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Vanagon Nut
Samba Member
Joined: February 08, 2008
Posts: 10379
Location: Sunshine Coast B.C.
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 Posted: Fri Dec 18, 2009 12:21 am Post subject: |
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| D Clymer wrote: |
Hi again, Neil.
Yes you're right. I believe the 2.6 manifold is also a two piece design. What I was trying to say is that the 2.8 manifold is a 2 stage (variable length) intake manifold. It actually has two sets of runners - a long narrow set, and a wide short set, and the engine management signals a vacuum actuator to switch runner paths at about 4000 rpms. Long runners for good low end torque, and wide short runners for higher rpm power. The 2.8 has this manifold, but the 2.6 does not. It looks to me like the variable length intake sits a bit taller.
I just realized I didn't answer your original question about the VR6 angle. As you stated, some late VR6s do have a smaller included angle compared to the Mk3 VR6s. However, it is just the latest 3.6 VR6 as used in the Passat that has the smaller included angle - 8 degrees as opposed to 15 degrees. It is basically a whole new engine. All of the other VR6s - 2.8s and 3.2s used in MK3, Mk4, and Mk5 cars are still 15 degrees like the original.
BTW, how has your ABA conversion been treating you?
David |
Quite well thank you. The muffler started cracking, (below) but that may have been due to muffler QC (Walker Quiet Flow) and/or my previous mounting system. Threw some weld on. A bit tricky to get the gun in there, but it seems to be holding. Just built it up beads between inlet pipe and can.
I really enjoy it. It gets decent mileage (~23 or better MP imp Gallon). The EVAP purge valve may need replacing, but pulses. Just now sure how well it seals when closed. Regardless, the engine is quite reliable. Sure love the heat! And I like the OBD. One of these days I'll get around to installing hydro mounts. The Fox mounts suck. The buzziness under acceleration is bugging me now. I may even go with an Audi oil pan and redo carrier (thanks Andrew for that tip)
I see what you mean re intake runners on the 2.8. Similar/same as some Porsche engines no? What I read earlier of them makes sense now. Thanks for the explanation.
regis101: yes indeed. I got lucky spotting that site. Using google to search "_____ images" works well.
Rallyedude: I was curious about Audi parts costs. $500??  
Re mounts ete. Have you searched the gallery portion of this site?
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/album_search.php
i.e.
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/album_page.php?pic_id=350303
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/album_page.php?pic_id=350301
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/album_page.php?pic_id=276214
I'm pretty sure there was another VR6 swap. Just can't recall his handle. 
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1981 Westy DIY 15º ABA
1988 West DIY 50º ABA
VE7TBN |
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Rallyedude
Samba Member
Joined: December 06, 2009
Posts: 206
Location: Aylmer, QC
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| Posted: Fri Dec 18, 2009 3:45 am Post subject: |
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http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/album_page.php?pic_id=276214
what is the mount in this pic? it looks like that 5.0L mustang mount I talked about earlier. The left mount looks like a stock mount with square tubimg bracket. No one seems to show uninstalled pics of their mounts. I guess there is no set way, just bolt engine to trans and mount trans mount then start fabbing. |
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Rallyedude
Samba Member
Joined: December 06, 2009
Posts: 206
Location: Aylmer, QC
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| Posted: Fri Dec 18, 2009 3:54 am Post subject: |
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| 078109087F that's one of the cam chain tensioners dealer list in canada 777.66$ you can get it through aftermarket for @500 and there's two per engine. if they let go goodbye engine, unless you get the start up oil pres leak down noise then change it before to late, but if guides on it go , forget about it. that being said i love the 30v as well, i've got one in my wife's A4, non fly by wire. they are just more time consuming than the vr for maintenance. To run late gen vw technology i'd put 1.8T in it(cheaper maintenance), or the TDi. But for my purpose the vr is perfect(even cheaper maintenance) and I've got to vr passat automatics sitting here for parts. and the vr's sound so good when you lay your foot into it. |
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Rallyedude
Samba Member
Joined: December 06, 2009
Posts: 206
Location: Aylmer, QC
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Vanagon Nut
Samba Member
Joined: February 08, 2008
Posts: 10379
Location: Sunshine Coast B.C.
