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shmoe2k
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Joined: August 09, 2009
Posts: 160
Location: Camarillo, CA
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 Posted: Mon Aug 20, 2012 5:54 pm Post subject: 1944 Kubelwagen restoration build. |
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Here is the newest build for us. It is a REAL Kubelwagen from 1944. This car has been in storage for about 30 years. I know its the wrong color but we are going to do a frame off resteration and put it back to its original condition. Here is a few pics what it looks like when it arrived today.
Check back and see how the progress goes. We are estimating 6 months to a year for the restoration. He would like it done by next years air cooled car show at channel islands harbor.
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69rulz
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Joined: June 07, 2009
Posts: 867
Location: On a trip on my couch
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| Posted: Tue Aug 21, 2012 9:02 pm Post subject: |
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LLLOOOOOOOOOOOVVVVEEEE it, you painting it the afrika camo?
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Bruce
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Joined: May 16, 2003
Posts: 17290
Location: Left coast, Canada
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| Posted: Tue Aug 21, 2012 11:26 pm Post subject: |
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Camo paint on German cars was quite rare during the war. The soon to be former paint of this car is an example of how not to do it. Camo was never applied with a spray can.
The original colour of this Kubel was dark yellow, aka desert beige.
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| overheard at the portland Swap Meet... wrote: |
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BNMike
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Joined: November 12, 2009
Posts: 333
Location: Hot Springs, SD
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| Posted: Wed Aug 22, 2012 7:03 am Post subject: |
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That's certainly a good looking start on a car to restore. I'll be watching 
Best,
BNMike
Last edited by BNMike on Thu Aug 23, 2012 6:08 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Kraftfahrer
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Joined: January 26, 2008
Posts: 165
Location: Bavaria
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| Posted: Wed Aug 22, 2012 12:30 pm Post subject: |
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Bruce, what makes you so sure that camo was quite rare on german vehicles?
I have a dvd with colour footage of the end of the war in germany. All the troops surrender to the US Army. The germany convoy in that footage was amazing, hundreds of cars and trucks...NOT one single car without camouflage ! 
Chocolate brown and bottle green camo paint was applied with a spraygun and compressor. You can see that on a lot of ww2 pictures.
Of course there was also paint paste, which was mixed with oil, gas, parafin etc..even water. It was applied with a brush.
It depends on the history of the car. If it was a "front-vehicle" it should "wear" camo, if it was only used in the barracks or as a staff car in the middle of Berlin City, it probably stayed in itīs original dark yellow paint.
just my 2 cents.
By the way, cool project ! Good luck on the restoration, keep us updated ! |
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Bruce
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Joined: May 16, 2003
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Location: Left coast, Canada
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| Posted: Wed Aug 22, 2012 9:57 pm Post subject: |
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It's true there are many war time pics of cars in camo paint, but there are a LOT more without camo.
Every Kubel and Schwimmer VW made was delivered from the factory without camo colours.
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| overheard at the portland Swap Meet... wrote: |
| ..... a steering wheel made from a mastadon tusk..... |
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bad1916
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Joined: November 14, 2010
Posts: 224
Location: Camarillo ca
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| Posted: Thu Aug 23, 2012 9:29 pm Post subject: |
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Awesome project. I'm looking forward to the progress. I'm in Camarillo as well. I didn't make it to this years show at the harbor but last years(I think) there was a kubel and schwim from Santa Barbara area there.
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shmoe2k
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Joined: August 09, 2009
Posts: 160
Location: Camarillo, CA
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| Posted: Fri Aug 24, 2012 10:23 pm Post subject: |
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The original color of the car is the green color. Under the dash has the original color of the vehicle. Next week we are going to order panels to replace a lot of the exterior panels. There would be way too many hours to repair what we have. This will be a fun project.
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Bruce
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Posts: 17290
Location: Left coast, Canada
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| Posted: Fri Aug 24, 2012 11:13 pm Post subject: |
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| shmoe2k wrote: |
| The original color of the car is the green color. Under the dash has the original color of the vehicle. |
Starting in mid 1943, all Wehrmacht vehicles were painted dark yellow.
Your car may have been green at one time, but it wasn't when it was new.
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| overheard at the portland Swap Meet... wrote: |
| ..... a steering wheel made from a mastadon tusk..... |
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Kraftfahrer
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Joined: January 26, 2008
Posts: 165
Location: Bavaria
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| Posted: Sat Aug 25, 2012 3:23 pm Post subject: |
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| Bruce wrote: |
| shmoe2k wrote: |
| The original color of the car is the green color. Under the dash has the original color of the vehicle. |
Starting in mid 1943, all Wehrmacht vehicles were painted dark yellow.
