hours of labor.

Major Tune plus valves is 2.8 hours therefor his mechanic is charging $89.29 per hour. Way too much in my books.

If anyone wants to know the labor rates for any particular job just email me.
_________________
Licensed Automotive Service Technician
Licensed Truck and Coach Technician
Licensed Heavy Duty Equipment Technician
CFC/HCFC/HFC A/C handling and installation license
Alignment specialist
66 Modified Manx,68 Kyote,74 Thing,74 Beetle, 76 Transporter,75 self made Double Cab,65 Meyers Manx,78Westy,68 Ghia, 79 Bradley GT2
Current projects:
Built for others:69 Manx Clone

[Buggeroff]

[dan macmillan]

What makes you think I'm on crack?
_________________
Licensed Automotive Service Technician
Licensed Truck and Coach Technician
Licensed Heavy Duty Equipment Technician
CFC/HCFC/HFC A/C handling and installation license
Alignment specialist
66 Modified Manx,68 Kyote,74 Thing,74 Beetle, 76 Transporter,75 self made Double Cab,65 Meyers Manx,78Westy,68 Ghia, 79 Bradley GT2
Current projects:
Built for others:69 Manx Clone

[NOVA Airhead]

What about parts?

Based on what you have posted, the $250 price is reasonable when you include the parts - probably around $50 for what a shop would charge.
_________________
Ghia Owner Emeritus

[dan macmillan]

In the original post nothing was mentioned about parts. We are talking labor only. Parts are extra. Still it is too much for what is being done.
I have worked in the same shop for 18 years and I still cannot see how people can pay for the repairs we do.

Original post "Hi. My bug needs a tune up and a shop quoted me $250 to adjust the valves and timing, check compression, and replace plugs, points, cap and rotor. Is this something I can do myself? I'm not that mechanically inclined, but $250 seems high."

My point of starting this thread was to help people from being ripped off. If some garage quotes you on a job, what labor guide are they going with? Most shops do not hold on to the old guides and AC VWs have not been in the guides for years.

If anyone thinks $200.00 plus parts is a fair price for a tune up, comp test and adj valves then I would be more than happy to steal your money. This job can easily be done in 1.25 hours. I can handle being paid $200.00 per hour
_________________
Licensed Automotive Service Technician
Licensed Truck and Coach Technician
Licensed Heavy Duty Equipment Technician
CFC/HCFC/HFC A/C handling and installation license
Alignment specialist
66 Modified Manx,68 Kyote,74 Thing,74 Beetle, 76 Transporter,75 self made Double Cab,65 Meyers Manx,78Westy,68 Ghia, 79 Bradley GT2
Current projects:
Built for others:69 Manx Clone

[NOVA Airhead]

dan macmillan said:

[dan macmillan]

[NOVA Airhead]

I guess its the deifinition of the word "Replace" since he did not say he was supplying the parts and subsequent posts in the thread talked about the cost of the parts.

In any event, most mechanics where I live do not want to use parts you bring in, at least for routine maintenance like a tune up. From my experience, when a mechanic quotes a price for replacement, it includes the new parts.

It would appear that it works differently in your shop.
_________________
Ghia Owner Emeritus

[DrDarby]

I have to laugh. What is the argument ? You stated the labor guide clearly shows 2.8 hours of labor? That is FLAT RATE. I know very well that if you hustle you can get it done in 1 - 1.5 hours but we are talking about a shop here that means FLAT RATE. You should understand that, you say you are a technician. Some bafoon might take 6 hours to do it but if he's in a professional environment guess what, he still only gets paid flat rate of 2.8 hours for the job. When I worked for VW I had shops full of great technicians. Some made $100,000 per year, some struggled at $35,000.00 and all essentially doing the same job.

Even at $75.00 per hour that is $210.00 in labor alone. In Chicago labor rates are over $100.00 per hour so that in itself would blow the estimate out of the water.
Plugs, cap, rotor, points, valve cover gaskets, sealant, etc etc etc with a normal shop markup would run $20.00 - $30.00 and don't argue the point that "you" can buy those parts for $15.00, I know, I can too but any shop will mark them up normally using a matrix. $210.00 + $30.00 + Tax etc is $250.00 at $75.00 per hour.

This is the whole point of my reply in the first post. All I ever see is people saying RIP OFF, RIP OFF but when you do the math it all works out when you let someone else do the work. The only way you are going to come out ahead is learn how to do it yourselves.

