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JasianBusBoi Samba Member
Joined: January 15, 2024 Posts: 14 Location: United States
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Posted: Mon Jan 15, 2024 3:26 pm Post subject: Help identifying cut piping on a Type 4 Engine |
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Hello all-
I am not sure what I am looking at after pulling this Type 4 from a 74 Westy. I was just about to disassemble it and noticed some cut pipes. Can someone help me identify what they are?
Thanks
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KentABQ Samba Member
Joined: September 11, 2016 Posts: 2406 Location: Albuquerque NM
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Posted: Mon Jan 15, 2024 3:30 pm Post subject: Re: Help identifying cut piping on a Type 4 Engine |
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Those were injection ports from the smog pump.
Exhaust was circulated back into the combustion chamber thru those ports. _________________ -Kent-
1976 Riviera, 1.8l FI chrome yellow VAN - "Chloe"
"I must say, how can you be in a bad mood driving this vehicle full of vibrant color.
Cars of today are so bland in comparison. It's like driving a celebration!" ---WildIdea
Bus ownership via emoticons:
---williamM
Last edited by KentABQ on Mon Jan 15, 2024 3:32 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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busdaddy Samba Member
Joined: February 12, 2004 Posts: 51057 Location: Surrey B.C. Canada, but thinking of Ukraine
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Posted: Mon Jan 15, 2024 3:30 pm Post subject: Re: Help identifying cut piping on a Type 4 Engine |
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Welcome!
Those were once part of the air injection/exhaust afterburner system.
If they are in your way 10mm x 1.0 hex drive pipe plugs, or valve adjuster screws do a good job of plugging the hole into the exhaust port down under the fins. _________________ Rust NEVER sleeps and stock never goes out of style.
Please don't PM technical questions, ask your problem in public so everyone can play along. If you think it's too stupid post it here
Stop dead photo links! Post your photos to The Samba Gallery!
Слава Україні! |
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JasianBusBoi Samba Member
Joined: January 15, 2024 Posts: 14 Location: United States
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Posted: Mon Jan 15, 2024 3:54 pm Post subject: Re: Help identifying cut piping on a Type 4 Engine |
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Thanks for the info and providing info on how to plug them up! |
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Wildthings Samba Member
Joined: March 13, 2005 Posts: 50261
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Posted: Mon Jan 15, 2024 4:08 pm Post subject: Re: Help identifying cut piping on a Type 4 Engine |
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I would be afraid they might break off if you attempted to remove them. Just remove the old tubing at the nut and braze to piece going into the head closed. |
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aeromech Samba Member
Joined: January 24, 2006 Posts: 16926 Location: San Diego, California
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Posted: Mon Jan 15, 2024 6:50 pm Post subject: Re: Help identifying cut piping on a Type 4 Engine |
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Turns out I’m working on this today. If they remove okay then you can buy plugs from [email protected]. If they don’t remove well then you’ll be as screwed as me _________________ Lead Mechanic: San Diego Air and Space Museum
Licensed Airframe and Powerplant Mechanic
Licensed Pilot (Single engine Land)
Boeing 727,737-200-300-400,757,767
Airbus A319,320,321
DC9/MD80
BAe146
Fokker F28/F100
VW type 1 1962,63,65,69,72
VW Type 2 1971 (3 ea.) 1978, 1969
VW Jetta
VW Passat
Capable of leaping tall buildings in a single bound |
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Abscate Samba Member
Joined: October 05, 2014 Posts: 22568 Location: NYC/Upstate/ROW
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Posted: Mon Jan 15, 2024 7:23 pm Post subject: Re: Help identifying cut piping on a Type 4 Engine |
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Air injection, not exhaust. EGR is exhaust recirculation, which is different.
