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Van stereo 101
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dobryan
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2015 6:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tom Powell wrote:
Nice installation Casey, but why does my unit, with an unswitched power source, only work with the ignition switch in the ON position? It behaves as if the ignition switch controls the ground to the unit.

Aloha
tp


Did you check for continuity to ground on the ground wire, ignition off and then on?
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Tom Powell
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2015 8:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Gunldesnapper wrote:
Are you sure about your constant power source Tom? Sounds like your source is either not a constant or you have a wiring issue that should get looked at.


Measured 12V with a multimeter with the ignition key in the OFF position. But the CD player does not function until the ignition switch is turned to the ON position. There are remnants of a previous installation and I'll start tracing some of that wiring.

Aloha
tp
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Tom Powell
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2015 8:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

dobryan wrote:
... Did you check for continuity to ground on the ground wire, ignition off and then on?


No I haven't done that yet. That seems to be the next logical trouble shooting step. But, how and why, would a ground get switched? If this was a Bay Window horn I would expect a switched ground. But, it's just a simple CD player that I want to work with the ignition switch in the OFF position like others have done in their Vanagons and I have done in my Bay Window.

Back to the vehicle with the multimeter and checking the black ground wire.

Aloha
tp
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Jake de Villiers
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2015 8:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tom Powell wrote:
Nice installation Casey, but why does my unit, with an unswitched power source, only work with the ignition switch in the ON position? It behaves as if the ignition switch controls the ground to the unit.

Aloha
tp


You need to have both the yellow and red wires attached to the 12V source. The yellow wire triggers the relay that allows the red wire to be connected internally.
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Zeitgeist 13
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2015 8:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah, I'd go back and start at ground zero...the ground. This is always the first lead I connect, and if in doubt about it's continuity with the chassis, I run my own, rather than tapping into the factory harness.
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Tom Powell
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2015 9:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

OK

#1
I tested the ground (black wire from the unit connected to OG brown wire) for continuity: I have a ground to the plug at the unit with the ignition switch in the OFF position. Therefore the ground is not switched.

#2
I hooked the yellow power wire from the unit directly to the battery (unswitched). The unit would not operate until the ignition switch was turned to the ON position. It went off when the ignition switch was turned to the OFF position.

It behaves as if the ground is switched, but the ground is not switched.

Maybe Crutchfield will have an answer.

Mysteriouser and mysteriouser.

Aloha
tp
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Altoona
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2015 9:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tom Powell wrote:
OK

#1
I tested the ground (black wire from the unit connected to OG brown wire) for continuity: I have a ground to the plug at the unit with the ignition switch in the OFF position. Therefore the ground is not switched.

#2
I hooked the yellow power wire from the unit directly to the battery (unswitched). The unit would not operate until the ignition switch was turned to the ON position. It went off when the ignition switch was turned to the OFF position.

It behaves as if the ground is switched, but the ground is not switched.

Maybe Crutchfield will have an answer.

Mysteriouser and mysteriouser.

Aloha
tp


What about the red wire (usually smaller gauge than the yellow)? It needs to be powered for the stereo to operate.
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Tom Powell
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2015 10:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jake de Villiers wrote:
... You need to have both the yellow and red wires attached to the 12V source. The yellow wire triggers the relay that allows the red wire to be connected internally.


In the installation schematic for the DEH-P3700MP it shows the yellow wire "To terminal always supplied with power regardless of ignition switch position." From this I assume that this yellow wire supplies constant power for the memory. The red wire "To electric terminal controlled by ignition switch,12VDC ON/OFF.

After reading your post and the schematic. I hooked the red wire to my constant power source and the unit worked as desired with the ignition switch in the OFF position.

I made the assumption that the fat yellow wire was for power and the skinny red wire for memory. DUH

Problem solved. Thanks for your help and to the others that posted replies to help me realize my ignorance.

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Aloha
tp
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Jake de Villiers
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2015 5:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tom Powell wrote:
Jake de Villiers wrote:
... You need to have both the yellow and red wires attached to the 12V source. The yellow wire triggers the relay that allows the red wire to be connected internally.


In the installation schematic for the DEH-P3700MP it shows the yellow wire "To terminal always supplied with power regardless of ignition switch position." From this I assume that this yellow wire supplies constant power for the memory. The red wire "To electric terminal controlled by ignition switch,12VDC ON/OFF.

