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77westy1
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Joined: March 31, 2008
Posts: 12
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 Posted: Fri Apr 25, 2008 6:51 pm Post subject: Heater Box/Exhaust conversion from 77 to 72-74 Question FAQ |
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My 77 bus (GD engine) is in for a rebuilt engine (JCS) and i am replacing my heater boxes at the same time. My question is that my vw service centre is recommending I go to a 72-74 heater boxes and exhaust as it has less places to leak and is simpler to maintain - he had a point that VW went back to the 72-74 heater box style in 79. I'm in Canada and have no catalytic requirements and my bus does not have one anyways...
I was leaning towards keeping my bus stock but as 77 parts (heater boxes,seals, gaskets, exhaust tubing) become harder and harder to get this may make sense???
At first I was reluctant to do this but my vw vendor has lots of experience and is well respected in the local vw community....he said that if it was his bus he would do this change ..
I would really appreciate any thoughts on this...
Thanks!
Todd
Last edited by 77westy1 on Fri Apr 25, 2008 7:21 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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Randy in Maine
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Location: The Beach
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EZ Gruv
King of Plaid
Joined: December 10, 2002
Posts: 8544
Location: Las Vegas
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| Posted: Fri Apr 25, 2008 7:07 pm Post subject: |
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I have been a total slacker on this project. I have had my 72-74 boxes and muffler for 2 years and havent put them on.
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Eric
1977 Deluxe Westfalia - 2.0L FI Type IV, Completely Original
Photographer for HotVWs, VolksWorld, AirMighty, VW Camper & Commercial, Hayburner, and more.
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fukengruvenoval
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Joined: December 07, 2004
Posts: 774
Location: OSHAWA, ONTARIO, CANADA
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| Posted: Fri Apr 25, 2008 8:17 pm Post subject: Re: Heater Box/Exhaust conversion from 77 to 72-74 Question |
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| 77westy1 wrote: |
I would really appreciate any thoughts on this...
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Aside from breathing easier, it is a simpler system. The '75-'78 stock system consisted of two manifold pipes (NLA, expensive to find ones with good flanges), two "U-PIPES" (NLA, last I checked reproductions were $150 each), two heater boxes (available as aftermarket replacements), crossover pipe, elbow pipe, catalytic convertor (or eliminator pipe), muffler, and tail pipe. There are MANY connections in this setup.
The '72-'74 style consists of two heater boxes, a muffler, and a tailpipe.
If you already have the existing '75-'78 style, IMHO it's not worth replacing for the sake of replacing. If you need to replace any expensive part of the system, such as the heater boxes, it likely makes sense to do the swap.
Make sure you replace all the necessary tin bits as well. Scott from GermanSupply.com lists a KIT for doing the swap, but he may be out of stock. All of the components in his kit here: http://www.germansupply.com/home/customer/product.php?productid=16683&cat=409&page=1 are needed!
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Karl
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Location: Coos Bay, Oregon
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77westy1
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Joined: March 31, 2008
Posts: 12
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| Posted: Fri Apr 25, 2008 9:15 pm Post subject: |
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thanks everyone so much for the comments!!! - i know he mentioned something about some tin and not being available..but I didn't get the impression it was a big issue for the conversion without it...
my quote doesn't seem to have the 8 pieces for the conversion listed - so i'll definately have to check with him about how he was planning on doing the conversion - with them?? or without these pieces?? - or if the pieces were included as part of the total???
Thanks again! |
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Karl
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Joined: January 29, 2001
Posts: 6170
Location: Coos Bay, Oregon
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| Posted: Fri Apr 25, 2008 9:53 pm Post subject: |
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| 77westy1 wrote: |
thanks everyone so much for the comments!!! - i know he mentioned something about some tin and not being available..but I didn't get the impression it was a big issue for the conversion without it...
my quote doesn't seem to have the 8 pieces for the conversion listed - so i'll definately have to check with him about how he was planning on doing the conversion - with them?? or without these pieces?? - or if the pieces were included as part of the total???
