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Battery Dead after 2 weeks sitting since last ran
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dublife13
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 24, 2024 3:05 pm    Post subject: Battery Dead after 2 weeks sitting since last ran Reply with quote

I have a weird situation that may just be a bad battery, and I'll find that out soon enough when I drop it off at Napa. Just wondering if I am missing something, or if anyone has experienced this or something like it,

The battery was bought in June of 2022, the sticker says May 2022. I bought it at Napa, because of the 25% AAA. I have driven the West Coast 2x since installation and camped probably 40 nights over those 2 years in it, as well as driven it locally when the weather is decent. Last winter I had it in storage and on a trickle charger, maybe 20% of the time. This winter I have had it parked in front of my house, no charger, but I would start it every few weeks and drive it to the store or a friend's house just to keep it from sitting. 2 weeks ago I drove it for maybe 30-40 minutes while running errands and parked it. Today I went to do the same but noticed the clock was off and there was not even a click from the starter when turning the key. Tossed the volt meter on the battery and it was reading below 2v, tossed the the trickle charger on it, but it was jumping in voltage from 0-15v.

I have a new alternator installed at the same time as the battery, so I don't believe that has been the issue. I have checked a few times over the last 2 years through the negative terminal with a voltage meter and saw now power drain with the key off. I have the stereo only wired to the ignition on, and the over-sink light is the only item powered off the starting battery which it hasn't been on.

I am pretty sure it is a bad battery and I will find out soon, but I am wondering if there is something else I should be looking at.

Thanks!
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Sodo
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 24, 2024 3:35 pm    Post subject: Re: Battery Dead after 2 weeks sitting since last ran. Reply with quote

Test for draws of course.

To test the battery, Give it a full charge and disconnect it.
Report voltage after 12 hours “at rest”.
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E1
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 24, 2024 3:42 pm    Post subject: Re: Battery Dead after 2 weeks sitting since last ran. Reply with quote

What you need to test is cold cranking amps (CCA), likely at a parts store unless you have a tester.

Voltage can show as perfectly normal on a battery that has absolutely no usable power to start the car.

Charge to full, then test CCA and compare to the label on the battery. Our starter batteries tend to have about 650 CCA and anything less than maybe 90% of that is a bad sign.
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 24, 2024 4:02 pm    Post subject: Re: Battery Dead after 2 weeks sitting since last ran. Reply with quote

A 12v starter battery that measures 2v after being idle for only two weeks suggests to me that there was a load on the battery drawing it down. Drawing a battery down to 2v shortened its life significantly. Give it a full charge, 72 hours min. if it's a 1 amp trickle charger, 36 if it's a 2 amp charger, and then see if it has enough life in it to last the summer. As mentioned, disconnect from the charger, measure volts after 12 hours (should be above 12.6) and then take it to NAPA. If you took it today they may have just swapped it for a new one depending on the warranty.

Your trickle charger may not be seeing enough voltage and therefore is not going into a charge cycle. Many (most?) newer battery chargers need to see voltage to begin a charging cycle. If they don't they shutoff. Connecting it in parallel with another battery and the charger may get the charger going.
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Last edited by jimf909 on Sun Mar 24, 2024 4:04 pm; edited 1 time in total
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do.dah
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 24, 2024 4:02 pm    Post subject: Re: Battery Dead after 2 weeks sitting since last ran. Reply with quote

For what it's worth, everybody in my neighborhood, family members and female acquaintances, feel that I'm their go to mechanic.
Since about the beginning of pandemic, I've checked, charged and double checked and condemned numerous batteries bought approx during pandemic or shortly after. All of them were just bad batteries.
I'm starting to think quality control/manufacturing was(is) sorely lacking...
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dublife13
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 24, 2024 4:06 pm    Post subject: Re: Battery Dead after 2 weeks sitting since last ran Reply with quote

I went to check on it and my trickle charger it had the bad battery symbol flashing. Took it NAPA and their handheld unit said it needs testing so they are going to put it on their charger this afternoon and see what it reads. They did grab the one new one they had in stock and set it aside if mine is bad, which I am guessing is the case, and being within the 2-year window it is a free replacement!