Warm those fittings up with propane heat for sixty seconds and they will come apart like magic. Put a wrench on them cold and you will cry tears _________________ .ssS! |
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aeromech Samba Member
Joined: January 24, 2006 Posts: 16926 Location: San Diego, California
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Posted: Mon Jan 15, 2024 7:40 pm Post subject: Re: Help identifying cut piping on a Type 4 Engine |
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Damn,
Looking at your pics. Seems like a model T engine. No offense but I started working on these about 50 years ago and times have changed _________________ Lead Mechanic: San Diego Air and Space Museum
Licensed Airframe and Powerplant Mechanic
Licensed Pilot (Single engine Land)
Boeing 727,737-200-300-400,757,767
Airbus A319,320,321
DC9/MD80
BAe146
Fokker F28/F100
VW type 1 1962,63,65,69,72
VW Type 2 1971 (3 ea.) 1978, 1969
VW Jetta
VW Passat
Capable of leaping tall buildings in a single bound |
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mikedjames Samba Member
Joined: July 02, 2012 Posts: 2714 Location: Hamble, Hampshire, UK
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Posted: Tue Jan 16, 2024 11:56 am Post subject: Re: Help identifying cut piping on a Type 4 Engine |
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aeromech wrote: |
Damn,
Looking at your pics. Seems like a model T engine. No offense but I started working on these about 50 years ago and times have changed |
50 years ago, the newest Ford Model T was newer than some buses with T4 engines in them are now.....
Ford 1927-> 1973 = 46 years ..
bus 1973->2024 = 51 years.
Strange thoughts. _________________ Ancient vehicles and vessels
1974 VW T2 : Devon Eurovette camper with 1641 DP T1 engine, Progressive carb, full flow oil cooler, EDIS crank timed ignition.
Engine 1: 40k miles (rocker shaft clip fell off), Engine 2: 30k miles (rebuild, dropped valve). Engine 3: a JK Preservation Parts "new" engine, aluminium case: 26k miles: new top end.
Gearbox rebuild 2021 by Bears.
1979 Westerly GK24 24 foot racer/cruiser yacht Forethought of Gosport.
1973 wooden Pacer sailing dinghy |
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fusername Samba Member
Joined: March 15, 2006 Posts: 2897 Location: Boston MA
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Posted: Thu Feb 22, 2024 8:42 pm Post subject: Re: Help identifying cut piping on a Type 4 Engine |
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trying to find a picture of one of these pipes not installed. i have a bus that ejected one of them and I can't find it, want to make something but I'm not sure how long to make it. can't guess with whta I have since theres a solid chance the threads are stripped out, so i can't guage it in place and I don't want to try to remove one of the other plugs that are installed, since they are all kludged, none are actually the og part. _________________ [email protected]
Need something custom bent up? shoot me an email, maybe we can make it work!
FORSALE: Thrust cut T4 and 1.9 main bearings
obnoxiousblue wrote: |
Maybe Ben Pon's ghost comes and vomits NOS stampings for your bus, but not mine! |
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aeromech Samba Member
Joined: January 24, 2006 Posts: 16926 Location: San Diego, California
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Posted: Thu Feb 22, 2024 9:04 pm Post subject: Re: Help identifying cut piping on a Type 4 Engine |
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I recently fixed this problem for a customer. It involved removing the engine and upper cylinder tin. _________________ Lead Mechanic: San Diego Air and Space Museum
Licensed Airframe and Powerplant Mechanic
Licensed Pilot (Single engine Land)
Boeing 727,737-200-300-400,757,767
Airbus A319,320,321
DC9/MD80
BAe146
Fokker F28/F100
VW type 1 1962,63,65,69,72
VW Type 2 1971 (3 ea.) 1978, 1969
VW Jetta
VW Passat
Capable of leaping tall buildings in a single bound |
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airschooled Air-Schooled
Joined: April 04, 2012 Posts: 12688 Location: on a bike ride somewhere
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Posted: Thu Feb 22, 2024 10:25 pm Post subject: Re: Help identifying cut piping on a Type 4 Engine |
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Wait, are you actually trying to repair the air injection system? That was single-handedly the worst thing VW ever did to the Type 4 engine….
If you want to plug it, a M10x1.0 set screw works. That’s a great use for an old T4 valve adjuster screw…. I slather the upper threads in copper RTV. They’re in hot exhaust flow, but not combustion pressure. Gravity + some thread engagement + cleanly applied RTV should get you many many miles.
Robbie _________________ Learn how your vintage VW works. And why it doesn't!
