The $2300 Rebuild - SO FAR SO GOOD!

[deprivation]

Hey, kids. I started my rebuild yesterday and here's where we are:

Getting the engine to separate from the A/T housing was really the hardest part. But there it is.

This is a bit of metal stock I used to hold the flex plate steady while I removed the bolts. I had to reposition the flex-plate once to get at the bolts underneath.

That's not dirt. The oil seal is actually flaking off! How the hell did this hold a seal?

The seal has worn a groove in the sealing surface. This flex-plate is done. I've already ordered a reman from GoWesty one. And the costs go up...

MORE...

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1986 Westy 2WD auto a.k.a. "The Old Girl"
www.kittenfart.com

[deprivation]

And we continue...

The heads were replaced by the PO a few years before I bought in. One was a GEX and the other a rebuild of some kind. What's weird is that the mech didn't use any sealant under the nuts. None. And you can see what crap shape the sealing surfaces are. Weird.

The water jacket gaskets were odd as well. One side had no sealant whatsoever and the other had this weird, flaky yellow shellac on just the head surface.

Both heads have these yellow plastic valve guides. That seems odd to me. Is it?

The rockers don't squarely connect to the valve stems. Glad I got new rockers, heads and adjusters!

MORE....
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1986 Westy 2WD auto a.k.a. "The Old Girl"
www.kittenfart.com

[deprivation]

Taking it apart...

There's something like 24 fasteners holding the case together! Next out is the oil pump. I tried to remove the pulley before I dropped the engine, but the half-inch breaker bar broke! Way to go, Harbor Freight!

Obviously, you SHOULD NOT use any metal implement to separate the case but right above the pulley, there is a little tab. I was surprised at how easily the case halves came apart.

Once the case was split a little, I could finally get the wanky old oil seal outta there. It fell apart like a mummy! Here you can see the placement of the thrust washer in it's little tab. The engine is on it's side, by the way.

MORE.....
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1986 Westy 2WD auto a.k.a. "The Old Girl"
www.kittenfart.com

[deprivation]

What do we have here?

The outside of the number 4 and 3 bearings. Until I get to the machine shop to have the pulley removed and the gears pressed off, these bearings are staying put.

The wear is pretty good, I think for an engine that just ticked off 120k miles.

Another look at #4.

Another look at the busy bit of business at the pulley-end of things.

On the other end of the crank is the #1 bearing. You can see the little tabs at the bottom.

The cam journals look new - the bearings had almost no sign of streaks or wear, either.

I'm not sure how cam lobes (or anything else, for that matter) are supposed to look but these look pretty good. Perhaps I'll just re-use the cam and sell my 2252 from CB. Dunno yet.

These are the rod journals. There is some discoloration but no perceptible deformation of the surface. In fact, some of the discoloration comes off with my fingernail. I measured the crank (more on that later) and it appears to be well within spec for standard bearings.

MORE...
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1986 Westy 2WD auto a.k.a. "The Old Girl"
www.kittenfart.com

[deprivation]

Colors, man...

I had read in the Bentley about the color-codes on the crank and let me tell you, it aint that obvious. In fact, until I had the crank wiped down pretty dry, I didn't even see these bits of color.

My cam gear appears to be blue, green or la-di-da teal. What does it mean? I know the Good Book says what it means, but I'm too pooped to look. Tomorrow...

But the thing here is the "0" designation of my cam gear. I haven't had a chance to test my CB 2252 gear in this case so I don't know if the "0" is bigger or smaller than the 2252's gear. I stacked the two gears on top of each other and the diameter and tooth depth looks the same but unless I get better measuring equipment or test it in-situ, this question will remain unanswered.

More later...
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1986 Westy 2WD auto a.k.a. "The Old Girl"
www.kittenfart.com

[tencentlife]

Oh-kay, I suppose you'd like some comments:

The zero on the front of your cam gear is not the size designation. And you won't be able to tell the difference in sizes unless you have some pretty fine measuring equipment; the increments are very small, as I recall .01mm. The size stamp is on the backside, the side the camshaft attaches to away from the oil pump. It is a stamped number on the root of one gear tooth. Usually the stamp is pretty faint and they can be hard to find. It will be a zero, or a plus or minus sign followed by 1, 2 or 3. My guess is you will find it's a +2.

Your cam lobes look pretty good in the pics, but I would want to examine them closely and look for any pitting, usually just off the lobe peak and concentrated along one edge there. If it is pit-free, then it might be OK for reuse, but if it were me I would want to set it up in some V-blocks or nest it in the bearings with a dial indicator and measure that all four lobes have equal lift heights.

The green paint on your cam gear is a mystery; I know of no color designations pertaining to that. Maybe the Green Demon was your rebuilder.

