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F.Y.I. short Type 1 swing axle's in a type 3
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Aaron M265
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PostPosted: Sun May 16, 2010 3:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I used 1200 length T1 axles and tubes on the back of my 1965 1500 'N' Panel Van.

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Wheels are 6.5 inch BRM replica's and brakes are 356B Porsche.

Obviously no drum modifications required. Std 356 bearings retaining plates used as well to keep it a simple bolt on.

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Only non standard thing I ended up doing was to have new shorter hand brake cables made at a local brake shop so they were the correct length.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


There is about 1/2 inch clearance on the inside of each wheel / tyre and about 1/2 inch clearance on the outside (roughly).

Of course I had my fenders rolled as well before the car was painted so that helps me a bit.
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jimmynotch
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PostPosted: Sun May 16, 2010 9:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Aaron Britcher wrote:


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What make of tyre is that? Looks bad ass! Twisted Evil
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Aaron M265
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PostPosted: Mon May 17, 2010 12:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yep they are bad ass - Yokohama 205/60R15 A048R.

Very sticky tyres.
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jim altemus
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PostPosted: Thu May 20, 2010 4:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Okay, either this was stickied at my request or I really need to read the FAQ's.
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PIMPPRIDE
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PostPosted: Thu May 20, 2010 5:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

sounds good... but lets fix it first...

you should not machine the inside of the drum or hub... just the outside snout... ( if you machine the backside / inside you run the risk of running the drum or hub down into the brake shoes, wheel cylinder, springs ect... )

ultimately if it worked for you that's good... but its not the correct way...

the correct way to do it is to swap to short axles and swap the bug short axle end castings on to the the type 3 tubes... this is where the difference is... on your 1967 type 3 this would have given you the ability to keep the Z bar as the type 3 tube has the hoop for it... the bug does not...

there is a drift pin that holds the end casting to the tube... common on both type 1 and type 3 ( search the gallery for photos )

from there... you do have to take off 50 thou or so... ( about the size of the castle nut ) from the snout of the type 3 drum / hub...

Anthony / ISP WEST
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flyinglow94
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PostPosted: Thu May 20, 2010 7:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

PIMPPRIDE wrote:
sounds good... but lets fix it first...

you should not machine the inside of the drum or hub... just the outside snout... ( if you machine the backside / inside you run the risk of running the drum or hub down into the brake shoes, wheel cylinder, springs ect... )

ultimately if it worked for you that's good... but its not the correct way...

the correct way to do it is to swap to short axles and swap the bug short axle end castings on to the the type 3 tubes... this is where the difference is... on your 1967 type 3 this would have given you the ability to keep the Z bar as the type 3 tube has the hoop for it... the bug does not...

there is a drift pin that holds the end casting to the tube... common on both type 1 and type 3 ( search the gallery for photos )

from there... you do have to take off 50 thou or so... ( about the size of the castle nut ) from the snout of the type 3 drum / hub...

Anthony / ISP WEST


To whom is this addressed to?

I think you are correct on switching the bug axles and the end castings if you want to use the Z bar on the 67/68 type 3's (I did not). I am baffled as to how you could only shave .050 off of the type 3 drum but the bug drum is still .625 shorter on the splines. Is that a typo? Did you mean .500?

YOU SHOULD NEVER SHAVE THE BACK OF THE DRUM /HUB. I had seen that in another post also.

Also if I remember correctly the drift pin only comes out one way( it is a tapered pin).
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jim altemus
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PostPosted: Fri May 21, 2010 6:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

This is where I'm at after following the instructions.

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I have a slight delay to POR-15 the frame horns before installing the transaxle. I'm also waiting on the '65-'66 vintage bearing covers I purchased from the Classifieds so I can install the brakes and get some gear lube in there.

My z-bar mounts on my original tubes were rusted (go figure, I have a solid pan but these rust out) so after a fruitless search for replacements and reading that removing the z-bar wasn't THAT big a deal I purchased fresh tubes and ends from CB Performance. The rest is just following the ample instructions found here. Can't wait to get this back together.

