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parris001 Samba Member
Joined: March 31, 2009 Posts: 28 Location: Franklin, Tennessee
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Posted: Sun Aug 16, 2009 8:14 pm Post subject: Mexican fuel injection |
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I thought I had heard that the Mexican Beetles used a fuel injection that was never offered on US models.
I like different kind of stuff, and would like to try the Mexican fuel injection on a carb engine.
Ever been done before? Too stupid of an idea to try? Did the Mexican Beetle have a better electronic ignition than the crappy points that we use? (Don't try to swap me over to the Pertronix. I had that system and threw it in the trash) |
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69 Jim Samba Member
Joined: September 27, 2004 Posts: 6264 Location: Chickengeorge's Neighbor
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74soupsoup Samba Member
Joined: July 27, 2009 Posts: 39 Location: Enfield, CT.
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Posted: Sun Aug 16, 2009 8:32 pm Post subject: |
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I beleive 75 and later had it stock in the states and it is pretty reliable.
There is also a pretty good aftermarket for parts,also hot vws has a project milage feature going about an F.I. type 1
go for it. |
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parris001 Samba Member
Joined: March 31, 2009 Posts: 28 Location: Franklin, Tennessee
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Posted: Mon Aug 17, 2009 8:27 pm Post subject: |
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Oh yes! That's it! Anyone ever install and use one on these? Port fuel injection would be a lot of fun to play with! |
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Bruce Samba Member
Joined: May 16, 2003 Posts: 17285 Location: Left coast, Canada
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Posted: Mon Aug 17, 2009 9:54 pm Post subject: Re: Mexican fuel injection |
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parris001 wrote: |
Did the Mexican Beetle have a better electronic ignition than the crappy points that we use? |
The Mex Beetles use a MAP controlled distributor without obsolete points. I can't remember if it uses an optical pickup or a magnetic. I'll have to look.
The Mex FI (as installed by VW in a Mex Beetle) is everything you can imagine. Driveability is like any modern FI car. _________________
overheard at the portland Swap Meet... wrote: |
..... a steering wheel made from a mastadon tusk..... |
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Antonio Trejo VW Parts Dealer
Joined: December 17, 2003 Posts: 937 Location: Mexico City
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didget69 Samba Member
Joined: July 22, 2004 Posts: 4927 Location: Raleigh, North Carolina
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Posted: Tue Aug 18, 2009 6:07 pm Post subject: |
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74soupsoup wrote: |
I beleive 75 and later had it stock in the states and it is pretty reliable.
There is also a pretty good aftermarket for parts,also hot vws has a project milage feature going about an F.I. type 1
go for it. |
The Mexican Beetle Digifant injection is not the same as the US Beetle L-Jet fuel injection setup... and parts for the original US L-Jet injection are getting harder to come by and are not cheap. The Mex system was a definite improvement over the earlier VW L-Jet system that the US cars had - many folks are using the Mexican components in conjunction with the Megasquirt ECM -
bnc _________________ I never found the need to impress people with any mechanic certifications, trophies or track wins... unless it was for Mom to post on the refrigerator door. |
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danielsan Samba Member
Joined: September 18, 2008 Posts: 802 Location: Carson City, NV
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Posted: Tue Aug 18, 2009 7:30 pm Post subject: |
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Has anyone ever installed a Mexibeetle EFI in a 70s bug? I'd like to get the 28 - 36 mpg that Mexibeetle owners report. |
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Bruce Samba Member
Joined: May 16, 2003 Posts: 17285 Location: Left coast, Canada
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Posted: Wed Aug 19, 2009 1:13 am Post subject: |
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danielsan wrote: |
28 - 36 mpg that Mexibeetle owners report. |
36 is a fantasy. _________________
overheard at the portland Swap Meet... wrote: |
..... a steering wheel made from a mastadon tusk..... |
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MinamiKotaro Samba Member
Joined: July 18, 2008 Posts: 1039 Location: Somewhere in TN
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Posted: Wed Aug 19, 2009 4:57 am Post subject: |
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Bruce wrote: |
danielsan wrote: |
28 - 36 mpg that Mexibeetle owners report. |
36 is a fantasy. |
I got 36 on the Interstate out of a 180+ whp 1915 turbo. I think a DD, NA engine could see that kind of economy. _________________ 1967 VW Beetle
2276cc
MegaSquirt-extra v3.57
Check out my ongoing story. |
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muirfollower Samba Member
Joined: December 02, 2005 Posts: 35
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Posted: Mon Aug 31, 2009 8:02 am Post subject: |
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Antonio,
Do you sell the wiring harness with connecctors for the MX MAP distributor, and sensors on the throttle body?
