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2.0 ABA Block rebuild thread thinking in turbo=)
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rogertj
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 09, 2019 9:55 am    Post subject: 2.0 ABA Block rebuild thread thinking in turbo=) Reply with quote

Guys I have a temporary motor for my current setup but I don't see ABA anywhere around the block could you help me out of kind of motor is this? What year? Thanks in advance!

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Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


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1985 Vanagon ABA 2.0 Jetta conversion with 1.8 heads and 32/36 carburetor


Last edited by rogertj on Thu Feb 06, 2020 5:41 pm; edited 2 times in total
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khughes
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 09, 2019 11:12 am    Post subject: Re: What type of Tiico engine is this one? Reply with quote

That looks to be a Tiico motor. It has the Tiico accessory mounting plate and the mickey mouse injector manifold designed to reuse the vanagon WBX injectors. Tiico motors were not a "VW" motor in the sense that they were never a production engine. You're looking at a 1.8L block with a 2.0L crankshaft and rods, 2.5L (5 cyl) pistons with a 1.8L head. It was designated a "2LR" motor. FAS has parts for them, and pics on their site that will give you an idea of what the complete kit looks like ( http://www.foreignautosupply.com/parts-accessories/category/clearance/ )
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 09, 2019 11:53 am    Post subject: Re: What type of Tiico engine is this one? Reply with quote

rogertj wrote:
Guys I have a temporary motor for my current setup...

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I don't think that Tiico will do the Z car any favors. (Fun garage)
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 09, 2019 12:01 pm    Post subject: Re: What type of Tiico engine is this one? Reply with quote

It might be a 2.0 Audi tall block with a 1.8 head.
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 09, 2019 12:36 pm    Post subject: Re: What type of Tiico engine is this one? Reply with quote

Looking at the web page that you suggested It looks like it's an ABA block just compared it with mine and it looks the same, just for the water pump to compare it. I'm in the process right now at this precise moment

I measured the head intake manifold to what I have ( I have the 1985 1.8 head) and it is not a match. I will upload the photo shortly after this post.
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 09, 2019 12:49 pm    Post subject: Re: What type of Tiico engine is this one? Reply with quote

khughes wrote:
That looks to be a Tiico motor. It has the Tiico accessory mounting plate and the mickey mouse injector manifold designed to reuse the vanagon WBX injectors. Tiico motors were not a "VW" motor in the sense that they were never a production engine. You're looking at a 1.8L block with a 2.0L crankshaft and rods, 2.5L (5 cyl) pistons with a 1.8L head. It was designated a "2LR" motor. FAS has parts for them, and pics on their site that will give you an idea of what the complete kit looks like (http://www.foreignautosupply.com/parts-accessories/category/clearance/)


It was in fact a 2LR configuration. It says in the engine block with the aluminum tag on it.

This is the head that I have in the new motor

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


And this is what I joust to have

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Do you know of a supplier in San Diego open today saturday that could sell me the intake manifold for my 32/36 Weber carb? I now of Pierce manifolds but this guys are far away from me.

Thanks everyone for your continues help
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 09, 2019 12:55 pm    Post subject: Re: What type of Tiico engine is this one? Reply with quote

Can you make an adapter plate that would seal the injector cutouts? Sounds like you are in a hurry, but Goodson Tool sells a 2 part epoxy for reshaping ports. Your intake probably has the same bolt pattern.
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 09, 2019 1:45 pm    Post subject: Re: What type of Tiico engine is this one? Reply with quote

MarkWard wrote:
It might be a 2.0 Audi tall block with a 1.8 head.


Maybe... it's not the same block for sure for a moment I thought it was an ABA

Here are the photos in my next post of the difference
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 09, 2019 1:54 pm    Post subject: Re: What type of Tiico engine is this one? Reply with quote

MarkWard wrote:
Can you make an adapter plate that would seal the injector cutouts? Sounds like you are in a hurry, but Goodson Tool sells a 2 part epoxy for reshaping ports. Your intake probably has the same bolt pattern.


It is definitely an option but I'm going to return the block most.posibly they don't know what motor did it came from so I'm not buying any rescue mission. But it sure looks in good shape

Here are.the difference of blocks between the one I have and the one they are offering me


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Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


I think it's time for the Subaru Conversion!
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 09, 2019 2:10 pm    Post subject: Re: What type of Tiico engine is this one? Reply with quote

rogertj wrote:
MarkWard wrote:
Can you make an adapter plate that would seal the injector cutouts? Sounds like you are in a hurry, but Goodson Tool sells a 2 part epoxy for reshaping ports. Your intake probably has the same bolt pattern.


