early westy to rivi pop top swap,help needed -edit-

theizzardking

with a rivi top?
whatever parts i have or beer whatever traded for your time Wink

anytime this weekend!
_________________
"Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch.
Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote." - Benjamin Franklin
'71 westie "the wanderer"

rivifunbus78 · Posted: Fri May 15, 2009 1:11 pm Post subject:

post lots of pics I have 2 of these to do, I would be there in a flash but Im a ways south.
Cant wait to see it Rivis are the shizzle

Air_Cooled_Nut · Posted: Fri May 15, 2009 1:28 pm Post subject:

Yes, lots of pictures, how-to, cutting/welding if necessary, etc. If space is an issue I can put it on my server.

I have a complete Riviera pop top for sale and I've had a few inquiries about how to perform the swap.
_________________
Toby http://www.aircoolednut.com/
Did I mention that I'm an original Darksider?
'72 VW Squareback, 2007cc, GB 5-speed, rag top; '76 VW Riviera Penthouse Sundowner 2.0L; 2015 Audi S5 Cabby w/Stage II APR; '06 Ducati Sport Classic 1000; '14 Ducati Diavel Strada
The First Invasion

Van-o-Vich · Posted: Fri May 15, 2009 1:30 pm Post subject:

I have some time on Sunday. How far north? I don't know if I will be much help, since I don't know that much about it, but I will be down if you think I can help. Let me know. [/code]

theizzardking · Posted: Fri May 15, 2009 1:53 pm Post subject:

i live in stanwood and would gladly hook it up gas moneys, i'll pm you directions and the main reason why i need someone is it's just well, big and awkward. the swap should be rather simple i don't for see much cutting or any welding.

i have a 1970 rivi top to go in place of my 1971 westy top, as far as i know from prior research is that the roof opening are the same, but none the less i've got the tools so we'll see what happens when we go to do it. but for sure since the interest i'll do a proper write up for you guys.
_________________
"Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch.
Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote." - Benjamin Franklin
'71 westie "the wanderer"

sharpmore · Posted: Fri May 15, 2009 10:53 pm Post subject:

hey bud if you pay gas and make some of those yummy brownies i can come up and help

Justin · Posted: Fri May 15, 2009 11:14 pm Post subject:

I'm still wide open on Monday if you want.
_________________
"I am convinced that [nothing] in all creation will be able to separate us from the love of God that is in Christ Jesus our Lord."
-Romans 8:38-39

theizzardking · Posted: Sat May 16, 2009 10:32 am Post subject:

justin- i really got to be in to work this week we got some customers coming through yada yada, so i was hoping to kill it tomorrow to i have it ready for next weekends trip to the gorge, but don't worry man you can still have that stuff and still could use a hand for some other smaller things. it's more about just getting together with you fellow bus guys. Wink

james-whats up man! i need your number again man i lost it ages ago and have been trying to get ahold of you again, that said caleb was trying to roll by later today or tomorrow, i'm unsure as i haven't talked to him yet today but i'm thinking tomorrow would be best, that said you should come on by anyways 3 hands will be better than 2 and just makes things that much easier manipulate when working with a big 'ol top.you gotta bring your bus by, that is not negotiable hahah!i really want to take another look at that thing!
so yeah man, i got your gas and the rest check your pm's

Van-o-Vich -hey looks like there maybe 3 of us tomorrow, you should come 'on by as well and check out the buses, we'll get some meat on the grill and just have at it . i live by the water with a short walk down to the beach that's just up from kayak point, it should be a good time pm me if your up for it.
_________________
"Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch.
Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote." - Benjamin Franklin
'71 westie "the wanderer"

theizzardking · Posted: Mon May 18, 2009 2:26 pm Post subject:

thought i would just add some quick photo's of the weekend will be adding the write up as a separate thread and will have detailed mounting pics in there.

the bus parking lot!

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

my bus bald...

taking the 70 rivi top off

pics of the rivi top soft mounted

and james crazy motor

like i said i will have mounting instructions and measurements as well as close up of what all happened, this is a bit more involved that what i had thought but it does seem as if you can do it with out any cutting of the bus as the inner frame of the early rivi top is made of wood screwed through the sheet metal of the bus so minor wood working is going to be going on, besides a minor adjustment to the wood frame the other problem area is going to be, making some sort of gasket for where the wood frame meets the steel there was an og one here but i have a feeling they don;t make those anymore hopefully with threshold rubber for a garage door from lowes and some sillycon(sic) i can make something work and look half way decent.

any thoughts about the gasket/seal that goes between the frame of the pop top and the body of the bus?
_________________
"Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch.
Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote." - Benjamin Franklin
'71 westie "the wanderer"

theizzardking · Posted: Mon May 18, 2009 2:29 pm Post subject:

oh and i would like to thank james, Van-o-Vich, roger, and caleb for coming out and/or offering to help!!!! thanks alot guys! can't wait to see all of you at the camano island camp out bitches! lol
_________________
"Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch.
Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote." - Benjamin Franklin
'71 westie "the wanderer"

calebmelvin · Posted: Mon May 18, 2009 5:06 pm Post subject:

Hey sorry I couldn't make it Jason. I somehow lost my phone this weekend is some adventures and couldn't call when I was in Seattle...