After reading your post and the schematic. I hooked the red wire to my constant power source and the unit worked as desired with the ignition switch in the OFF position.

I made the assumption that the fat yellow wire was for power and the skinny red wire for memory. DUH

Problem solved. Thanks for your help and to the others that posted replies to help me realize my ignorance.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Aloha
tp

Yay!
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luVWagn
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2015 11:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This doesn't sound right, and I smell a dead batt in future.
Yellow is battery unswitched power, and typically thicker gauge.
Red is switched/trigger power, typically via ACC, which vans don't have.
Some people hook the red to key in circuit. Some folks hook the red to a toggle switch.
Tying the yellow and red means the stereo is always "on", and not just maintaining memory...

I'm still confused on how this is wired?
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Altoona
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 10, 2015 8:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

luVWagn wrote:
This doesn't sound right, and I smell a dead batt in future.
Yellow is battery unswitched power, and typically thicker gauge.
Red is switched/trigger power, typically via ACC, which vans don't have.
Some people hook the red to key in circuit. Some folks hook the red to a toggle switch.
Tying the yellow and red means the stereo is always "on", and not just maintaining memory...

I'm still confused on how this is wired?


It will still be "on" although depending on the stereo, you will be able to turn the face off. It does leave a small draw of around 45mA, so it will only be a battery drain issue if you van sits for 1-2 weeks. I would recommend using a toggle of some sort to offer both the keyed option and direct power option.
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Tom Powell
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 10, 2015 8:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The final solution was constant power to the yellow wire for memory. Switched power to the red wire.

The red wire normally gets power from the ignition On position, but for camping the red wire is switched and gets a constant power source.
Everything works as intended. I use a pigtail and DC plug from the cigarette lighter to provide the switched constant power. I don't actually have a switch, but I have a connection in the red wire that I change from Ignition ON to cigarette lighter. The connection is accessible under the ashtray and the pigtail to the lighter is a reminder to return to the ignition ON connection.

My problem was in making the assumption that the fat wire was for power and the skinny wire for memory.

Aloha
tp
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Dampcamper
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 11, 2015 9:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

FWIW, I hooked up a switch (a tasteful little rocker switch with a green LED) and used a couple of diodes to isolate, feeding the diodes' output to the red wire. One side is from ignition power, other side is from aux battery through switch. So radio comes on either with ignition or if I flip the little rocker switch. The diodes keep you from powering up the ignition system when you turn the rocker switch on to listen to some tunes. I also ran radio main power (yellow wire) from the aux battery so I don't end up pushing the van to start it after a few days of tunes in the woods.
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Jeffrey Lee
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 06, 2015 6:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Preparing to install a new stereo in my 83 Westy. Have already run 2 new pairs of speaker wires to the rear cabinet so each new speaker will have its own dedicated ground.

Many online retailers suggest I add this Floating Ground Adaptor to my purchase, for older vehicles with shared grounds:
http://www.crutchfield.com/p_142FGA/Scosche-FGA-Floating-Ground-Adapter.html?tp=3486

Since I've already wired the van for individual grounds, do I even need this adaptor?
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vanis13
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 06, 2015 6:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

no

they mention it because their 'book' says you need it thinking you are just replacing the speaker.

FYI, handy to pull a 12v+ along with the speaker wires to power future accessories.
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Jeffrey Lee
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 06, 2015 8:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Great, thanks for that! And for the 12V tip ...
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0to60in6min
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 07, 2015 12:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

this is my observation on my problem

the red thin wire needs to be hooked on a power source otherwise the radio won't work - but then the radio will stay ON all the time which will drain the battery

some put a toggle switch on that thin red wire...

I just push on face plate release button - not taking out the face plate - and then the radio stop working and not draining the battery

I think it depends on the brand of the radio... I wish that I find a better wiring solution for my Pioneer..
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Altoona
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 07, 2015 1:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

0to60in6min wrote:
I wish that I find a better wiring solution for my Pioneer.


Tap the red wire into a keyed power source so it goes off with the ignition.
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0to60in6min
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 07, 2015 1:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

yes... but I want to use the radio with ignition OFF...

that's why some people put a switch as the harness from GW...
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Altoona
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 07, 2015 1:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

0to60in6min wrote:
yes... but I want to use the radio with ignition OFF...

that's why some people put a switch as the harness from GW...


Ah, well then, that is about as elegant as it gets.
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