Thks
Andrew |
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Antonio Trejo VW Parts Dealer
Joined: December 17, 2003 Posts: 937 Location: Mexico City
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Posted: Mon Aug 31, 2009 8:10 am Post subject: |
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Andrew,
The sensors (TPS and Air intake temp sensor) are included on the used throttle body from my basic EFI kit. I have for sale the genuine and new engine bay area wirinng harness, to conecct distributor Hall sensor, TPS, , injectors, engine temp sensor, ralenty valve...
_________________ Parts VW
"From Volkswagen of Mexico factory..."
Genuine VW Sedan parts
Genuine VW Ultima Edition parts
Genuine VW Type 2 watercooled parts |
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Bruce Samba Member
Joined: May 16, 2003 Posts: 17285 Location: Left coast, Canada
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Posted: Tue Sep 01, 2009 12:42 am Post subject: |
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MinamiKotaro wrote: |
Bruce wrote: |
danielsan wrote: |
28 - 36 mpg that Mexibeetle owners report. |
36 is a fantasy. |
I got 36 on the Interstate out of a 180+ whp 1915 turbo. |
Your engine isn't the same as in a Mexican Beetle.
The big problem is that a Mexican Beetle is geared all wrong for mileage. _________________
overheard at the portland Swap Meet... wrote: |
..... a steering wheel made from a mastadon tusk..... |
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Shadd Samba Member
Joined: January 18, 2007 Posts: 883 Location: Lancaster, Ohio
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Posted: Tue Sep 01, 2009 3:38 am Post subject: |
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I don't understand. I've driven a Mexican beetle. It didn't seem to have much more power or speed than my 61 beetle with a 1600DP in it. My car got an average of 33 mpg on my trip from Arizona to Ohio. Why would a Mexican beetle with electronic everything get worse mileage than my 61 because of gearing?? |
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alikatcraig Samba Member
Joined: September 09, 2007 Posts: 556 Location: Anaheim, CA
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Posted: Mon Sep 07, 2009 10:15 pm Post subject: |
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I managed 49.9MPG (UK) on my Mexican 1200 bug (supplied to Europe by VW until 1985). Same trans as current models, well gearing anyway. 4.37 R&P needs dropping to a 4.12, and 4th to a .89 to make full use of the FI motor. I will be doing this to my '98 when I get it back together.
The Digifant system on the Mexican bug is pretty much the same as in a current Golf etc. Together with hydraulic lifters it is a huge step forward.
Al _________________ 1967 Ghia
1971 Deluxe Microbus
1974 Convertible Bug
1973 Standard Bug
1998 Mexican Bug |
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Bruce Samba Member
Joined: May 16, 2003 Posts: 17285 Location: Left coast, Canada
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Posted: Mon Sep 07, 2009 10:45 pm Post subject: |
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alikatcraig wrote: |
I managed 49.9MPG (UK) ... |
= 41.5 miles per US gallon.
The mileage of a 1200 cc equipped car is irrelevant to the mileage of a 1600cc car. _________________
overheard at the portland Swap Meet... wrote: |
..... a steering wheel made from a mastadon tusk..... |
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Bruce Samba Member
Joined: May 16, 2003 Posts: 17285 Location: Left coast, Canada
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Posted: Mon Sep 07, 2009 10:47 pm Post subject: |
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Shadd wrote: |
Why would a Mexican beetle with electronic everything get worse mileage than my 61 because of gearing?? |
Trans ratios aren't the only thing that goes into the gearing calculation.
Your 61 most likely had 165 rear tires. A late Mexican Beetle has 155s. These are about 1½" shorter. Mileage suffers badly when you run a Mexican Beetle at US freeway speeds. _________________
overheard at the portland Swap Meet... wrote: |
..... a steering wheel made from a mastadon tusk..... |
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linearone Samba Member
Joined: April 21, 2008 Posts: 158 Location: Wappingers Falls, NY
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Posted: Tue Sep 08, 2009 11:25 am Post subject: |
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I have a beautiful 71 bug with a 34 pict 3 that runs well I am super happy.
I would LOVE to buy a spanking new ( or close to it) used Fi mexi beetle.
I have seen a couple on ebay and its been tempting BUT.
As far as I can tell from phone calls and visits to the VW dealers in NY state NO ONE (dealerships) SUPPORTS THEM OR HAS ANY CLUE HOW TO BEGIN TO SUPPORT ONE IN THIS COUNTRY. I explained what I wanted to do to the service manager and he thought I meant a water cooled bug. when I explained it was a mexi beetle etc etc air cooled he stared at me blankly and had no idea what to say. The guy in Poughkeepsie told me that VW does not offer universal service info to all its techs, they wouldnt have the tools or know where to begin. They went to far as to explain they couldnt even offer me parts if I had the numbers.