Looks good though! Is it all attached. You should PM me your number so I can put it in the new phone...
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'68 Tagged Manx | My Wanted Ads
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theizzardking · Posted: Mon May 18, 2009 7:06 pm Post subject:

since it's starting to rain outside i decided to put this off until further in the week when the clouds break,ok so here is the low down ,and no i'm not driving it like this Wink

right now it's only being held up there by 3 short sheet metal screw just to keep it in position and from blowing away, so as the metal brackets sit they are in location but the inner wood frame on which the bed sits is loosely floating about. as seen here.

the piece of wood seen there has a notch in it to rest against the lower channel of the sunroof frame the problem is that on the riviera tops the sunroof was slightly enlarged toward the front of the bus to the middle of the door frame pillar (i'll show pics of this in the write up) so in lieu of taking a cutting wheel to my pride and joy i thought about it for a second and here is my reasoning. the overall length of the bus has not changed so if the primary mounting bracket location is static only the location of the bed is effected by the sun roof opening which would make a few things happen either causing the
fiberglass shell to bind on the lower wooden frame of the bed and/or cause the over all length of the bed to become affected.

as you can see in the photo's in the post before that binding isn't an issue so this only really leaves the issue of the length of the bed over extending into the sunroof area and possibly denying access to the upper bunk area, i hope this can be remedied by either shorting the bed a few inches or possibly moving the hinge for the fold down portion of the upper bunk back a few inches.(note: the upper bunk in the early rivi's is similar to the later westy tops where the head/foot section of the bed is on hinges.)

ok, so anyone see anything i'm missing here or askew logic?

ok the second part, attaching sealing and weather proofing the top.
here are the materials i plan on using

i plan on mounting the main pop top brackets with black zinc fasteners with rubber washers and a mild thread locker, as far as mounting the wood frame to the top of the bus i plan using silicon caulking and the foam rubber weather stripping between the wood and the sheet metal of the bus, i am however concerned about using caulking and the clearance issues that may arise from the foam rubber, this was all i was able to find at home depot on my lunch break. moving on, on the out side of the wood frame i plan on fastening the garage door threashold/rubber to the frame over the top of the canvas and
then fastening the side to the roof of the bus creating a gasket around the wood frame.

again any thoughts suggestions? i don't know what i'm doing here just having a go at it in good 'ol vw fashion Wink

_________________
"Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch.
Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote." - Benjamin Franklin
'71 westie "the wanderer"

chazz79 · Posted: Tue May 19, 2009 5:57 am Post subject:

you should use sheet metal screws with a 5/16 head (no more than 1" long) on them to attach the aluminum side rails. Did you have to enlarge the sunroof hole? I think my conversion was actually easier with having to cut a big hole in a tin top. Those wooden side rails need to be right next to the aluminum rails that screw to the roof for the added Support they give. The forward wood rails still have to support the bed extension that goes over the opening when the top is up. Looks good so far but I actually think that having a hole there already is a bigger pain in the ass than having to cut iit up.
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One day as a lion, or a lifetime as lamb

The green monster in bits and peices: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=332556&highlight=green+monster

chazz79 · Posted: Tue May 19, 2009 6:22 am Post subject:

Before the top goes up you have to be at thes step first

The hole has to be 1.5 inches in from the tops body line (8.5 inches up from the drip rails). The side rail placement is important as it supports the bed extension, and has the tie down latches for when the top is down.
You can fudge on the for and aft cuts as they're not that important, it'll just look a little wierd.
You can see on the stock rivi that sealant is only used where the aluminum attaches to the metal roof. They used a caulk tape that resembles plumbers putty. It's good stuff that remained pliable even after 30 years use. You can buy that stuff at an rv supply store. Don't use any sealants on the wood, that will hold water in and cause future headaches.

1>Build the bed on your donor bus
2>set the top in place, with the aluminum support struts "spread eagled" and resting in the rain channels
3>staple your top material back to the bed box sides
4>place the aluminum roof channels against the bed box (some seal in place underneeth) and start stabbing screws, Should be @ 30 of them.

That's the way I did it and it seems most logical. Your opperation is different with that hole being there but following these 4 steps after you get your hole correct and you'll have a functioning top
_________________
One day as a lion, or a lifetime as lamb

The green monster in bits and peices: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=332556&highlight=green+monster

theizzardking · Posted: Tue May 19, 2009 9:56 am Post subject:

theizzardking · Posted: Tue May 19, 2009 10:00 am Post subject:

also what's wrong using caulking to bond the wood and the metal how is this any different than in a home setting ? the silicone is made for bonding/sealing wood to metals and plastics, as well as the silicone will expand and contract with the temps. as well as having a rubber gasket over the top of the caulk it's self, that said what did the r.v. stuff cost you? the whole bag of stuff i have there was $40 total, if that rv stuff is reasonably priced i may pick some of that up instead but i don;t really see any problems with the caulking.
_________________
"Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch.
Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote." - Benjamin Franklin
'71 westie "the wanderer"

Air_Cooled_Nut · Posted: Tue May 19, 2009 11:18 am Post subject:

Here's a lot of pictures of the Riviera removal I did. They may help.
_________________
Toby http://www.aircoolednut.com/
Did I mention that I'm an original Darksider?
'72 VW Squareback, 2007cc, GB 5-speed, rag top; '76 VW Riviera Penthouse Sundowner 2.0L; 2015 Audi S5 Cabby w/Stage II APR; '06 Ducati Sport Classic 1000; '14 Ducati Diavel Strada
The First Invasion

theizzardking · Posted: Tue May 19, 2009 11:25 am Post subject:

Air_Cooled_Nut · Posted: Tue May 19, 2009 3:17 pm Post subject:

Jim Bear · Posted: Tue May 19, 2009 7:19 pm Post subject: James' Motor

Is there any info on the Samba or otherwise about that dude James' motor? That is funky. Dual oil baths? Does he have solex on there? Interesting...
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early westy to rivi pop top swap,help needed -edit-
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