Thanks again! |
It is a big issue. You NEED all of them. |
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77westy1
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Joined: March 31, 2008
Posts: 12
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| Posted: Fri Apr 25, 2008 10:22 pm Post subject: |
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| karl wrote: |
| It is a big issue. You NEED all of them. |
Thanks Karl!
i will call my vw vendor on monday and if he doen't have, can't get, or doesn't intend to use all the 8 conversion parts then i'll get him to replace just the 77 stock Heater boxes (assuming all the rest is good) and leave the exhaust as 77 stock for now.... |
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RZAR
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Joined: September 01, 2007
Posts: 725
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| Posted: Fri Jul 18, 2008 7:14 pm Post subject: |
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| Can you run a Cat and EGR with the 72-74 setup on a 77? |
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Karl
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Posts: 6170
Location: Coos Bay, Oregon
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| Posted: Fri Jul 18, 2008 8:29 pm Post subject: |
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| RZAR wrote: |
| Can you run a Cat and EGR with the 72-74 setup on a 77? |
EGR yes: if you use a 411 muffler or find the super rare left heater box with the EGR filter flange on #2 exhaust pipe. A minor problem with the 411 muffler is the spacing of the EGR filter flange: 411 is closer together. Somewhere I posted pics and measurements but I cannot find them.
Cat: no way, no how. |
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RZAR
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| Posted: Sat Jul 19, 2008 9:24 am Post subject: |
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| What about using the cross over pipe from a Fed 79-83? |
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germansupplyscott
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Joined: May 22, 2004
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Location: toronto
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| Posted: Sat Jul 19, 2008 9:29 am Post subject: |
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yes, that should work. 72-74 HE, 79 x-over, cat, stock muffler and tailpipe.
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SL
Last edited by germansupplyscott on Sat Jul 19, 2008 9:32 am; edited 2 times in total |
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RZAR
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| Posted: Sat Jul 19, 2008 9:31 am Post subject: |
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| EGR too? |
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germansupplyscott
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Location: toronto
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| Posted: Sat Jul 19, 2008 9:33 am Post subject: |
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to include EGR you'd have to fashion something to get the egr into the exhaust stream or use an early setup and have the egr plumbed into the HE exhaust pipe like karl mentioned. there's no EGR 79-up.
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SL |
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RZAR
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| Posted: Sat Jul 19, 2008 9:39 am Post subject: |
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| OK thanks for the info. I ask this because I scored a complete CB engine with perfect HE's. I was thinking on using them on my 77 since they flow better. But it doesnt seem to be worth it because the ones on my 77 are in great shape too. Thanks to Karl for the awesome manifolds! |
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EZ Gruv
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Joined: December 10, 2002
Posts: 8544
Location: Las Vegas
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| Posted: Sat Nov 15, 2008 3:36 pm Post subject: |
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Thread Ressurection!!!
OK, I am 2 pieces away from being ready to do this swap. I need to know what the bottom two pieces of tin are called and where they are located on the engine so I can track them down (see bottom 2 photos in germansupply.com link)
http://www.germansupply.com/home/customer/product.php?productid=16683&cat=409&page=1
Thanks...
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Eric
1977 Deluxe Westfalia - 2.0L FI Type IV, Completely Original
Photographer for HotVWs, VolksWorld, AirMighty, VW Camper & Commercial, Hayburner, and more.
My Photography Page. |
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hazetguy
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Joined: April 06, 2001
Posts: 10773
Location: iT StiNgeD iTseLf tO dEAd
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| Posted: Sat Nov 15, 2008 3:42 pm Post subject: |
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| Karl wrote: |
| RZAR wrote: |
| Can you run a Cat and EGR with the 72-74 setup on a 77? |
EGR yes: if you use a 411 muffler or find the super rare left heater box with the EGR filter flange on #2 exhaust pipe. |
do you mean coming off #4 as seen in this pic?
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Last edited by hazetguy on Mon Nov 17, 2008 1:49 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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regis101
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Joined: July 28, 2005
Posts: 2078
Location: Livermore, Ca
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| Posted: Sat Nov 15, 2008 5:25 pm Post subject: |
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| RZAR wrote: |
| What about using the cross over pipe from a Fed 79-83? |
Ding.. Ding...Ding
You win! That is the answer.
I have been searching for the 79 Fed Bus and/or the 80-83 Fed Vanagon crossover pipe for some time. BD used to carry a repo but no longer. Used is even tougher to find at least for me here in Cali.
There has got to be a boneyard somewhere with a few of these. I'd take one even if it didn't have the EGR tube. I'll work that out later.
I have the HE's, tins, and alt bracket. Need the crossover pipe.
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EZ Gruv
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Joined: December 10, 2002
Posts: 8544
Location: Las Vegas
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| Posted: Sun Nov 16, 2008 10:50 am Post subject: |
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_________________
Eric
1977 Deluxe Westfalia - 2.0L FI Type IV, Completely Original
Photographer for HotVWs, VolksWorld, AirMighty, VW Camper & Commercial, Hayburner, and more.
My Photography Page. |
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Karl
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