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Auto/power door locks are running amok
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danocox
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Joined: April 14, 2007
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Location: Salt Lake
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 14, 2007 8:52 am    Post subject: Auto/power door locks are running amok Reply with quote

o.k. when i go unlock my door on my 90 van it unlocks and then locks again and the only way to get it to stop is by quickly opening the door and unocking it manually from the other side. and then it all stops. sometimes it will also lock at random when driving. help would be appreciated thanks
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RCB
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 14, 2007 9:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I was at my mechanics a few weeks ago and in drives a young couple in a beautiful Westy. After a brief chat with John, the couple leaves on foot.
I was admiring their Westy from afar and since my oil change was just about over with I decided to mosey on over to check out their ride.
As I got closer I began to hear this clicking sound..over and over and over.
Turns out the electronic door locks are on the fritz and all of them in unison are opening and then locking and opening and then locking.
By the time my oil change was done the battery had just about run itself down to nothing.

I got a chuckle out of it and the customer got a new electric lock.
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Dogpilot
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 14, 2007 10:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

They are a simple system. The master units on the front doors, especially the drivers one can get corrosion or out of adjustment and hit that fun special point where it is almost in either position. There are some sliding adjusters on the rod to the lock. You have to remove the door panels to get to them. Also, it can be our old friend corrosion internally to the unit, which can be opened and cleaned. The worst is chafing on the wires in the rubber tube in the door jamb. Good luck there. Here is how the system works:
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

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Geology with a Syncro rocks!
86 Syncro Westy AKA "The Bughunter"
98 Disco I
08 Range Rover SC
08 VW Rabbit S
1951 O-1G
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Steelhead
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 02, 2007 12:25 pm    Post subject: I have a similar issue - Reply with quote

Hijacking. I have a similar issue. Advice needed from someone who really gets these circuits.

I've taken apart and cleaned both motors/units. Here's whats happening:
1. locking and unlocking the passenger door works properly - All doors lock and and unlock the way they are supposed to when operating from the pasenger side.
2. When locking from the driver's side, the lock plunger goes down, activities the rear doors, but not the passenger door, and then automatically pops back up (thus unlocking all doors).
3. If I lock all doors using the passenger door, and then try to unlock the driver's door the reverse of the above happens ---- it unlocks momentarily (including the rear doors, but not the passenger door) and then relocks all automatically.

Its like the driver's door is getting an inverse signal from the passenger door? I'm thinking it may have something to do with the big drive gear (detailed above) being out of sync on one of the doors. Any auto door lock wizards able to follow/diagnose this?

thanks, Duncan
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Dogpilot
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 02, 2007 12:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Duncan, take the drivers side lock actuator out, but plug it in the circuit. You can push and pull on the plunger and see what happens. If it does it when it is out, then the internals are suspect. If it does not do it when out, then it is the geometry of the liknage not allowing the actuator to make its full throw, an obstruction or some other external issue.
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Geology with a Syncro rocks!
86 Syncro Westy AKA "The Bughunter"
98 Disco I
08 Range Rover SC
08 VW Rabbit S
1951 O-1G
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danocox
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 02, 2007 1:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

sorry I never actually responded to my own post. should follow up on all my problems, sorry. the problem I found and sounds alot like yours if not the exact same thing. the problem was that I tracked the "locking wire" down and it had corroded and had lost conection where the door hinges were. as I remember the locking wire was yellow and the unlocking one was white but that could be different from yours.

the best way to find out is to get some alligator jumps and hook one end up to power underneath the dash. just find a powered circut and then use a neddle to poke the wire in several different places. once it does someting then you know where to cut the wire. make sure you replace or seal and holes you make in the wire insualtion because you will be back doing the same thing right over again.

sorry for writing so much but, just wanted to be clear.
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Steelhead
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 03, 2007 8:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks guys. After much fiddling its fixed! In order to isolate the problem I switched them from one door to the other, and the problem moved. This indicated that it was one unit in particular and not the door wiring (relief).

It turned out that the big gear in one of the units was fused/rusted on the its post (not spinning well...the whole post was turning). This prevented any juice from getting to the motor -- causing it not to lock (and messed up the signal back to the other unit).

There are also some little springs in there that had rusted out and were screwing up the contact points. Cleaned it all up, mcgyver'd some new tiny springs, and its back in action. I sealed the units up with some liquid rubber so that it won't be a problem again 'til next year (haha).

Intense little electro-mechanical puzzle.
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John Sullivan
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 03, 2007 8:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It was the one originally on the passenger side that was bad, right?
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Steelhead
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2007 12:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

John Sullivan wrote:
It was the one originally on the passenger side that was bad, right?


yep, you got it. I finally figured it out when I realized I could only hear the motor working on the driver's side unit, and then I took the passenger side motor out and bench tested it (and it worked by itself, but not in the actuator housing).

The gory detail: The compounding confusion was a result of first fabbing new springs for the plunger contacts, which ended up being a bit too stiff (but hard to know at the time). Then the main gear spindle, which had apparently worked sporadically in its fused state (by rotating both gear and spindle together, instead of gear rotating on spindle), in combination with the too stiff springs, began to bind and lock up the entire system.

Sensitive little mechanisms. Hard to imagine they last as long as they do. To anyone reading this who has similar door lock problems, don't let these diagrams scare you, just take one apart.

Key things to know:
- the motor screw always goes one direction and it's down (threads winding towards the motor).
- Consider bench testing the motor by itself.
- make sure both gears slide easily on the spindles.
- check the little springs that press the contact bar on the plunger.
- Don't get too hung up trying to figure out where to start the big gear when reassembling - it doesn't matter, it just goes around and around counter clock-wise (lock, unlock, lock, unlock, etc).
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aviatorjames
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2007 10:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You've got an intermittent connection somewhere.
My system was also acting goofy for a while too...
...lock the door and they would simply unlock.
...sometimes?!?!

After getting into the wiring diagram, I was able to figure it out.
Traced it to an intermittent open circuit on the passenger side.
A broken wire in the bundle between the door and the door frame.

If you need some specific help, or a copy of the wiring diagram,
I'll be happy to send it to you.

james

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