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Remove trans - DIY motor support bracket/chain/tool?
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airkooledchris
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 17, 2009 11:48 am    Post subject: Remove trans - DIY motor support bracket/chain/tool? Reply with quote

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I think the above is the tool VW used to remove the trans with the motor still in place. I did some searching and found a lot of threads mentioning this process, but didn't find a specific tip on creating this tool...

so, what do you use to facilitate this process? yea, it's the first time id be tackling this, which is why im probably asking more questions and making it seem more difficult than it really is. ;p
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Vanagon Nut
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 17, 2009 12:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

With the air cooled engine, I supported it from underneath with wood or a bottle jack (can't recall) Proper wood blocks are probably best.

I used a floor jack. Not the easiest. (first time)

I've read that some use a motorcycle or ATV lift (though I swear I've seen them with "one piece" support) i.e. :

http://www.sears.com/shc/s/p_10153_12605_00950191000P?sid=BVReview

Neil.
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airkooledchris
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 17, 2009 12:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

you used a floor jack to support the bottom of the motor when you pulled the trans? If so, what did you use to support the trans when it needed to be lowered and pulled out of the way? (another jack?)

I was thinking about using my SUV style floor jack (21 inch lift) to support and then lower the transmission. Perhaps drive the van up on ramps beforehand, and my missing link has been how to support the motor while still in the van without the trans there.

come to think of it I may not be able to reach the bottom of either with the van on ramps. (with a regular floor jack.)


Vanagon Nut wrote:
With the air cooled engine, I supported it from underneath with wood or a bottle jack (can't recall) Proper wood blocks are probably best.

I used a floor jack. Not the easiest. (first time)

I've read that some use a motorcycle or ATV lift (though I swear I've seen them with "one piece" support) i.e. :

http://www.sears.com/shc/s/p_10153_12605_00950191000P?sid=BVReview

Neil.
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McVanagon
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 17, 2009 12:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I used ramps to lift the van.
I used my floor jack and a jerryrigged wood platform to lower the transmission.
I used a combination of cinderblocks, 4x4s, and a bottlejack to support and lower the engine just enough to get the transmission out.

I have a Cycle/Quad jack now. I will use it next time.
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Vanagon Nut
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 17, 2009 12:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

airkooledchris wrote:
you used a floor jack to support the bottom of the motor when you pulled the trans? If so, what did you use to support the trans when it needed to be lowered and pulled out of the way? (another jack?)

......



Vanagon Nut wrote:
With the air cooled engine, I supported it from underneath with wood or a bottle jack (can't recall) Proper wood blocks are probably best.

I used a floor jack. Not the easiest. (first time)

.....

Neil.


In an effort to be clear, maybe I wasn't.

"it" referred to my old air cooled engine. The type of engine was specified as removing the tranny is *likely* similar to the WBX. I now have a Jetta engine in there. Smile

Old air cooled engine was supported with wood or bottle jack.

Floor jack used to remove tranny.

Removal was easier than installation. On installation, tranny tended to slide or topple off the saddle of the floor jack which makes lining things up challenging. A piece of plywood put on the jack saddle *might* help in this regard. Maybe..... edit: McVanagon did this. Thanks for the info McVanagon.

McVanagon: did you add "bolsters" on each side of the piece of wood to support the tranny? I bet that would help.

A while back, I found that with jack saddle removed, an old socket fit nicely in the hole. I was going to bolt it to a piece of plywood to make a platform of sorts, but it seemed hinky. (wobbly) But now I have a MIG. Maybe I'll make a piece. Possibly not the most stable, but might help if used right.

Neil.
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50 ABA Swap in to '88 Westy: http://tinyurl.com/yap5hpwt

Vanagon VAG GAS engine swap Google Group:
https://tinyurl.com/2f24rmh

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Wildthings
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 17, 2009 1:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

There is very little force on the engine once the tranny is removed. You can just hang the rear of the engine using a piece of wire or cord. Just lay a 2x4 over the engine hatch opening for something to attach to.
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McVanagon
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 17, 2009 1:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Vanagon Nut wrote:
McVanagon: did you add "bolsters" on each side of the piece of wood to support the tranny? I bet that would help.


It was a little platform with shims and blocks on it that evolved as the day went on.. I'll take a photo of it if have time tonight.
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airkooledchris
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 17, 2009 1:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

thanks for the additional tips guys. mcvan, if you can, id love to see it.

wild- your talking something like this, only I don't even need the winch since I don't need to move the motor itself yea?
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


just put the 2x6's across the compartment and attach the rear of the motor to it so it can't dip downward and the front (fan side) mounts will take care of the rest?
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Vanagon Nut
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 17, 2009 1:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks man.

I imagine one could fasten some nice ~45* "bolsters" onto the platform to cradle the tranny a little. ..... or strap the tranny down with some duct tape.... heh heh Twisted Evil
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1981 Westy air cooled to 15 ABA swap: http://tinyurl.com/y9n4xob8

50 ABA Swap in to '88 Westy: http://tinyurl.com/yap5hpwt

Vanagon VAG GAS engine swap Google Group:
https://tinyurl.com/2f24rmh

VE7TBN
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Vanagon Nut
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 17, 2009 1:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

airkooledchris wrote:
thanks for the additional tips guys. mcvan, if you can, id love to see it.

wild- your talking something like this, only I don't even need the winch since I don't need to move the motor itself yea?
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


just put the 2x6's across the compartment and attach the rear of the motor to it so it can't dip downward and the front (fan side) mounts will take care of the rest?


IMO, that type of winch setup is very useful for engine removal. Especially in tight work spaces. i.e. you don't have to have vehicle as high off ground and you just remove a wheel and slide engine out from under. (assuming engine on carpet or w.h.y.) I also found my worm gear type (more $ btw) uber useful for tweeking drivetrain position for my Jetta conversion.

