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Aftermarket injectors for 1.9 and 2.1 Vanagons
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klucz
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 25, 2008 12:46 pm    Post subject: Re: These are new Reply with quote

Hey Matt, great thread! Very useful to know of alternative injectors. I'm not gonna pretend to understand the technical details of it all. But here are a couple of links I came across on the subject.
http://users.erols.com/srweiss/tableifc.htm
http://z-r-c.com/News/article/sid=32.html
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mattcfish
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 25, 2008 2:29 pm    Post subject: Re: These are new Reply with quote

klucz wrote:

http://users.erols.com/srweiss/tableifc.htm
http://z-r-c.com/News/article/sid=32.html


Very useful links. They are definately Lucas #5202003, it's stamped right on them.
lbs/hr=17.9
cc/min.=188.1
grams/min=135.3
rating PSI=36.25
rating Bars=2.50

Bosch#0-280-150-206
lbs/hr=16.0
cc/min=168.2
grams/min=121.0
rating PSI=36.25
rating Bars=2.50
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Last edited by mattcfish on Fri Jan 25, 2008 4:19 pm; edited 1 time in total
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tclark
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 25, 2008 3:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well Looks like this might be a sticky on injectors
So here is more info on x-ref numbers:

OEM Pintle Style
vw 025-906-031 15.8ohms, [email protected] bar, 16.1lbs/hr, 36.3 psi,
bosch-280 150 206
Volvo-1306933
BWD, Borg Warner(Niehoff)-57530
ECHLIN-218530
BeckArney-1580218/1550026
Standard-FJ18
GP Sorenson-8001206N
GB REMANUFACTURING-852-13118
AIRTEX-4G1608
Fuel Injection Corp 390206

Rotary Disc Style
CVU-CVU52-13118 www.cvunlimited.com
TomCo-15501

and I guess I now add
Lucas/Delphi- 5202003


Last edited by tclark on Mon Feb 04, 2008 10:53 am; edited 8 times in total
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mattcfish
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 25, 2008 4:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

and Delphi #FJ10319

Anybody try some of these other injectors on a Vanagon?
Looks like lots of choices.
Lucas was sold to TRW in 1999, Delphi was part of TRW. TRW was sold to Grumman...and it gets sort of confusing after that.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LucasVarity
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mattcfish
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 26, 2008 11:56 am    Post subject: Pictures Reply with quote

Pictures of Tomco Lucas rotary disk injector for Vanagon

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tclark
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 12, 2008 1:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

So I got my tomco injectors today

on 1 side of the injector is the assumed
lucas number 5202003
on the opposite side are these#'s
3 have #5720XD600 and 1 has #5720D600

then on ridge above the main injector body
CAV 2293, 2298 3158 1608 so that looks like
some s/n#


and well they are in and they work Smile
with the new afm & the tomco injectors that van is running like it never has Smile
very smooth

I was a bit taken back when you compare the length of the tomco injectors to the bosch injector

they are shorter by about the length of the pintle on the bosch but they do fit in the opening with the smaller seal installed they are just higher up in the injector passage also the harness does NOT click on the little ridge is not quite like the bosch but it does fit & lock

well I will report back on mileage next week
and I guess the real question is durability but at $36/pop NEW I think they can replaced as often as a bosch cleaning
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mattcfish
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 15, 2008 12:16 pm    Post subject: Re: These are new Reply with quote

Got my Witch Hunter test results. The Tomco injectors scored better than expected.
Only slightly more flow than the Bosch, less than posted results.

Witch Hunter results:Tomco 15501/Lucas 5202003
Resistance=15.9
leak test=PASS
Spray pattern=Good (Good/Fair/Poor/)
Static flow=95.8
Pulsed flow @2500rpm=103.6
Balance=1.55% (anthing under 4% is good)
lbs/hr=16.7
cc/min=175
grams/min=125.9
rating PSI=36.25
rating Bars=2.50

Test results from the Web:
Tomco 15501/Lucas 5202003
lbs/hr=17.9
cc/min.=188.1
grams/min=135.3
rating PSI=36.25
rating Bars=2.50

Bosch#0-280-150-206 (posted rating for new injectors)
lbs/hr=16.0
cc/min=168.2
grams/min=121.0
rating PSI=36.25
rating Bars=2.50

Anybody have test results for reconditioned Bosch injectors?
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tclark
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 15, 2008 2:37 pm    Post subject: Re: These are new Reply with quote

mattcfish wrote:

Anybody have test results for reconditioned Bosch injectors?


http://members.shaw.ca/trclark/Volkswagen-Bus-Vanagon_files/85VangonInjector.html
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tclark
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 27, 2008 4:11 pm    Post subject: 10 month check in on TomCo injectors Reply with quote

Just FYI
It now going on 10 months now and I can say I dont see any real difference
between the cleaned Bosch injectors I had before they started to drip
and these brand new TomCo injectors

mattcfish .. how would you say your results are ?
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mattcfish
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 28, 2008 8:03 pm    Post subject: Re: 10 month check in on TomCo injectors Reply with quote

tclark wrote:
Just FYI
It now going on 10 months now and I can say I dont see any real difference
between the cleaned Bosch injectors I had before they started to drip
and these brand new TomCo injectors

mattcfish .. how would you say your results are ?