Jim
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Aaron M265
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PostPosted: Fri May 21, 2010 8:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Keep up the good work - it will look boss when done.
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jim altemus
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PostPosted: Fri May 21, 2010 1:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks. I can't wait to back it out of the garage. This has been a work in progress/money pit since 2002. I've driven it once since 2004, and that was just around the block before realizing I didn't lower the rear correctly.

Jim
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 07, 2010 4:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

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Well, I'm at the reassembly stage and I think I've hit a small snag. Above is what it looks like (complete with one of the drums I bought from Russ) after torquing the nut down as best as I could with my 1/2" impact wrench. After reading several posts on the topic, I had my hubs cut down by .5625. This doesn't appear to be enough. I haven't put the full almost torque on the one axle nut I have installed so far but it seems like I'm a little thick still. I can't quite get the hole for the cotter pin. Not a big deal, except that the hub is a tight fit and will be a bugger to get back off if I can't get it in just that last little bit.

Thoughts?

Jim
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 07, 2010 10:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

.625 is what i always heard/read should be shaved. so if you really close but not quite there then there is probably your reason....ken....
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jim altemus
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 13, 2010 9:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

luckystiff wrote:
.625 is what i always heard/read should be shaved. so if you really close but not quite there then there is probably your reason....ken....


I'm going to use a belt sander for the remaining .0625"

My next issue is the brake cables. My aftermarket cables (either from CB or CIP1, I can't remember) seem to be a bit short, not long as has been reported here. I'm tinkering with this now. It won't prevent me from getting the motor back in, but it will keep me from driving the car.

Jim
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 13, 2010 9:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

jim altemus wrote:
luckystiff wrote:
.625 is what i always heard/read should be shaved. so if you really close but not quite there then there is probably your reason....ken....


I'm going to use a belt sander for the remaining .0625"

My next issue is the brake cables. My aftermarket cables (either from CB or CIP1, I can't remember) seem to be a bit short, not long as has been reported here. I'm tinkering with this now. It won't prevent me from getting the motor back in, but it will keep me from driving the car.

Jim


That surface needs to be perfectly square with the axle. Otherwise, you are tightening on a small area, and it will not hold. Take it back to the machine shop, and have them take of the extra.
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jim altemus
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 13, 2010 3:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Russ Wolfe wrote:
That surface needs to be perfectly square with the axle. Otherwise, you are tightening on a small area, and it will not hold. Take it back to the machine shop, and have them take of the extra.


Yes sir Very Happy

In other news, I have the car back together enough to put it on the ground.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


A dead battery (that is probably in need of replacement) thwarted our efforts to start it. I have a bunch of small things to work on (like the hubs, I need to get the correct brake cables, a few other odds and ends) but the big news is it is back together and that much closer to being back on the road.

Jim
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kooldub
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 14, 2010 7:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

got my axle swap done. much thanks to all in the thread!! Cool
before pic is with 4.5in sprints and 165 tires...
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after pic, with 5.5in sprints and 185/65 tires...
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sorry for the crappy cel pics...

kris
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 14, 2010 1:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Looks good. Mine isn't quite so low in the back, but lower enough than the front that when I put the final wheels and tires on (165/60-15 fronts, 205/60-15 rears, on Sprintstars) the car should have a nice rake to it.

Jim
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 30, 2010 5:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

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Here is the end result with the final rear wheels. If my car was IRS I would have some major tire rub. With the swing axle there is no rub but I have more toe-in than I should probably have, thanks in no small part to the Kafer bar I recently installed.

Jim
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 30, 2010 5:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Looks good Jim
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 31, 2010 10:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks. I still have a long ways to go but this is a big milestone.

Jim
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 11, 2011 12:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This should be a sticky for sure!

Thanks to the original poster of this thread... And all who have contributed.


Can someone post up a grocery list for this job? (parts list, machining, etc...)



I have a four lug type 3 rear subframe, with a swingaxle, and was wondering, What is needed to use the narrow axles with the stock type3 4bolt brake parts on this?

I know that a few of the cars are swingaxle 4 bolt... but i am unclear...
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