I have never had a battery go bad this quickly, hopefully, the next one doesn't have the same issues.
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dublife13
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 24, 2024 4:11 pm    Post subject: Re: Battery Dead after 2 weeks sitting since last ran. Reply with quote

jimf909 wrote:
A 12v starter battery that measures 2v after being idle for only two weeks suggests to me that there was a load on the battery drawing it down. Drawing a battery down to 2v shortened its life significantly. Give it a full charge, 72 hours min. if it's a 1 amp trickle charger, 36 if it's a 2 amp charger, and then see if it has enough life in it to last the summer. As mentioned, disconnect from the charger, measure volts after 12 hours (should be above 12.6) and then take it to NAPA. If you took it today they may have just swapped it for a new one depending on the warranty.

Your trickle charger may not be seeing enough voltage and therefore is not going into a charge cycle. Many (most?) newer battery chargers need to see voltage to begin a charging cycle. If they don't they shutoff. Connecting it in parallel with another battery and the charger may get the charger going.


I would assume the same, a load with key off would explain that much drain that quickly. I didn't have it 2 weeks ago, so its possible a wire has become disconnected or shorted, I sure hope its not the case, I do not like searching for bad wiring. I have been planning on replacing the battery to a starter and ground cable, so I will reprioritize that to the top of the list just because.
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E1
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 24, 2024 4:55 pm    Post subject: Re: Battery Dead after 2 weeks sitting since last ran Reply with quote

Dublife, I do agree it sounds like you have a drain.

It could very well be the clock, and/or if you have say a USB plug in the DC port. I will add that of you have the standard lamp about the stove, if it gets at all damp it indeed can stay on *very dimly* if it’s at all damp out — and you won’t see it unless it’s pitch black in the van.

My point on load-testing after charging the battery is voltage can still read normal even though the battery has no working CCA charge at all — meaning, it can’t do anything substantial like crank the starter, despite showing decent voltage. It may work fine for days, weeks, or months, and without a CCA test you won’t know what’s coming until it doesn’t start.

After going to 2, I’d be shocked if it wasn’t a goner — and honestly, I wouldn’t even want it whether they warranty it or not
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 24, 2024 7:18 pm    Post subject: Re: Battery Dead after 2 weeks sitting since last ran Reply with quote

A dome light will kill a battery quite dead in two weeks.
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 25, 2024 4:15 am    Post subject: Re: Battery Dead after 2 weeks sitting since last ran Reply with quote

Pick up a 12 volt testlight at NAPA if you don’t own one. Install the battery with just the positive cable attached. Now take your test light and connect it between the ground cable and the negative battery post. If it lights you have a draw and you need to locate it. If you don’t defeat the dome light, the test won’t work. Easiest way is to be sure the doors are all closed during the test. Report back.
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dublife13
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 25, 2024 3:53 pm    Post subject: Re: Battery Dead after 2 weeks sitting since last ran Reply with quote

Battery tested fine, 12.4v and 650CCA. I tossed it back in and found an 11.9v draw with the key out and doors closed. When I have more time this week I will run through the fuse box hoping to find the culprit, if not it will be a fun game of finding the draw. I will also check all the wiring i have done, but most of it is outside of the starting system and should be the issue.
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 25, 2024 4:01 pm    Post subject: Re: Battery Dead after 2 weeks sitting since last ran Reply with quote

dublife13 wrote:
Battery tested fine, 12.4v and 650CCA. I tossed it back in and found an 11.9v draw with the key out and doors closed. When I have more time this week I will run through the fuse box hoping to find the culprit, if not it will be a fun game of finding the draw. I will also check all the wiring i have done, but most of it is outside of the starting system and should be the issue.
I have no clue what you mean by a 11.9V draw - it's how much current being drawn that's of interest. Knowing that will give clue. Wink
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 25, 2024 4:02 pm    Post subject: Re: Battery Dead after 2 weeks sitting since last ran Reply with quote

Oh Good, you should be able to get home now. You might start it every two hours overnight. Wink

I’d actually love to know the procedure you’ll go through to find a drain!