Your car may have been green at one time, but it wasn't when it was new. |
YUP ! At the time this Kubel was produced it definitely had a dark yellow paintjob . Very late Kubels around feb/march 1945 and after that ,had a kinda greenish colour, you can see one fine example on Jaceks website.
Please check every angle or spot, where you can find old traces of paint.It must be yellow somewhere !
Chris |
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lawn ninja
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Joined: January 02, 2006
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Location: Round Rock, TX
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| Posted: Mon Aug 27, 2012 7:24 pm Post subject: |
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The color they came from the factory and the color the military painted them once they were put in service is almost certainly two different things.
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Jason
My 64 1500 S Notchback project here
My 58 sedan project here
My 63 Ghia here |
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Kapt. Q
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Joined: May 28, 2011
Posts: 256
Location: UK
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| Posted: Tue Aug 28, 2012 6:26 pm Post subject: |
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| lawn ninja wrote: |
| The color they came from the factory and the color the military painted them once they were put in service is almost certainly two different things. |
The military specified the colour the factory painted them, this was the base colour that cammoflage could be applied too, the base colour was not changed in service, except in 1943 when they switched from grey to yellow and old vehicles were repainted in the new colour.
Cheers! |
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Kraftfahrer
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Joined: January 26, 2008
Posts: 165
Location: Bavaria
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| Posted: Wed Aug 29, 2012 2:54 pm Post subject: |
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| Kapt. Q wrote: |
| lawn ninja wrote: |
| The color they came from the factory and the color the military painted them once they were put in service is almost certainly two different things. |
The military specified the colour the factory painted them, this was the base colour that cammoflage could be applied too, the base colour was not changed in service, except in 1943 when they switched from grey to yellow and old vehicles were repainted in the new colour.
Cheers! |
You nailed it ,Kapt. Q !
@Shmoe2K : Any updates ? |
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lawn ninja
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Joined: January 02, 2006
Posts: 1009
Location: Round Rock, TX
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| Posted: Wed Aug 29, 2012 5:05 pm Post subject: |
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| Kapt. Q wrote: |
| lawn ninja wrote: |
| The color they came from the factory and the color the military painted them once they were put in service is almost certainly two different things. |
The military specified the colour the factory painted them, this was the base colour that cammoflage could be applied too, the base colour was not changed in service, except in 1943 when they switched from grey to yellow and old vehicles were repainted in the new colour.
Cheers! |
Nice. Good to know. I made the guess because in the Army now we get everything in OD green and then hit it with desert tan.
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Jason
My 64 1500 S Notchback project here
My 58 sedan project here
My 63 Ghia here |
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shmoe2k
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Joined: August 09, 2009
Posts: 160
Location: Camarillo, CA
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| Posted: Thu Aug 30, 2012 8:27 pm Post subject: |
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Thank you all, this is some good info. I'm waiting for a couple body shops that do restorations to get back to me. It almost sounds like they don't want to do it. I may be on the hunt for a body shop to tackle this thing. I'm hoping for somebody in the area.
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Kapt. Q
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Joined: May 28, 2011
Posts: 256
Location: UK
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| Posted: Fri Aug 31, 2012 1:25 pm Post subject: |
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| lawn ninja wrote: |
| Kapt. Q wrote: |
| lawn ninja wrote: |
| The color they came from the factory and the color the military painted them once they were put in service is almost certainly two different things. |
The military specified the colour the factory painted them, this was the base colour that cammoflage could be applied too, the base colour was not changed in service, except in 1943 when they switched from grey to yellow and old vehicles were repainted in the new colour.
Cheers! |
Nice. Good to know. I made the guess because in the Army now we get everything in OD green and then hit it with desert tan. |
That is interesting, most of our stuff seems to be tan these days, lol.
The Yellow used in Europe by the Germans was called Dunkelgelb and should not be confused with the slightly darker/yellower 'desert yellow' (Tropen gelb) used by the DAK in Africa.
The dunkelgelb colour was chosen in 1943 because of the enviroment in Russia, an irrelevance by 1945 and the plan, if the war had continued longer, was to switch to green and by some accounts this process had actually started by the wars end.
Cheers! |
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BNMike
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Joined: November 12, 2009
Posts: 333
Location: Hot Springs, SD
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| Posted: Sat Sep 01, 2012 12:03 pm Post subject: |
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In the beginning of the war, the standard body color "coming off the production line" was "Dunkelgrau, RAL 7021" or "Panzer Grey".