I agree. I've got as many months on my Tomco's and they perform as well as Bosch. I put these in while I was having my Bosch injectors cleaned. I planned to put the Bosch back in, but haven't needed to. Running 22 mpg on my 2.2L.
I'm not saying to through the Bosch away, but these seem to be a good economical alternative.
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Terry Kay
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 28, 2008 9:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
I bought them. I'll get the other 2 from Tomco. I figure I can use them for a while and get the Bosch rebuilt. Who knows, maybe I'll want to keep them in.


Let's have an understanding here.
Electromagnetic injector's cannot be rebuilt.
They can be pressure cleaned,& tested for continuity only.

The only injector;s that can truely remanufactured/ rebuilt is a mechanical injector.

Don't dump your money into a flushed out, half dead injector.
If the electro magnet fries a week after you've had them cleaned--your done.

I'd invest in a set of the new Tomco's and feel much more secure with them than a 20 year old, just cleaned out orfice injector.
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Terry Kay
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 28, 2008 7:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This is real good information for those of you tossing your Dracma's away having your million miled injector's cleaned, remanned, rebuilt, refurbished, rehabbed--whatever.

"New" is alway's a better deal---
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Randy in Maine
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 28, 2008 7:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

A cleaned and calibrated Bosch injectors is as good as any other ones out there. New or used.

I have had 3 or 4 sets cleaned for different applications and they have come back completley serviceable and flow tested. If they "burn out resistance wise" that guy at cruzin will call you up and tell you it is bunk.
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Terry Kay
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 28, 2008 9:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
A cleaned and calibrated Bosch injectors is as good as any other ones out there. New or used.


And there ya have it Mom's & Dads, Boy's & Girl's.
You heard it here first.

Reman / rebuilt used stuff is as good, if not better than new, and will undoubtably last as long.

PTL, it's a miracle.
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Randy in Maine
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 29, 2008 5:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Terry, they just have to work. Cleaned/calibrated old or new, they just have to work within the spec.

You more than anyone here should know that half of that new chineese made crap doesn't work as well as my 30 year old German made Bosch stuff.
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Terry Kay
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 29, 2008 7:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Randy,
My thought on this cleaning & hoping for new performance outa old injector's is;
You can only run so much fluid through the same hole for so long without the orfice being altered.

Example;

I have to change the oil furnaces burner nozzle once a year at work.
It wears out.
I have to change the stainless tip once every 6 months on the pressure washer.
It runs at 3500 lbs, and after about 6 months, the tip has hogged itself out, so the operating pressure drops.

The exact same thing will happen to any kinda orfice, be it an injector, or oil burning furnace, which depends on the proper amount of fluid to be delivered to opertate properly.

Now, as far as the Chinese connection, the last time I purchased a set of Beck injectors's they were Bosch.

The last time I bought a Beck cap & rotor,they were Bosch repackaged in a Beck box, which is usually the case.

I didn't see any chop suey markings on the body of the new injector's, so I'm gonna assume that they wern't manufactured in the land of Ho Chi Min.

They operate perfect, I had a 90 day guarantee on them, and I didn't need that cause the Van is running perfect, and much better than it did before I changed them.

If the engine was a Detroit Deisel, Mack, Cummin's , Cat with mechanical injector's--sure I'd have them rebuilt--I've done this a million times. ( and have had an occasional problem with a reman injector--) butfor the most part it's been OK.

The nozzle's have been replaced in any remaned diesel injector.

These fixed ,sealed, unremoveable tipped electric injector's can't really be totally rebuilt--just cleaned.

And for this very reason I choose to buy new.

The Tomco injector's are Joe Lucas--bought up bt TRW, and from reading all of the posts & results on the whole subject, don't sound like a bad part.

I don't know if they have an injection shop in Bejing.

Could--might.
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Last edited by Terry Kay on Sat Jan 10, 2009 6:31 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Bruce Wayne
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 09, 2009 9:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I got my Tomco injectors this afternoon. I will install them tomorrow.
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syncrosimon
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 10, 2009 3:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I just bought 4 injectors from German E-bay for 100 English Pounds.

Made in Spain, and Green.

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Bruce Wayne
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 10, 2009 4:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Installed the Tomco injectors this a.m. took about a 20 mile drive afterwards. didn't put the engine lid back on for the drive,damn that's loud! maybe on the next tank of gas I will get a little better mpg.
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sgtpepper
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 27, 2009 7:27 pm    Post subject: tomcos Reply with quote

As per Tencentlife's post, the new tomco disk injectors should have a slightly higher fuel consumption during warm-up - has anyone who runs these experienced this?
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