How much wasser can a wasserleaker leak? (Blinking coolant)

[westy81]

I recently picked up an 87.5 Wolfsburg for a Subaru engine transplant, but was hoping the 2.1 wasserboxer motor would survive long enough for at least me to gather my parts together for the conversion.

Anyhow - I bought the van knowing it was dripping a bit of coolant, but lately it's been piddling green on a regular basis. More recently (today) the coolant temp gauge dash warning light began to blink, even though the coolant temperature was normal and the coolant level was topped off.

I initially thought the warning light was for temp, but obviously it isn't... which seems to be confirmed by looking through my Bentley on 19.13 and seeing that there's a coolant level warning light switch at the top of the expansion tank.

I'm assuming I've got a bunch of air in my system, and need to bleed it out as per Bentley 19.16 (and keep bleeding it since I'm dropping coolant on a regular basis). Yes? Some decent 2.1L bleeding info can be found at http://www.benplace.com/bleeding.htm. (I guess I could just look at the top of my expansion tank for air, but that would mean I would need to get off the couch, put on my shoes, and go outside with a flashlight.)

Also - any guesses how long I can drive it dropping coolant at a furious rate? (about 1 cup / 250mL every time I fill up with gas.) I'd like to drive it for about 6 months more (as I refresh my Subaru motor, etc) and don't care if the 2.1L is sold for core at the end of it. Maybe it's time to break out the jumbo tubes of JB weld and encase the cylinder head in an epoxy sheath...

I think I'll rig up a little "wasserleaker reservoir" on the outside of my cylinder to catch the coolant (to save groundwater and puppydogs from glycol, etc) or transition to water (I'm located in Southern California).

And this seems to be an error in Bentley: on 19.16, it says "raise vehicle aprox. 10 cm (4 in.) at front" for bleeding. The back should be raised... no?

Any wasserleaker pros out there want to chime in?

Garnet

[hiram6]

Can't answer the quuestion of how long you can run this engine, but I can addess your final question about raising the front of the Vanagon to bleed. The Bemtley is correct, it's the front that needs to be higher, since the principal bled location is at the top passenger side of your radiator. Elevating the front insures that this is the highest point in the cooling system.
_________________
1985 Westy, 1.9L automatic (Daisy)
1996 Mazda Miata
1998 Jeep Grand Cherokee 5.9 Limited

You can't lie around on the beach and drink rum all day.................unless you start first thing in the morning.

[bucko]

The contents of the 1.9 liter coolant system is 16.9 quarts according to the Bentley and/or owners manual.
_________________
Current VW drives: 1984 Westfalia

Past VW drives: 1967 Beetle, 1973 Beetle, 1977 Bus, 1971 Military Type 181

[perrib]

Where is it leaking from?

[Alan Brase]

If your pressure cap and the attached hose to the burp tank are intact, there is really no need to bleed it. It will self bleed. Every time it warms up, it will bubble the air into the burp tank. Every time it cools, it will draw in new coolant from the burp tank. A few cycles of this and most of the air is purged.
Unless I changed the radiator, I no longer bother with Bentley's complicated bleeding plan.
Al
_________________
Al Brase
Projects: 67 sunroof bug, 67 Porsche 912 Targa, 70 Westy
Dec 1955 Single Cab pickup WANT 15" BUS RIMS dated 8/55, thru 12/55
To New owners: 1969 doublecab, 1971 Dormobile
Vanagons:
80 P27 Westy JUL 1979, 3rd oldest known US
83 1.6TD Vanagon, 87 Wolfie Westy daily driver, swap meet home

[Van-go108]

Been there, Done that..... No really!

http://www.vanagonauts.com/index.phtml?catid=193
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"Okay, so there's 6 beers and 5 of us. You know what this means don't you? 4 of you are going to have to leave."


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[amishman]

[candyman]

i always let it self bleed. but to ensure quicker bleeding, after long drives i will open the bleeder screw on the radiator and let air escape there. do that a couple of times and all is good. been doing that for about 10 years now and have had no problems

[candyman]

.Also - any guesses how long I can drive it dropping coolant at a furious rate? (about 1 cup / 250mL every time I fill up with gas.) I'd like to drive it for about 6 months more (as I refresh my Subaru motor, etc) and don't care if the 2.1L is sold for core at the end of it. Maybe it's time to break out the jumbo tubes of JB weld and encase the cylinder head in an epoxy sheath...


if you decide to knowingly drive it leaking, don't push it as you are already losing a lot of fluid. just keep coolant in the van and don't stray too far from home in case the inevitable happens 6 months is a long time to be limping a long, only takes one good well heated engine to make that system go

[weatherbill]

I think the bently manual says to air it out by the screw on the thermostat as you raise the front of it.