In the middle of 1943, the standard body color was changed to "Dunkelgelb, RAL 7028" (of which there were at least three shades, the last being more of an "olive drab" type color than "gold")....though the cars continued to be painted Panzer Grey until the factory ran out of that color paint.
The wheels and running gear were "usually" painted Panzer Grey throughout production.
The major exception to this was a "run" of "Tropen" Type 82's built for Africa in 1941, which were Dunkelgelb all over. After these cars, the factory returned to Panzer Grey.
This information is a result of research done by Lawrence Martin, and published in the Kubel Korps USA quarterly newsletter.
BNMike |
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Kapt. Q
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Joined: May 28, 2011
Posts: 256
Location: UK
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| Posted: Sun Sep 02, 2012 1:05 am Post subject: |
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| BNMike wrote: |
The major exception to this was a "run" of "Tropen" Type 82's built for Africa in 1941, which were Dunkelgelb all over. After these cars, the factory returned to Panzer Grey.
This information is a result of research done by Lawrence Martin, and published in the Kubel Korps USA quarterly newsletter.
BNMike |
This is incorrect, all DAK kubels were NOT painted dunkelgelb!
The earliest vehicles in Africa were given a base coat of Gruenbraun RAL: 8000 with a disruptive overspray (about 1/3) of Graugrun.
In April 1942 it was ordered that the base colour be changed to RAL 8020 Gelbbraun with the disruptive overspray in RAL 7027, but infact many vehicles already in the field did not get the colour change because old colour stocks were not exhausted and the new colour was in short supply.
Dunkelgelb was introduced after the defeat of the DAK and was never used in N.Africa! The runs of Kubels originally destined for Africa were painted in RAL 8020 Gelbbraun. The confusion is common because the colour looks similar in B&W pics. Check it with Larry at Kubel Korps
Cheers! |
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BNMike
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Joined: November 12, 2009
Posts: 333
Location: Hot Springs, SD
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| Posted: Sun Sep 02, 2012 10:52 am Post subject: |
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| Kapt. Q wrote: |
| BNMike wrote: |
The major exception to this was a "run" of "Tropen" Type 82's built for Africa in 1941, which were Dunkelgelb all over. After these cars, the factory returned to Panzer Grey.
This information is a result of research done by Lawrence Martin, and published in the Kubel Korps USA quarterly newsletter.
BNMike |
This is incorrect, all DAK kubels were NOT painted dunkelgelb!
The earliest vehicles in Africa were given a base coat of Gruenbraun RAL: 8000 with a disruptive overspray (about 1/3) of Graugrun.
In April 1942 it was ordered that the base colour be changed to RAL 8020 Gelbbraun with the disruptive overspray in RAL 7027, but infact many vehicles already in the field did not get the colour change because old colour stocks were not exhausted and the new colour was in short supply.
Dunkelgelb was introduced after the defeat of the DAK and was never used in N.Africa! The runs of Kubels originally destined for Africa were painted in RAL 8020 Gelbbraun. The confusion is common because the colour looks similar in B&W pics. Check it with Larry at Kubel Korps
Cheers! |
Hi Kapt..........
I stand corrected.
Larry said that the color of the "Tropen" Kubels was Dunkelgelb, but according to my copy of Chory's "Wehrmacht Heer Camoflage Colors", the color was "Gelbbraun RAL 8000". The first vehicles sent to Africa were in the standard Panzer Grey 7021, but were later overpainted with the Gelbbraun 8000, until the Gelbbraun 8000 vehicles started to be delivered in the Summer of 1941, according to Chory.
Thanks for correcting me...we need to keep the information accurate.
My "faux Kubel", 1973 Thing will be one of the shades of Dunkelgelb 7028, I haven't decided which one yet.
BTW....RAL 8020 is called "Braun" in Chory's book, the "paint Chip" for 8020 is a "tan", while that for 8000 is darker and more "goldish".
Best,
BNMike |
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michaelbeth
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Joined: September 08, 2005
Posts: 35
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| Posted: Sun Sep 02, 2012 6:43 pm Post subject: Volkswagen type 82 restoration |
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| shmoe2k wrote: |
| Thank you all, this is some good info. I'm waiting for a couple body shops that do restorations to get back to me. It almost sounds like they don't want to do it. I may be on the hunt for a body shop to tackle this thing. I'm hoping for somebody in the area. |
Guys, if you want to ensure it is restored correctly there are 2 guys in the midwest who have done probably the majority of the restorations on the Type 82/166s here in the states. One gentlemen has restored some 60+ war time Volkswagens in his career.
Contact me if you want to get their information and I can send it to you offline.
Michael
1943 Volkswagen Type 82 |
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