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Borg
Samba Member
Joined: October 18, 2012
Posts: 120
Location: Western Washington
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 Posted: Fri Mar 29, 2024 9:28 am Post subject: $&#(@)! grounds... |
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Just venting a bit, some of you will understand
After a too long stretch of impersonating a brick, my van is finally running. So I'm happily driving up and down my little dead end street trying to burp the 2.2l Subaru motor coolant system when the heater fan, radio and interior lights all stop working. 
Between the PO's questionable wiring practices, my having R&R'd the dash to paint the van while it was dormant and the nasty little speed bumps on my road I'm pretty sure a ground has been lost somewhere back in the spaghetti mess behind the steering column.
And here I was thinking today would be a good day to put the new carpet kit in...
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Steve |
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Silverghost500
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Joined: August 01, 2018
Posts: 1085
Location: Atlanta, GA
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| Posted: Fri Mar 29, 2024 10:22 am Post subject: Re: $&#(@)! grounds... |
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One step forward, a few steps back. Man, I know that dance well.
Behind the driver's side of the dash is what's called a ground tree. It's a round object screwed into the bodywork, and should have several ground wires attached to it. I'd check that.
Next would be ground strap for the battery. Make sure it's not come loose. Also a good time to check it for corrosion if it's the original braided line, as well as corrosion between the ground strap and body work.
If that checks out, there should be a braided ground strap from transmission mount to the frame under the van.
There should also be a ground wire from engine to bodywork.
Hope that helps.
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1986 Volkswagen Vanagon Westfalia "Von Westy"
Honda K24A converversion-Road Testing Phase
3-Speed Automatic
Von Westy YouTube Channel
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCbhyZYxJEQrUuLnMbLleeIA |
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jimf909 
Samba Member
Joined: April 03, 2014
Posts: 7455
Location: WA/ID
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| Posted: Fri Mar 29, 2024 10:57 am Post subject: Re: $&#(@)! grounds... |
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A very helpful thread covering Vanagon grounds:
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=548492
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- Jim
| Abscate wrote: |
Do not get killed, do not kill others.
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Current: 1990 Westy Camper - Bostig RG4, 2wd, manual trans w/Peloquin, NAHT high-top, 280 ah LFP battery, 160 watts solar, Flash Silver, seam rust, bondo, etc., etc.
Past: 1985 Westy Camper - 1.9 wbx, 2wd, manual trans, Merian Brown, (sold after 17 years to Northwesty who converted it to a Syncro). |
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Sodo
Samba Member
Joined: July 06, 2007
Posts: 9600
Location: Western WA
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| Posted: Fri Mar 29, 2024 12:28 pm Post subject: Re: $&#(@)! grounds... |
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| Silverghost500 wrote: |
| there should be a braided ground strap from transmission mount to the frame under the van. |
If giving any effort to the transmission ground, delete the VW strap & replace with one in the proper location.
Direct contact with the device it serves.
On a 35 year old vehicle it’s worthwhile to get your grounds in order prior to wasting time on wild goose chases caused by corroded grounds.
Your problem may disappear.
But if it’s still there, at least the next diagnostic steps are more valid.
And your van has an easy “upgrade”.
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'90 Westy EJ25, 2Peloquins, 3knobs, pressure-oiled GT mainshaft, filtered, cooled gearbox
'87 Tintop w 47k 53k, '12 SmallCar EJ25, cooled filtered gearbox
....KTMs, GasGas, SPOT mtb |
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djkeev
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Joined: September 30, 2007
Posts: 32561
Location: Reading Pennsylvania
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markswagen
Samba Member
Joined: January 28, 2018
Posts: 1019
Location: san diego
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| Posted: Fri Mar 29, 2024 3:22 pm Post subject: Re: $&#(@)! grounds... |
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what year is the van.
does it start and run, do the gages, turn signals, wipers etc work
if late model, there are two large red wires that go to the fuse panel, they are only just the right length.
l see them come off causing all sorts of troubles, admittedly more troubles than you are describing, but it's not uncommon for stereo installers to use a local ground when installing a stereo, instead of taking a wire back to the stock ground location, and as has already been mentioned the interior lights don't get their grounds their either.
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markswagen {mobile mechanic} san diego area all early VW's cared for.
619 201 0310 |
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Borg
Samba Member
Joined: October 18, 2012
Posts: 120
Location: Western Washington
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| Posted: Fri Mar 29, 2024 3:25 pm Post subject: Re: $&#(@)! grounds... |
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| djkeev wrote: |
| Well....... the interior lights don't use that ground tree...... they get their ground from the body at the door switch. |
Good point
But I was just looking up into the space behind the fuse block, poked a bit of spaghetti wiring and everything came back to life. Remember my comment about the PO and his wiring practices. At least I've isolated the area to work on and it is clearly a loose connection in the area.
On the up side I still have two months before I want to drive the beast to Port Townsend so I finally have someplace comfortable to sleep before watching the start of the 2024 R2AK (Race to Alaska, an unsupported adventure race for human and/or wind powered craft up the Inside Passage to Ketchikan AK).
Plenty of time...
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Steve |
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Borg
Samba Member
Joined: October 18, 2012
Posts: 120
Location: Western Washington
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| Posted: Sat Apr 13, 2024 8:16 pm Post subject: Re: $&#(@)! grounds... |
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After poking around a bit more i have discovered that the problem is not on the ground but on the "hot" side. One of the two red wires going into the panel itself has just a wee bit of play in the male connector, wiggle the fitting just a hair and it loses it's connection to the rest of the panel. This particular red wire goes up into the ignition switch, makes sense as I first noticed the problem when the heater blower stopped running while I was driving the van burping the radiator and the radio turned off. Looks like I'm dealing with the "ignition switched' side of things.
I have polished the connectors and made sure the crimps are good, it is definitely the male blade to box interface that has an issue. When I get back to the van tomorrow I'll take a deeper look but it didn't appear that the panel is meant to come apart, which would be nice because then I could just solder the bits together. Any tips on getting in there?
Looks like a new panel is $165 or so...at least it isn't unobtanium but actually fixing it would be more satisfying.
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Steve |
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crazyvwvanman
Samba Member
Joined: January 28, 2008
Posts: 9913
Location: Orbiting San Diego
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| Posted: Yesterday 5:49 am Post subject: Re: $&#(@)! grounds... |
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Those red wires plug into the P spades of the panel.
All of the P spades are connected together inside the panel.
Most of the time only a couple of the P spades are used.
Maybe there is another one of the same size available to try.
The P spades are grouped together, as seen best on the Bentley diagram for early 86.
Here is a drawing from the gallery showing the 7 grouped P spades.
Mark |
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Borg
Samba Member
Joined: October 18, 2012
Posts: 120
Location: Western Washington
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| Posted: Yesterday 9:40 am Post subject: Re: $&#(@)! grounds... |
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I'll go poking around in there later with my multimeter. If they are all connected I suppose worst case scenario is to splice into the other line going in. Or maybe a better way to think of it is power going out...
Working on 2 hours of sleep this morning, my "high level" thinking isn't as sharp as it should be. Van work will be post-nap
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Steve |
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