Happy Travels! Cool
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 25, 2024 4:53 pm    Post subject: Re: Battery Dead after 2 weeks sitting since last ran Reply with quote

E1 wrote:
Oh Good, you should be able to get home now. You might start it every two hours overnight. Wink

I’d actually love to know the procedure you’ll go through to find a drain!

Happy Travels! Cool


It's been at home so no worries there. I'll plug in a test light between the negative post of the battery and the cable, with the draw the light is on, ill pull each fuse individually in the panel and see if the test light goes out, if it does then that circuit will get investigated. Though this problem started out of nowhere, as in it didn't exist a few weeks ago, I am guessing something that has constant power in my van has broken and is causing the drain. Possibly the DCDC controller is fucking up, the amplifier for my stereo isn't turning off, a relay is stuck open..... Ill report my findings when i get some time to spend on it.
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 25, 2024 5:01 pm    Post subject: Re: Battery Dead after 2 weeks sitting since last ran Reply with quote

I just replaced my battery.

It was a NAPA and less than 3 years old.
I hated that battery since early on, it would die without a second glance!
If I left my lights on for ten minutes? It was gone!

I purchased an H5 from Walmart....... yes, I know the T5 is shorter but I have the height with my front seat set up.

I am so happy with this battery!
It its better!
it works better!
I left my lights on for 45 minutes today..... it wasn't fazed by it!

That NAPA crap? Pisses me off...
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 25, 2024 5:03 pm    Post subject: Re: Battery Dead after 2 weeks sitting since last ran Reply with quote

That makes perfect sense, and Thanks!
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 25, 2024 6:43 pm    Post subject: Re: Battery Dead after 2 weeks sitting since last ran Reply with quote

djkeev wrote:
I purchased an H5 from Walmart...

I am so happy with this battery!
It its better!
it works better!
I left my lights on for 45 minutes today... it wasn't fazed by it!


I hate Walmart as a company, and lots of people have had issues with their batteries, but my van's 5-year-old Walmart battery that lost its cranking amps about 6 months ago is still sitting in my garage... just read 12.6V and hasn't had the charger on it for about a month. The Cabriolet's T5, bought/installed at nearly the same time as the van's that was replaced, is still going. The average life of a starting battery in Phoenix is 3 years. Thoroughly impressed with the EverStart Maxx batteries.

The O'Reilly battery in my GTI didn't last 2 years (when the factory battery died, the car was parked in front of the van and the Cabriolet was out of commission; O'Reilly is in walking distance, so...). They had to do a warranty replacement. Next time it dies, it's getting an EverStart.
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 25, 2024 6:48 pm    Post subject: Re: Battery Dead after 2 weeks sitting since last ran Reply with quote

It might be worth disconnecting the alternator first. A diode can fail and drain the battery. It won’t show up with your fuse test. You can do that after isolating the alternator as the draw.
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 26, 2024 11:13 am    Post subject: Re: Battery Dead after 2 weeks sitting since last ran Reply with quote

Walmart often has the best price on Prestone Antifreeze. Order enough and you get free delivery, and for tires, also a great price for good quality, and their tire install center I use is top notch, run by a Marine who knows his stuff.
Just saying, sorry you had a bad experience with Walmart, I never have had a bad experience with them.
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 26, 2024 7:22 pm    Post subject: Re: Battery Dead after 2 weeks sitting since last ran Reply with quote

With any electrical problem like this you really need to be methodical and thorough. First check the charging system. Make sure there are no significant voltage drops under full load between the alternator and the battery. I can't even tell you how many times I have found basic problems there.

Then check for quiescent and possibly intermittent draws. A test light does not cut it. You need an ammeter. One that reads down to milliamperes. Use a shunt to keep the battery connected when fussing with the meter. Interrupting the battery connection during testing can affect things.

Batteries can fail in many ways. Even a carbon pile load test is not always conclusive. There can be cracked plates that move. Plates that short intermittently. And plenty of other phenomena.

Try not to interfere with the vehicle when testing. The observer can influence the observed. And any test you perform should be able to get repeatable accurate test results. If the results are not repeatable there is probably an error in the test methodology.
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