This is the reason the Mexi's scare me, If anyone has any input as to wether or not VW stealerships in this country can or will service one let me know. |
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Antonio Trejo VW Parts Dealer
Joined: December 17, 2003 Posts: 937 Location: Mexico City
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Posted: Tue Sep 08, 2009 6:28 pm Post subject: |
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The air-cooled “Sedan” model produced by Volkswagen Mexico in the 1993-2003 years used the classic 1600 engine with some updated components. It is known as the “ACD” code engine. Differences from the engines in older models include:
1. Hydraulic valve lifters similar to the type 4 and waterboxer lifters are used, so valves stay in adjustment and should not be adjusted between rebuilds.
2. Revised cylinder heads that take a ¾” reach sparkplug.
3. A full-flow filter pump is used with larger (30mm) gears for higher oil flow. This provides better filtering to avoid fouling the hydraulic lifters. Because of the higher oil flow, pressure is better maintained in hot climates. Factory spec oil is 15w40 for the Mexican climate range; but in a wider temperature climate a 5w40 or 0w40 synthetic is more appropriate. The 70s dual relief oil pressure control is used. The spin-on filter is the same as used by most water-cooled VW 4-cyl engines, and the anti-drain back of the Vanagon waterboxer filter is helpful.
4. An electronic ignition distributor is used with no advance mechanism. Ignition advance is controlled by the electronic Engine Control Unit.
5. A combined ignition coil/spark control unit is used.
6. No thermostat or air shutters are used in the cooling system, as the ECU controls mixture during warmup to prevent fuel washing the cylinder walls. However, the fan shroud design has not changed, and the shutters and thermostat can be fitted (by drilling and tapping the case for the thermostat mounting stud) to provide better airflow for cold defrost of the windshield.
7. Fuel and ignition are controlled by a Digifant 1.82 ECU system. This system is unique to the air-cooled engine, although similar in concept and procedures to many VW cars. The control unit includes non-volatile memory for storing adaptation values matching the ECU to the car sensors, and for storing fault codes for diagnostics. The Digifant ECU communicates for adjustments and diagnostics. It is intended to use the VAG1552 or VAS5052 diagnostics tool used by VWoA dealerships. However, it does not use the now-standard 16 pin DLC connector as do US models, so it requires an adapter cable. _________________ Parts VW
"From Volkswagen of Mexico factory..."
Genuine VW Sedan parts
Genuine VW Ultima Edition parts
Genuine VW Type 2 watercooled parts |
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zoti Samba Member
Joined: December 26, 2007 Posts: 2060 Location: Plano, TX USA
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Posted: Tue Sep 08, 2009 9:17 pm Post subject: |
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Antonio Trejo wrote: |
The air-cooled “Sedan” model produced by Volkswagen Mexico in the 1993-2003 years used the classic 1600 engine with some updated components. It is known as the “ACD” code engine. Differences from the engines in older models include:
1. Hydraulic valve lifters similar to the type 4 and waterboxer lifters are used, so valves stay in adjustment and should not be adjusted between rebuilds.
2. Revised cylinder heads that take a ¾” reach sparkplug.
3. A full-flow filter pump is used with larger (30mm) gears for higher oil flow. This provides better filtering to avoid fouling the hydraulic lifters. Because of the higher oil flow, pressure is better maintained in hot climates. Factory spec oil is 15w40 for the Mexican climate range; but in a wider temperature climate a 5w40 or 0w40 synthetic is more appropriate. The 70s dual relief oil pressure control is used. The spin-on filter is the same as used by most water-cooled VW 4-cyl engines, and the anti-drain back of the Vanagon waterboxer filter is helpful.
4. An electronic ignition distributor is used with no advance mechanism. Ignition advance is controlled by the electronic Engine Control Unit.
5. A combined ignition coil/spark control unit is used.
6. No thermostat or air shutters are used in the cooling system, as the ECU controls mixture during warmup to prevent fuel washing the cylinder walls. However, the fan shroud design has not changed, and the shutters and thermostat can be fitted (by drilling and tapping the case for the thermostat mounting stud) to provide better airflow for cold defrost of the windshield.
7. Fuel and ignition are controlled by a Digifant 1.82 ECU system. This system is unique to the air-cooled engine, although similar in concept and procedures to many VW cars. The control unit includes non-volatile memory for storing adaptation values matching the ECU to the car sensors, and for storing fault codes for diagnostics. The Digifant ECU communicates for adjustments and diagnostics. It is intended to use the VAG1552 or VAS5052 diagnostics tool used by VWoA dealerships. However, it does not use the now-standard 16 pin DLC connector as do US models, so it requires an adapter cable. |
Awesome read, Antonio. Did you ever sell a turn key FI Mexican Engine to a US customer? |
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