One-on-one tech help for your Volkswagen:
www.airschooled.com |
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aeromech Samba Member
Joined: January 24, 2006 Posts: 16926 Location: San Diego, California
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Posted: Fri Feb 23, 2024 7:21 pm Post subject: Re: Help identifying cut piping on a Type 4 Engine |
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Here's a plug that popped out
Here's the plugs I made
It's a double plug. The m10X1.0 valve adjuster backed up by a pipe plug _________________ Lead Mechanic: San Diego Air and Space Museum
Licensed Airframe and Powerplant Mechanic
Licensed Pilot (Single engine Land)
Boeing 727,737-200-300-400,757,767
Airbus A319,320,321
DC9/MD80
BAe146
Fokker F28/F100
VW type 1 1962,63,65,69,72
VW Type 2 1971 (3 ea.) 1978, 1969
VW Jetta
VW Passat
Capable of leaping tall buildings in a single bound |
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JasianBusBoi Samba Member
Joined: January 15, 2024 Posts: 14 Location: United States
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Posted: Wed Feb 28, 2024 6:57 am Post subject: Re: Help identifying cut piping on a Type 4 Engine |
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I see mention of M10 x 1MM to plug the holes. What is the best way of avoiding the screw from bottoming out? Is there an ideal length to use? |
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aeromech Samba Member
Joined: January 24, 2006 Posts: 16926 Location: San Diego, California
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Posted: Wed Feb 28, 2024 7:11 am Post subject: Re: Help identifying cut piping on a Type 4 Engine |
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When I installed the plugs they did bottom out. Then I installed the backup lock _________________ Lead Mechanic: San Diego Air and Space Museum
Licensed Airframe and Powerplant Mechanic
Licensed Pilot (Single engine Land)
Boeing 727,737-200-300-400,757,767
Airbus A319,320,321
DC9/MD80
BAe146
Fokker F28/F100
VW type 1 1962,63,65,69,72
VW Type 2 1971 (3 ea.) 1978, 1969
VW Jetta
VW Passat
Capable of leaping tall buildings in a single bound |
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busdaddy Samba Member
Joined: February 12, 2004 Posts: 51057 Location: Surrey B.C. Canada, but thinking of Ukraine
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Posted: Wed Feb 28, 2024 9:54 am Post subject: Re: Help identifying cut piping on a Type 4 Engine |
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Interesting question, I've never studied the hole that closely, yet they all seem to stop after going in a dozen(ish) turns, the threads might end before the edge of the port?, or maybe there's so much carbon built up in the threads it jams them there? _________________ Rust NEVER sleeps and stock never goes out of style.
Please don't PM technical questions, ask your problem in public so everyone can play along. If you think it's too stupid post it here
Stop dead photo links! Post your photos to The Samba Gallery!
Слава Україні! |
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Clatter Samba Member
Joined: September 24, 2003 Posts: 7527 Location: Santa Cruz
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Posted: Thu Feb 29, 2024 8:03 am Post subject: Re: Help identifying cut piping on a Type 4 Engine |
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If you really want to do the best job EMW sells aluminum plugs for these.
You tap to an oversize and thread them clear thru to where they protrude into the port.
Then you can die-grind the plug smooth/flush with the exhaust port wall and make sure the port flows nicely with no disturbance/turbulance. _________________ Bus Motor Build
What’s That Noise?!? |
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fusername Samba Member
Joined: March 15, 2006 Posts: 2897 Location: Boston MA
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Posted: Thu Mar 21, 2024 6:35 pm Post subject: Re: Help identifying cut piping on a Type 4 Engine |
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so on my motor in my other bus, I bought bolts from mcmaster, ran them in, then marked and cut the ends ot match the contour of the exhaust path. lots of work since they need to come back out for the sheetmetal, and i didnt realize how tihgt they would be with the intake but it worked, this was a FI motor. my current issue is on a different bus with a motor installed. unfortunatly it looks like the threads all got stripped out, since the stud i have is 50mm long and slips in, and looking at the photo there should actually be about 45mm of bolt past the surface of the head. measuring off hte picture you posted, its also 45mm so i guess I was right. im thinking i'll slather it in jb-weld and stick it back in, there is ZERO thread left, it just slips on in, must have had next to nothing holding it in place originally. I was going to make a fancy wedge peice on my lathe for it out of aluminum so the steel/aluminum combo didn't start to leak over time, but i guess i really have do actually do that now. nice that the threads are optional for me tho, as that is an odd size. _________________ [email protected]
Need something custom bent up? shoot me an email, maybe we can make it work!
FORSALE: Thrust cut T4 and 1.9 main bearings
obnoxiousblue wrote: |
Maybe Ben Pon's ghost comes and vomits NOS stampings for your bus, but not mine! |
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