It is definitely an option but I'm going to return the block most.posibly they don't know what motor did it came from so I'm not buying any rescue mission. But it sure looks in good shape


The 2LR is a bit of a crapshoot for sure. Some were assembled properly and well balanced, some were pitiful. They were assembled by Remtec in South Africa. There's still a Tiico Group on Yahoo with the whole history of issues. They are also buzzier than an ABA due to having the higher piston/rod angle required for the shorter deck height and long stroke.
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 09, 2019 8:04 pm    Post subject: Re: What type of Tiico engine is this one? Reply with quote

rogertj wrote:
I think it's time for the Subaru Conversion!


You would be much happier, I am.....very brainless to have.

My good friend Paul in Chula Vista had a wonderful collection of all the various items to create I4 conversions back in the day at D&P Auto Dismantling in Chula Vista. All the parts ended up in Elsinore at InterState VW.

You may need to go dig around up there to get all the stuff you need.

We did cobble together I4 conversions form nearly all stock parts because they where everywhere. Combination of A1, A2 and A3 parts couple with Vanagon Diesel parts. But that was 20+ years ago.

It can be done with the right combination of stock parts.

But it is not a quick job.

Interstate should have everything you need, but you are going to have to dig and dig to get the magic combination.
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 10, 2019 11:03 am    Post subject: Re: What type of Tiico engine is this one? Reply with quote

You may not have to cobble parts together to do a VW inline gas engine conversion. Regardless, like the subaru swap, the conversion parts will cost a significant amount of money.

I see that the rogertj is located on the west coast so shipping costs from the east may be a concern but FAS has parts for the VW inline conversions:

http://www.foreignautosupply.com/parts-accessories...chI73eZOV4

From that page:

"Basic Install Kit will also fit; 2LR, ABA, or earlier equivalent codes. "

and

"**OE cast oil pan & diesel pick up tube & pump provided for some earlier conversions "

But, call and ask what they can supply and whats needed for your particular engine.

Of note, Quality German Auto Parts in California

http://www.qualitygermanautoparts.com/index.php?p=...ines%20MK3

has reconditioned ABA engines for $1000 + core charge if applicable. They also show diesel Vanagon components to do a swap.

Is your current engine damaged or otherwise inoperable?

In your image of the engine below, I find it odd that I can't see the engine model "code" stamped in the block at area above the crank case breather hole. Purely out of my own interest, I searched the head part number 044103373D and got results for T4 2.0 engines in Europe. e.g.

https://translate.google.ca/translate?sl=auto&...0-93r.html

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

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Vanagon VAG GAS engine swap Google Group:
https://tinyurl.com/2f24rmh

VE7TBN
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rogertj
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 16, 2019 7:05 am    Post subject: Re: What type of Tiico engine is this one? Reply with quote

r39o wrote:
rogertj wrote:
I think it's time for the Subaru Conversion!


You would be much happier, I am.....very brainless to have.

My good friend Paul in Chula Vista had a wonderful collection of all the various items to create I4 conversions back in the day at D&P Auto Dismantling in Chula Vista. All the parts ended up in Elsinore at InterState VW.

You may need to go dig around up there to get all the stuff you need.

We did cobble together I4 conversions form nearly all stock parts because they where everywhere. Combination of A1, A2 and A3 parts couple with Vanagon Diesel parts. But that was 20+ years ago.

It can be done with the right combination of stock parts.

But it is not a quick job.

Interstate should have everything you need, but you are going to have to dig and dig to get the magic combination.


Thanks R39o! I decided to fix what I have.

It turned out that I had a bad head, 10 years plus with the same head and at least 2 machining on that head when I had it so God knows how bad the head was... So I decided to go (temporarly) to fix the head, As a matter of fact I found a head yesterday in the yunkyards here in Tijuana, cost me 50 dlls, the machining 40 dlls, the head gasket 22 dlls and the back water plastic fitting 6 dlls, plus the silicone 4 dlls. The head gasket came with the valve cover and it had no leaky appearence from what I saw... so maybe I correct the spilling of oil that I had... quite dangerous if you know what I mean, I hope it gives me the correct height clearence of the valve cover, the oil cap fitted perfectly from what I saw.

Ill post some picks of the build once its done.

