Up in smoke... Bus fires... don't let it happen to you! FAQ

kombicol · Posted: Tue Apr 08, 2008 1:49 pm Post subject:

I recognise that burnout - and the wrecker it sits at....the drivers side (RH in OZ) window winder is now in my bus....pretty sure the remains of the shell were cut up for scrap metal.

With regards to the thread topic, I use high quality EFI fuel hose on my EFI and non EFI volksies. This stuff is not strictly original, but is far better quality than the OG stuff & have had no problems.

72Bay&SB'vert-n-KS · Posted: Wed Apr 09, 2008 8:56 pm Post subject:

Has anyone seen this video yet? Very sad. The song playing the background is very appropre.

http://myspacetv.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=vids.individual&videoid=1688997
_________________
Current VW's:
1972 Super Beetle Convertible
1972 Super Beetle Sedan
1972 Weekender Bus
2007 GTI

VW's of my past:
1979 Super Beetle Convertible (95-97)
1974 Super Beetle (97)
1967 Beetle (97-99)
2003 New Beetle 1.8 Turbo (03-07)
1969 Beetle Convertible (05-07)

calivw78 · Samba Member Joined: June 27, 2004 Posts: 101

cardinal0128 · Posted: Fri Apr 25, 2008 10:46 am Post subject:

On the fire extinguisher issue, I think its a good call to have two onboard. Right now, I only have one, and it's a halon in the back under the sink (probably not enough time to get to it in an emergency anyhow). I'm planning on picking up a decent one at WalMart or Home Depot and mounting it right behind the driver's seat by the door.

Halon, if you can still find it, works really well on gas fires in enclosed spaces (ie the bus engine room). The key would be to not open the engine lid, and instead spray the halon in through one of the vents. Blocking off the opposite vent would be ideal. I'm assuming most fires would be on the top of the engine anyway, and this would almost certainly extinguish it.
_________________
1978 Westy, stock
1967 Beetle (sold)
1993 Ford F-150 v8 5 sp
1965 Jeep CJ-5
2002 Jetta TDI

WhirledTraveller · Posted: Sat Apr 26, 2008 6:16 am Post subject:

"Real" Halon is almost impossible to buy since it's a CFC and can't be legally manufactured in most first world countries. However "Halotron" is an ozone friendly alternative that's supposedly just as good.

If you have a real Halon fire extinguisher please recycle it properly. You might be able to get money for it, the Halon can be removed and reused for certain applications that require it (Aircraft etc). The price for Halon is incredible... to refill an aircraft fire bottle can cost $5000.
_________________
1977 Westy, Automatic. Big Valve heads, CS Cam.

asafk · Posted: Sat Apr 26, 2008 12:56 pm Post subject:

Just wondering... Why no one is using an automatic fire extinguishing system?
somthing like:
http://www.firetrex.fr/index.htm
http://www.ompracing.it/detail.html?productcode=CA/369

there are many systems out there - some expensive, some just "not cheap", but is there a price for a burnt bus?

Asaf.
Rolling Eyes

BryGer · Samba Member Joined: September 13, 2007 Posts: 28

Take a look in your engine compartment, up by the oil bath air filter (if it's still there, or where it used to be) There should be a buckle where a small extinguisher can be mounted, and a small hole leading to the front, for a cable to run through. Now, just find the right way to activate it with a cable....It took me a while to get the right extinguisher...

stevem49090 · Samba Member Joined: June 09, 2004 Posts: 203

I have been smelling fuel for some months now and finally dove in and took the carbs off the engine and got in behind the tank firewall. All the vapor lines were in great shape except for the rubber connector that attaches on the tank and leads to the vent by the filler neck. I don't see that listed on any of the schematics. It has a part number of 211 201 157a. I found that a pvc hose for an older chrysler works great as a replacement.
_________________
Good health is merely the slowest possible rate at which one can die.

99 New Beetle
72 Ghia convert.
73 Westy

dutchsher · Posted: Sat May 31, 2008 10:16 pm Post subject:

wanderglobe · Posted: Mon Jun 02, 2008 2:03 pm Post subject:

gunnar89 · Posted: Sun Jun 22, 2008 2:48 am Post subject:

well i always had a idea for the fire extinguisher system. Its probably stupid but hear me out. take 2 fire extinguishers and mount them on the hatch or some place were there both facing the engines hot spots for fires. and take out the pins on the handle and put like some paper or something to replace them. and have then handle "the part that u squeeze to spray" spring loaded so if there was ever a fire in the engine room the fire will burn the paper holding back the extinguishers making them go off on the engine and hopefully setting the fire out with out any problems.sounds stupid i no but if u can think of a better way more power to u Very Happy

Westy Driver · Posted: Tue Jul 08, 2008 12:33 pm Post subject:

borrowed from the girls with bays sticky, looks like a good location for a fire extinguisher...