[Cusser]

In Arizona, my mechanic (not for AC VWs) charges $80 per flat rate hour, and he's honest and thorough, one-year guarantee on all his labor. However, I only use him like twice a year at most because I do most myself, like a power steering pump on my '88 Mazda truck last week, brake master cylinder, pads, and rotor on my '94 Suburban in December, etc. He even took in that Sub MC and had the parts shop swap it out for me for free, since the part was lifetime guaranteed even though the labor time had expired, saved me $70 cost of a new MC (good 'ol GM or anybody else doesn't sell replacement seals for the reservoir to MC seal). So labor rates plus transportation issues dropping off the vehicles is why many here do their own work; as I said, this mechanic doesn't even work on AC VWs, so I'd have to find a specialty shop if I needed work on mine that I couldn't handle.
_________________
1970 VW (owned since 1972) and 1971 VW Convertible (owned since 1976), second owner of each. The '71 now has the 1835 engine, swapped from the '70. Second owner of each. 1988 Mazda B2200 truck, 1998 Frontier, 2014 Yukon, 2004 Frontier King Cab. All manual transmission except for the Yukon. http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/album_page.php?pic_id=335294 http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/album_page.php?pic_id=335297

[JustBurn]

I've worked at a few shops. Out here in the bay area shop rates are $100/hr for the cheap places and 110-130 for places like firestone and the dealers.

I was suprised to see complaint for $250...

especially because i was a service writer/estimator at a bodyshop... labor rates aren't cheap when you have alot of overhead.


Now would someone do a tune up for less? Sure. But you took your car to a professional, and they did professional work.

[Air-Cooled Head]

[Robslittlebrownbug]

My son and I have decided to open a shop specializing in Air Cooled VW.
we can't find "book time' labor guides to be able to give estimates. is there a reliable source for book time on different jobs?

[Tim Donahoe]

PM the original poster. Maybe he’s still around.

Tim
_________________
Let's do the Time Warp again!

Richard O'Brien

[Cusser]

Flat Rate
OK, here's all what I had written down years ago, don't know the source:
brake shoes front & rear 2.2
brake overhaul (shoes & wheel cylinders) 5.0
handbrake adjust 0.4
master cylinder R&R 1.2 overhaul (early) 1.8
axle boot 0.6
speedometer R&R 0.4
speedo cable R&R 0.4
ignition switch (late) 1.7
engine R&R 1.5
crankshaft oil seal 1.0
pushrod tube seals 3.5
switch over engine components (e.g. to rebuilt engine) 4.0
tune-up major 1.8
starter R&R 0.7
oil cooler re-seal (early) 1.6
generator R&R (early) 1.2
generator R&R (late) 2.0
that's all I have; some doesn't make much sense to me: for example, I think speedo cable replace is easier than a speedo replacement, but same amount is detailed.
_________________
1970 VW (owned since 1972) and 1971 VW Convertible (owned since 1976), second owner of each. The '71 now has the 1835 engine, swapped from the '70. Second owner of each. 1988 Mazda B2200 truck, 1998 Frontier, 2014 Yukon, 2004 Frontier King Cab. All manual transmission except for the Yukon. http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/album_page.php?pic_id=335294 http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/album_page.php?pic_id=335297

[zundfolge73]

Thanks for updating the post! I just started working on a friends 66 and could not find any information on aircooled VW labor rates. I don't want to overcharge; however, with a car this old, parts tend to break which adds to the cost of parts. It's nice to have some sorta reference to use regarding labor rates.

[[email protected]]

While it’s nice that some of the dealer labor estimates are posted, they were referenced when working on a vehicle less than 5-8 years old. Those attempting to give an estimate on a repair off of those guides for a 40+ year old car are very foolish. I doubt any of you in this post have taken a couple hours to remove a customer’s early Super strut from its spindle with a torch, and a sawzall to install a set of adjustable ones. I doubt any have done a tune up in a customer’s recent purchase, that hasn’t had the plugs removed in 20 years, that takes the head threads with more than one plug. I doubt any have done a customer’s valve adjustment to find the guide moving right along with the valve when turning the engine over to adjust the next cylinder. I wish Robslittlebrownbug the best in their new venture, but customer’s need to realize working on older vehicles creates many different variables on how well/poor the job goes. While this post was started in 2007, labor rates vary imo in 2021 from $75-$150 an hour. You can only charge what your customer base will support. Also in 2021, Bosch tune up components, if you can find them, will most likely be over $100 in the parts for plugs/wires/cap/rotor/points/condenser.

[MuzzcoVW]

Anyone in my area that actually knows anything about an air cooled VW or Porsche is at least $100 an hour, usually more like $125. I would expect if I didn't do everything myself that a tune up, oil change and valve adjustment would be a minimum of $500.

[zundfolge73]

You make some valid points gkeeton and thank you for your insight.

[MuzzcoVW]