The green on your crank merely denotes a 2.1 crank. The red paint says it is one of the two size designations, but it doesn't matter because I don't believe the two bearing sizes, red or blue, explained in Bentley are available, just one size. If you look at the numerical size ranges according to color, the differences are very slight and either one lets you end up with a good bearing clearance. The main thing is to mike out all the main and rod journals with a micrometer for roundness and taper; if you haven't done this it is best trusted to a machinist to judge whether it is within spec. Usually if the journals look smooth and shiny as yours do it is pretty unworn, but not definitely; only proper measurement can tell for sure.

Was there a tiny dowel pin in the left case saddle for the #4 pulley bearing? That bearing looks like it might have spun, although in your in situ pics it is in the right position. I have heard of people forgetting to put that one dowel in with these. Luckily it is only on that tiny and very lightly-loaded bearing, so no real harm results. In the older cases, forgetting any of the three "main" bearing dowels would cause a disaster, but the change in bearing design with the 2.1's put an end to that. The tangs ensure that the bearings stay put, and it's impossible to forget them unless you forget the whole bearing!

I'm thinking the staining on the rod journals may have happened if the engine was let to sit a long time and the oil drained from the bearing clearances but a pool remained at the bottom. Are all the stains facing the same direction? Haven't seen that kind of staining before that I can recall.

The head nuts can be made flat again by polishing them on some medium grit paper on a flat surface. I do that with every set, as well as chasing out the threads with a tap, then cleaning them out thoroughly with solvent. I run a die over all the stud threads to clean off any old sealant and deburr them. Those threads and the main bearing saddle nuts should run on their threads very cleanly. When you reassemble you will want to have a light coating of oil on the threads so your torque readings are accurate and even.

What did he use to seal those water jackets? Honey?

That "yellow plastic" thing in the head port is the bronze valve guide. No plastic there, no no.

The rockers should contact the valve stem slightly off center. The one in your pic is a little more eccentric than I try to get them but it's better than it nailing it right in the middle. They have to push them off-center to make the valve rotate a little with every stroke, so the valves and seats and stems and guides wear evenly all around. If you build rocker sets on solid-spacer shafts with shims, instead of the OEM method with spring washers, you can adjust the rockers' lateral positions so they each contact their valve just slightly off-center.

That's some rotten old mainseal; amazing it still did its job.

Funzy-wunzies.
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Please don't PM here, I will not reply.

Experience is kryptonite to doctrine.

[Pascal]

Great pics! Compared to 2.1 I'm rebuilding, yours looks realy clean with minimal wear. I can't believe how clean the inside of your case is.

Do you have the history on that motor?
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'84 Westy - 2.2wbx, GT Torque-Biasing Differential
'91 EA Cabby

[deprivation]

[240Gordy]

I noticed the paper gasket on the oil pump cover. wonder if that caused alow oil pressure worries.
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Tencentlife said,
"So, now that you know what you're doing, go to town."
2010 GOLF TRENDLINE 2.5
1985 GL now with more! a 2.1L
H&R SPORT(RED) Springs FRONT , SLAM SPECIALTIES RE6 AIRBAGS REAR

[deprivation]

[Pascal]

[deprivation]

[iceracer]

Good for you wanting to learn and do it yourself. That is how I have always done it with the Vw's. And you are right about one thing leads to another. I just finished a top end rebuild on a motor from an 86 westy I bought in Feb. One piston had a hole in it but it ran and blew smoke out the exhaust. One thing lead to another and now I have rebuilt heads on it and correct German used pistons and cylinders. It had the Cofaps in it. Luckily I had another motor I could pull the parts from but man the hours I have spent cleaning and rebuilding it is crazy. Next up is installation.
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86 Syncro Wolfsburg edition
63 Beetle (The Iceracer)

[iceracer]

Forgot to mention , in my case the motor was rebuilt 60k miles ago and I have the paperwork to prove it, therefore I did not split the case or change out the rods.
_________________
86 Syncro Wolfsburg edition
63 Beetle (The Iceracer)

[deprivation]

[deprivation]

Funzy-wunzies, as Chris said.

Most of the work so far has involved cleaning. The case cleaned up pretty well overall with Wal-Mart engine degreaser, which handily dissolved most the varnish inside the case. I still had a very stubborn mainseal which had welded itself to the case. I shaved it out bit by bit, which took about two hours. A very sharp blade kept me from gouging any aluminum out of the case. A final clean-up with Scotchbrite and it looks good.

Throughout the engine joints and surface unions I found what was either the remnants of the original factory sealant or maybe oil that had turned to varnish along the stagnant crevices. In any event, I'm not sure if sealant goes on these joints. The Bentley says something about using sealant on "joining surfaces." Okay, fine. But I wouldn't use sealant where the bearing saddle join.

What has anyone else done here?

More cleaning. There was some very tenacious varnish between the end of the cam and the cam plug. Plus the sealant used to seal the cam plug was this tough, waxy crap that resisted everything.

Scotchbrite really does a number on the sealing surfaces.

My new flex plate from GW is bee-yoo-tee-ful.