Talking about the subaru conversion need to save some money for the components. Theres tones of motors in the USA side (not here in Mexico anymore because they canceled the importation of older cars some years back) so the yunkyards dont have much to offer but they just started to admit cars again with VIN numbers from 1 to 5 (free trade agreement stuff) like one year ago so maybe in the near future will have some when people realize that the subaru are very dependable vehicles. Our Subaru has 25,000 thousand miles on it from when we bought it from an auction and it still running strong so I already have the donor motor but I Would like to have it rebuilt with new everything to start with a fresh new motor. Not long ago I quoted the parts list for the engine rebuild in rockauto and it was something like 500 dlls for the entire rebuild kit but dont remember if it had the water and oil pump included, need to check again. Plus the machining here in Tj, dont know if they be willing to do a Subaru here... Ill let you know. Tons of good machining shops around here.

Well there goes my story about my Vanagon life on this side of the border. Very Happy

Ill keep you guys posted!
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rogertj
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 16, 2019 7:12 am    Post subject: Re: What type of Tiico engine is this one? Reply with quote

Vanagon Nut wrote:
You may not have to cobble parts together to do a VW inline gas engine conversion. Regardless, like the subaru swap, the conversion parts will cost a significant amount of money.

I see that the rogertj is located on the west coast so shipping costs from the east may be a concern but FAS has parts for the VW inline conversions:

http://www.foreignautosupply.com/parts-accessories...chI73eZOV4

From that page:

"Basic Install Kit will also fit; 2LR, ABA, or earlier equivalent codes. "

and

"**OE cast oil pan & diesel pick up tube & pump provided for some earlier conversions "

But, call and ask what they can supply and whats needed for your particular engine.

Of note, Quality German Auto Parts in California

http://www.qualitygermanautoparts.com/index.php?p=...ines%20MK3

has reconditioned ABA engines for $1000 + core charge if applicable. They also show diesel Vanagon components to do a swap.

Is your current engine damaged or otherwise inoperable?

In your image of the engine below, I find it odd that I can't see the engine model "code" stamped in the block at area above the crank case breather hole. Purely out of my own interest, I searched the head part number 044103373D and got results for T4 2.0 engines in Europe. e.g.

https://translate.google.ca/translate?sl=auto&...0-93r.html

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Hey Vanagon Nut!

My current motor is inoperable because I had a bad head. Just fixing it today. Ill wait till 10 AM when it comes out of the machine shop.

The engine that I put in my post it was a motor that was offered by a good friend of mine, it was a 2LR motor but i decided not to go for it because there was many components missing so just decided to go for my current fix in what I have (at least temporarly)

Thanks all for your feed back ill let you know about my build.

Cant wait for that Suby conversion! Very Happy
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 16, 2019 10:30 am    Post subject: Re: What type of Tiico engine is this one? Reply with quote

"Cant wait for that Suby conversion! Very Happy"

Based on my, admittedly uncalibrated, butt-dyno, I think a 2.2L would leave you unimpressed, while a 2.5L would be significantly more peppy than your Jetta engine.

Of course you could ditch the carb and install a Mega-squirt and a turbo and zoom, zoom, zoom Laughing
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 16, 2019 10:51 am    Post subject: Re: What type of Tiico engine is this one? Reply with quote

rogertj wrote:
Vanagon Nut wrote:

I see that the rogertj is located on the west coast .....

Is your current engine damaged or otherwise inoperable?


......and the back water plastic fitting 6 dlls, plus the silicone 4 dlls.

.......

Hey Vanagon Nut!

My current motor is inoperable because I had a bad head. Just fixing it today. Ill wait till 10 AM when it comes out of the machine shop.

The engine that I put in my post it was a motor that was offered by a good friend of mine, it was a 2LR motor but i decided not to go for it because there was many components missing so just decided to go for my current fix in what I have (at least temporarly)



rogertj

Ok. I understand. And, I see you're in Mexico. Interesting to get your point of view on what the machine shop may be willing to work on, or not.

I don't know which "back water plastic fitting" part you refer to earlier but if you're replacing the black plastic manifold (outlet) at forward end of head, try to find an actual VW part if possible. Some people have had trouble with that part warping. Not right away, but after some miles. Maybe this is why you purchased silicone? I've never had any trouble with that part though.

Is the head gasket the correct thickness?

Also, check all threaded holes and studs on the head before installing. On my "free" ABA, I found 1 or 2 studs for the valve cover required work and there was a bad hole at end of head. Correcting that with head already installed was obviously more difficult.

I see from your picture below that you may have a metal inlet at the water pump (coolant pump). Those are superior to the plastic part especially compared to the stock ABA parts, but that doesn't apply to the Tiico as far as I know.

Neil.



Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


damaged bolt hole on my "free" ABA

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Image of part I installed on my 50 ABA in 1988 Vanagon. I don't know if I installed this same brand of part in my other 15 ABA 1981 Vanagon but if I did, it has not leaked at all.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

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1981 Westy air cooled to 15 ABA swap: http://tinyurl.com/y9n4xob8

50 ABA Swap in to '88 Westy: http://tinyurl.com/yap5hpwt

Vanagon VAG GAS engine swap Google Group:
https://tinyurl.com/2f24rmh

VE7TBN
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rogertj
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 16, 2019 10:53 am    Post subject: Re: What type of Tiico engine is this one? Reply with quote

khughes wrote:
"Cant wait for that Suby conversion! Very Happy"

Based on my, admittedly uncalibrated, butt-dyno, I think a 2.2L would leave you unimpressed, while a 2.5L would be significantly more peppy than your Jetta engine.

Of course you could ditch the carb and install a Mega-squirt and a turbo and zoom, zoom, zoom Laughing


Hahahaha wish I could do that, my engine is tired and needs a fully rebuild and sale tag for the Jetta followers Very Happy
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 16, 2019 3:21 pm    Post subject: Re: What type of Tiico engine is this one? Reply with quote

r39o wrote:
rogertj wrote:
I think it's time for the Subaru Conversion!


You would be much happier, I am.....very brainless to have.



Stick with your ABA inline since you already have it. However, you can still find good Subaru engines cheap if you look. I picked up this sweet non-EGR, non-interference MT EJ22 last year for a few hundred bucks. I'm still not sure if I'm going to install it (the Subaru), or the AHU M-TDI I have. I just felt I needed to find a good (complete) example to save.

FYI: The 90-94 EJ22's with manual trans came with non-EGR heads. The heads, intake, and everything will bolt onto a late EJ257 block (aka Frankenmotor) using special Cometic head gaskets, p/n H1631SPK051S (0.051" thick) or H1631SPK040S (0.40" thick)

https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/album_page.php?pic_id=1890528
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rogertj
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 16, 2019 4:32 pm    Post subject: Re: What type of Tiico engine is this one? Reply with quote

tjet wrote:
r39o wrote:
rogertj wrote:
I think it's time for the Subaru Conversion!


You would be much happier, I am.....very brainless to have.



Stick with your ABA inline since you already have it. However, you can still find good Subaru engines cheap if you look. I picked up this sweet non-EGR, non-interference MT EJ22 last year for a few hundred bucks. I'm still not sure if I'm going to install it (the Subaru), or the AHU M-TDI I have. I just felt I needed to find a good (complete) example to save.

FYI: The 90-94 EJ22's with manual trans came with non-EGR heads. The heads, intake, and everything will bolt onto a late EJ257 block (aka Frankenmotor) using special Cometic head gaskets, p/n H1631SPK051S (0.051" thick) or H1631SPK040S (0.40" thick)

https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/album_page.php?pic_id=1890528


Thanks TJET!

Maybe I do stick with the ABA with a little bit of tunning and if the budget gets tight... I was just asking the machining cost today and is cheaaaaaapppp down here! Very Happy I Just need to buy the rings, pistons and metals for the rods and crankshaft

I already have the 2002 EJ25 (operable vehicle) but will grab your advice if in the future found one 2.2 . I think that this frankenmotor if something happens with the timing belt nothing happens with it, right? Dont know if this true but Ive heard that. Somebody mentioned to me that if the timing belt would break nothing happens to the valves, dont know if thats true...

Thanks again!
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 16, 2019 4:50 pm    Post subject: Re: What type of Tiico engine is this one? Reply with quote

Vanagon Nut wrote:
rogertj

Ok. I understand. And, I see you're in Mexico. Interesting to get your point of view on what the machine shop may be willing to work on, or not.

I don't know which "back water plastic fitting" part you refer to earlier but if you're replacing the black plastic manifold (outlet) at forward end of head, try to find an actual VW part if possible. Some people have had trouble with that part warping. Not right away, but after some miles. Maybe this is why you purchased silicone? I've never had any trouble with that part though.

Is the head gasket the correct thickness?

Also, check all threaded holes and studs on the head before installing. On my "free" ABA, I found 1 or 2 studs for the valve cover required work and there was a bad hole at end of head. Correcting that with head already installed was obviously more difficult.

I see from your picture below that you may have a metal inlet at the water pump (coolant pump). Those are superior to the plastic part especially compared to the stock ABA parts, but that doesn't apply to the Tiico as far as I know.

Neil.


Hey Vanagon nut! Yes as a matter of fact it did came with the same screw bad, and in the valve cover screws one screw "fd" up, I need to change them before installing it.

About my water outlet is the flange one that I was refering to : heres the photo:


Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

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