Pic of it UNfinished. Shorter now, and mit cable Wink.


Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

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1981 Westy air cooled to 15 ABA swap: http://tinyurl.com/y9n4xob8

50 ABA Swap in to '88 Westy: http://tinyurl.com/yap5hpwt

Vanagon VAG GAS engine swap Google Group:
https://tinyurl.com/2f24rmh

VE7TBN
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kshbaja
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 17, 2009 2:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I built something out of a 4x4 and a piece of threaded rod with an eye hook on the end. Put the hook through one of the lift points on the engine so the shaft is vertical. Drill a small hole in the 4x4 that is just large enough for the rod and then lower the 4x4 so the rod projects vertically through the hole. Then drop a washer on the rod and finally a nut. After tightening the nut down to the 4x4 you should be supporting the engine. What I liked about this design is that you can securely raise/lower the engine in very small increments just by turning the nut.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


I also built the other winch-based gizmo mentioned previously for dropping the engine to the floor, and lifting it up to my bench with the gizmo perched in the garage ceiling joists!
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 17, 2009 2:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Vanagon Nut wrote:


I've read that some use a motorcycle or ATV lift (though I swear I've seen them with "one piece" support) i.e. :

http://www.sears.com/shc/s/p_10153_12605_00950191000P?sid=BVReview

Neil.


I used that exact ATV jack when replacing the trans. in my Studebaker. It worked really well for that job, but cant say for certain that it whether or not it would be good for a Vanagon trans.
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airkooledchris
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 17, 2009 2:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

if I can get away with not buying an ATV jack right now, that would be great.
I like the look of that 4x4 with the bolt/hook and will consider fabbing up just such a piece tonight and see what it looks like. it seems to be holding the side of the motor I need to support when only pulling the trans, which was the original goal.

now to just put together a final parts list on what seals/etc ill be replacing and I should be good to go for this weekend. (yes im excited about it now... we'll see how I feel Sunday)

edited to add : ok, I also need to see about fabbing up some sort of platform for the trans to rest in, to aid in the reinstallation of it afterward.
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BigNick0
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 17, 2009 3:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I just pulled the transmission in my '91 a few weeks ago for the first time. Heres what I did:

1. Put jack under transmission end, and unbolt transmission mount.
2. Lower whole assembly leaving enough room for transmission to clear frame.
3. Put jackstand with wood block under engine case.
4. Use second jack at front of transmission with plywood (about 1'x2.5') along transmission body.
5. I unbolted the transmission and gently lowered/slid it off and out, using the plywood as a ramp at the final stage and removing the mount side jack.

I managed to do this unassisted. I even got it back in by myself using a single jack, and a rolling furniture dolly. I hand-lifted the mount side of the transmission onto more and more wood blocking sitting on top of the dolly, as I jacked the front up to meet the engine. The transmission isn't that heavy. I managed it myself and I'm a lightweight guy at buck thirty-five.

Laughing

In retrospect I spent more time worrying and thinking about how I was going to do it, than it actually took to get it done.

Good luck!

-Nick
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 17, 2009 3:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The 4x4 with bolt was used for a clutch replacement. I only have 1 jack and needed that for the tranny. It worked great.
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 17, 2009 8:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

McVanagon wrote:
Vanagon Nut wrote:
McVanagon: did you add "bolsters" on each side of the piece of wood to support the tranny? I bet that would help.

It was a little platform with shims and blocks on it that evolved as the day went on.. I'll take a photo of it if have time tonight.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

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PostPosted: Tue Feb 17, 2009 8:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

airkooledchris wrote:
if I can get away with not buying an ATV jack right now, that would be great.
edited to add : ok, I also need to see about fabbing up some sort of platform for the trans to rest in, to aid in the reinstallation of it afterward.


I've done it a couple of times by using a bottle jack and a piece of wood under the engine and a regular floor jack and a piece of wood under the balance point on the trans. No fancy holders and just 6" long pieces of 2 x 6 for the wood. Fancier things will work but you can KISS and do fine. Smile
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airkooledchris
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 17, 2009 11:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

im really liking this 'keepin it simple' method:

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thats not mine, but that looks stupid easy.
use a bottle jack to raise and lower the motor wile removing it (trans),
then lock it (motor) in place with the chained 4x4
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?Waldo?
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 17, 2009 11:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've used similar to other concepts here, but when removing just the engine I use three sections of all thread that are long enough to lift the engine from the ground. The three points coupled with the ability to slide the supports on the cross pieces allows the ability to orient the engine solidly in any specific angle and to slide it in any direction.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


For the tranny, I've always just used the simple block of wood under the balance point and used the assistance of a friend to avoid difficult moments. I will likely make a more complicated wood support for the tranny to make solo installation easier.

For simply supporting the engine during tranny removal, I've always used just one all-thread. I definitely prefer it over a simple chain. The easy fine adjustability up and down can sometimes make a big difference in the ease of work.

Andrew
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Vanagon Nut
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 18, 2009 3:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

McVanagon wrote:
McVanagon wrote:
Vanagon Nut wrote:
McVanagon: did you add "bolsters" on each side of the piece of wood to support the tranny? I bet that would help.

It was a little platform with shims and blocks on it that evolved as the day went on.. I'll take a photo of it if have time tonight.

[img]https://www.thesamba.com/vw/gallery/pix/525310.jpg....


Thanks McVanagon!
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1981 Westy air cooled to 15 ABA swap: http://tinyurl.com/y9n4xob8

50 ABA Swap in to '88 Westy: http://tinyurl.com/yap5hpwt

Vanagon VAG GAS engine swap Google Group:
https://tinyurl.com/2f24rmh

VE7TBN
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