[levi]

You can keep driving it, as long as you make sure the high pressure tank doesn't get empty. You can bleed out any air at the same time you check that tank. If the van is warmed up, and you open the lid to check that high pressure tank and it's got air in it, just unscrew that lid SLOWLY, you'll only need about 1/4 turn, and the pressure will force the air out, then tighten it back. The more air is getting into the system, the more often you'll have to do this. When the van is cold you take the high-pressure cap off and fill it up. Important to make sure the reserve tank doesn't go empty of course. I bought a subarood van several months back with blown head gaskets, and drove it cross country this way. Left the rear hatch unlocked so I wouldn't have to turn off the engine, then go back and let out some air.
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[Rhinoculips]

Just an FYI note -

To bleed the system by raising the rear, as recommended by http://www.benplace.com/bleeding.htm works quite well. I just did it today by myself and it was quick and easy. This method makes a lot of sense to me. Water will always equalize itself no matter what it is in, whether it's a garden hose or your cooling system. Air will be displaced by the coolant via the 3 bleeding screws. The trick to it though, is to make sure the lip of your expansion tank is an inch or two higher than the bleed screw on the radiator. When there's coolant coming out of the radiator, plug it, lower the rear and top off the expansion tank and fill reservoir and your essentially done. Drive it a couple of times and let any excess air(mine had none) out of the radiator after each one. First time I did it this way, I was really questioning why VW wants you to do it the harder Bentley way.

With the Bentley method you are actually pumping coolant up hill and if the rpm's drop off for some reason, the coolant will rush back and splash out of the expansion tank. i.e. the water will try to equalize itself.
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[tencentlife]

What's key with the VW method (raising the front) is to do it cold (thermostat still closed) and rev it at 2000rpm as you add fluid, until it jets out the top. Raising the front gets the radiator lines to the front sloped upward such that there aren't any raised pockets where air can get trapped. Works a wonder every time if you do it right. If the thermostat is open or you don't raise the revs, it doesn't work so good.

[Bambus]

[westy81]

Good news... the problem is fixed!

As it turns out, there was a small (1/2" ID, about 5/8" OD) coolant hose that was leaking. The hose connected between a metal tube along the top inside back of the engine compartment (above the license plate door hole) and down along the oil add tube and into the right side of the motor below the alternator and by the water pump.

Thanks to perrib for asking "Where is it leaking from?" - simple but exactly the right question. (And, thanks to lanval http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/profile.php?mode=viewprofile&u=106257 my neighbor who gave me his drain pan and a hand during the process.)

I think it is "P" in this diagram:

Anyhow, I replaced the tubing for $4 and am now as good as new with no leaks, no blinkin' light crying out at me, and no more visions of a ridiculously accelerated Subie transplant.

This has been my cheapest Vanagon fix yet... especially compared to my initial thoughts of the motor going and head gaskets leaking, etc. Hopefully the guy I bought the van from also thought that the heads were leaking and never checked it out and just sold it...

[msinabottle]

Hurray!

Congratulations! Look up my post, 'Winston Tries to Give Rob a Heart Attack' for my own version of this story.

Congratulations, you took it calmly, took advice, took action--and prevailed!

Best!
_________________
'Winston,' '84 1.9 WBX Westy
Vanagon Poet Laureate: "I have suffered in
many ways, but never, never, never in silence."

[tencentlife]

Westy81, if the flanged nipple bolted to the right head where the hose you pointed to connected was still made of plastic, you definitely need to replace it with the metal version:

http://www.van-cafe.com/vanagon_parts.jsp?pa=p&p=1671107832&pct=1232111170&ct=1247501126

The plastic nipple will snap right off someday without warning, leaving you with a gushing leak.

[westy81]

[tencentlife]

Why? I dunno, ask them cheap beancounters at VW. The amazing thing is how long the damn things held up. Mine must have gone 13 years before it broke off. Anyway, they caught their mistake, and be glad yours is already the metal one.

[perrib]

Vanogens seem well sealed compared to newer VW's cooling systems. After 1988. Vw used plastic exclusively for all flanges on all VW model. They barely last two years in ther heat of Phoenix. Many of the replacements are made in China and have a 3-10 month life expectancy.