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

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Gandalf - '76 Westfalia Deluxe Campmobile

calebmelvin · Posted: Tue Jul 08, 2008 11:31 pm Post subject:

Poor sad '69, burnt badly.

Seen here: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=624126
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'68 Tagged Manx | My Wanted Ads
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Malokin Martin · Posted: Wed Jul 09, 2008 9:51 am Post subject:

64Bug · Posted: Wed Jul 16, 2008 10:42 am Post subject: Fire extinguishers

Nice van above, which, IMHO I would definitely “NOT” locate the fire extinguisher on the bumper outside of the engine compartment. It would be OK if the fire was in a headlight, but where do the majority of fires occur?

Scenario: You’re driving along enjoying the scenery and notice the fire in the back. By the time you get out and open the engine door, it will be so dam hot you won’t be able to get within 10 feet of it, let alone operate the extinguisher. Have you noticed the pics of engine fires? The metal is melted. Magnesium based metals burn at a much higher temperature.

Our company, at least once a year, mandates every employee to take fire extinguisher training. They teach us about the characteristics of fire, the types of extinguishers and allow us to physically operate a real extinguisher in a controlled environment.

How many of you have had that type of training or even operated one?

Fact: Did you know that a 2 pound ABC extinguisher will blow out powder for “2 Seconds”? A 5 pound for 5 seconds and so and so on. Get the picture?

Fact: After putting out a fire, always back away from the scene. Never turn your back on the extinguished fire. It may flare up again.

Try to imagine using a 2 pound extinguisher on your pride and joy in the “heat” of the moment and getting two seconds of powder. (No pun intended)

They may not be the prettiest thing to have in your ride, but in this case, BIGGER is better.

If I appear to be blunt, please accept my apologies. I love my VW so much I tend to get paranoid about things like this and knowledge is power.

p.s. Do you have one in home? Food for thought!
_________________
When you turn it on, does it return the favor?

1974 Westfalia
1964 Beetle (stock)
2017 Santa Fe

Wildthings · Samba Member Joined: March 13, 2005 Posts: 50353

I wonder what percentage of bus fires could have been put out with a 2# extinguisher, or even a 5# extinguisher. As 64Bug says, by the time you notice the smoke or flames things are going to be pretty hot. Once the fuel lines burn through and you are getting gravity feed from the tank its all over. Maybe the best thing to have would be a high temperature warning alarm. If the engine compartment temps get up above say 250°F then you get an alarm and can kill the engine and thereby stop or lessen the fuel flow so your extinguisher has a chance.

6d4vdub · Posted: Wed Jul 16, 2008 5:17 pm Post subject:

Check this out it looks like the right thing to have on any VW. Mount it on the roof of the engine bay. I think I'll have get one. http://gulffishing.com/np06seafire.html
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South Jersey VW Club. www.sjvwc.net
Jack Kessel [email protected]

tilly · Posted: Sat Aug 02, 2008 5:29 pm Post subject:

If anyone wants any info on the automatic fire extinguishing systems, I install these, and can answer some of your questions...

No, they are not cheap, but what cost is a new bus, and the hard work you put into it...

http://www.firetrace.co.uk/whatis.html

6d4vdub · Posted: Sat Aug 02, 2008 6:19 pm Post subject:

Tilly, the thing I have to check is how hot the engine compartment gets, I see the extinguishers I posted a link to go off at 190o

At what Temp. will The FryerTrace system go off at?

Jack
_________________
South Jersey VW Club. www.sjvwc.net
Jack Kessel [email protected]

tilly · Posted: Sun Aug 03, 2008 12:28 am Post subject:

The tube will rupture at 120 centigrade....

You would need to run the bus up to temp, and put in a temperature probe in the engine bay to find out what the maximum temperature achieved is...

120c is pretty much ok for most applications. I have a system on my Eunos, which has never got anywhere near that temp.

You also have to consider the extinguishant medium. For a fuel fire, I'd recommend AFFF Foam. Dry powder leaves a crusty mess, and FM200 might put out the flames temporarily, but you need to smother the fuel, incase it ignites again on the hot engine.

You can also run off a pressure switch to activate any fuel cut offs, or provide a warning on the dash...

The detection tubing is P clipped onto the top of the engine bay.


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