Pushrod tubes cleaned up very well with engine degreaser and, finally, 99% alcohol. I think they may need to have the flexible-joints straitened, though.

Also, the Bentley says they should measure at 7.6 inches but mine are 8.5 inches. Hmm. EDIT: I was measuring from end-to-end, not from the "shoulder." Duh.

For the most part, the sealing surface of the water jacket looked pretty good but there was some pitting. I mixed up some JB and it really did the trick. After some sanding with 1000-grit, you can hardly see the repair.

Other things: put new oil pump studs in, cleaned breather, water pump, dizzy, head nuts, casenuts, ran taps and dies over everything - EVERYTHING, Just cleaned, cleaned and cleaned. I can't afford to do some of the rebuilds you see here on The Samba, I'm sorry to say, so nothing is getting painted, plated or buffed to a factory-new look. Just cleaned. That's okay, though, because everything else except for engine internals is new.

I think I'm going to go with my 2252 cam. My old cam has on two lobes a miniscule bit of pitting and one lobe has wear that I can feel if I drag my fingernail along the surface. My cam dish is a +1, which I think I've read is the approximate size of the 2252's gear. Closer than other sizes, anyway.
EDIT: I found a post where 10cent indicates that he believes the 2252 gear is close to the stock -1 gear, which means the aftermarket gear in my engine might be a teeny bit small. We'll see...

One last thing: I'm a little nervous about putting the rings on my new AA's. So I've removed the rings from my old pistons and I'm going to practice a few times on them, including the last step of dropping the whole shebang into the jug.
_________________
1986 Westy 2WD auto a.k.a. "The Old Girl"
www.kittenfart.com

[jimbelmont]

Check out Tencent's post for details on sealing here:

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=254338&highlight=motorhead

Great job Dep, looks really good.

[deprivation]

[deprivation]

The work continues:

The gears are being heated in a very heavy saucepan. The Bent says to heat the gears to 170 degrees, which isn't hot enough for the main drive gear to drop on easily, I found. An aircooled book I read said to heat the oil just to the smoke point, which in the case of grapeseed oil is very hot. The gears needed the tiniest push but they fit!

The crank on an old flexplate and my tools ready in case the gears need any serious help. The pipe drift has gaffer's tape on it so I won't scratch the crank. Turns out I didn't need 'em.

I used a silicone mitt to press the gear on but the heat went through very quickly. Ouch. That's okay, you gotta do this step super-fast.

Even on new rods, the bolts can be skanky, which will give me inaccurate torque readings. All bolts were cleaned with a brass brush and 3-in-one oil. The dirty oil was washed off with Brakleen. I had some Arp moly grease from my CB cam, which I applied SPARINGLY on the bolts. Ran the nut up and down the threads and then wiped off the moly from the bolts. Whatever moly that stuck to the inside of the nuts will probably be plenty for the task of tightening things down to 32lbs.

Plastigage-ing the rods. Everything is hunky-dory.

Setting the cam end-play.

Gradually, the thrusts are sanded down until the play is a hair over .002"

The case is almost ready. I ended up being able to use my new CB 2252 cam. I was having a fitment issue that was, as Tencent suggested, entirely a thrust issue.

The rings Rocky sent me with the AA's are bang-on spec. Getting the pistons in the jugs was for me very difficult. The rings compressor kept wanting to go in the jug as well. But, everything is fine.

Setting end-play. My Harbor Freight dial jig didn't let me get too close to the center. But if the play measurement is off because of this, it's probably not off to any extent that is measurable by the gauge I'm using so I didn't sweat it. I ended up with play just shy if .004".

When it came time to torque the bolts down to the full 82lbs, I locked the flex-plate in two places so no single flange would get too stressed.

Onward.
_________________
1986 Westy 2WD auto a.k.a. "The Old Girl"
www.kittenfart.com

[deprivation]

I mentioned this in another thread but I wanted to include it in this thread as well. This is like the third time I've been told that I can't use the CB cam in the Waterboxer. Today, Lucas at GW said the "new" lifters they sold me might not have the right bottom to fit the grind of the cam. And, even though they are clearly remanufactured lifters, he insisted that they were new. The lifters are clearly not new: they have scratches and minute traces of dirt on the cracks. The insides were dirty.

But then he said the lifters "might" not be new after all and if that's the case they wouldn't work with my cam. Or they would. I don't know.

I gotta say, Lucas was surprisingly condescending and hostile.

So, I'm very discouraged at this point because I'm not sure if I should finish the engine as-is or take the case apart and put my old cam back in. I probably won't but dammit I hate it when someone is mad at me for, gasp, not possessing the same knowledge they do. I guess I was hoping Lucas would be helpful and when he was defensive and hostile, I was rattled.

And I really have to proceed here - I need my car back, you know?
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1986 Westy 2WD auto a.k.a. "The Old Girl"
www.kittenfart.com