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Vanagon Nut
Samba Member
Joined: February 08, 2008
Posts: 10379
Location: Sunshine Coast B.C.
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| Posted: Fri Dec 18, 2009 11:29 am Post subject: |
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I'd say pmail the guy for mount info.
another vr6 name: bern
from archives
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=231928&highlight=
maybe info there?
Bern also makes mention of finding a way to lower engine.
I wonder if he has?
Another is vr6 vanagon, though I didn't see any project threads.
A tip from fastwagens:
"I had to build a 6 inch high box that sits in a u channel filled with a closed cell weather strip. I also used a syncro engine cradle and I custom made the brackets and used chevy tranny mounts."
My tip: Don't do this! (although points to that fellow for mounting what I assume is a Mk3 drivetrain)
_________________
1981 Westy DIY 15º ABA
1988 West DIY 50º ABA
VE7TBN |
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Rallyedude
Samba Member
Joined: December 06, 2009
Posts: 206
Location: Aylmer, QC
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| Posted: Fri Dec 18, 2009 5:22 pm Post subject: |
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| why the v6 audi love? someting about it i just don't like. I'd sooner an inline 5 swap or the 4.2 v8 32v or 40v. those 12v audi motors feel almost agricultural to me . If you must have an audi v6 run the 30v way smoother motor grear power across the band. i guess people just don't care for the vr, whenever this project starts i'll post pics thanks for the help! |
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Vanagon Nut
Samba Member
Joined: February 08, 2008
Posts: 10379
Location: Sunshine Coast B.C.
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| Posted: Fri Dec 18, 2009 5:50 pm Post subject: |
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| Rallyedude wrote: |
| why the v6 audi love? ...... i guess people just don't care for the vr, whenever this project starts i'll post pics thanks for the help! |
Well, in looking for more VR6 swap info, I found more pics of the Audi. The image showing the oil pan was relevant.... at least to the hijacked portion of this thread!
Nothing against the VR.
As for an Audi swap, just the price of parts alone would prohibit me from swapping one in!
Nice that you have a donor Passat(s?) And please do post some pics. I'm sure they will help out others.
Neil.
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1981 Westy DIY 15º ABA
1988 West DIY 50º ABA
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D Clymer
Samba Member
Joined: December 22, 2005
Posts: 2978
Location: Issaquah, WA
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| Posted: Fri Dec 18, 2009 6:00 pm Post subject: |
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| Rallyedude wrote: |
| why the v6 audi love? someting about it i just don't like. I'd sooner an inline 5 swap or the 4.2 v8 32v or 40v. those 12v audi motors feel almost agricultural to me . If you must have an audi v6 run the 30v way smoother motor grear power across the band. i guess people just don't care for the vr, whenever this project starts i'll post pics thanks for the help! |
The reason I suggested the Audi V6 is because it is a good fit in a Vanagon, is easy to get, and delivers decent output. I have always liked the VR6, I just don't like the way it fits in a Vanagon engine bay. Your project is a little bit different since you are putting it in a truck. The VR^ fits well in that engine bay.
The Audi V6 12V certainly isn't an exciting engine. I alluded to that in my original post. However, it certainly is no more agricultural than an Audi 5 cylinder. In the 96-97 Audi A4 with a 5 speed I've always thought it feels decent. It is certainly less agricultural than a Subaru 2.5 and has more hp and torque. It also has a simple SOHC valvetrain with no expensive hydraulic cam adjusters.
I'm not sure I qualify as having Audi V6 love, but those are the reasons I suggested it.
David |
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Vanagonner
Samba Member
Joined: September 15, 2009
Posts: 506
Location: Broomfield Colorado
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| Posted: Fri Dec 18, 2009 6:20 pm Post subject: |
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"Shots are from tractor competition (or happening) take place in village Sihelne (NW Slovakia). All tractors was home made. Parts are from another tractors or sometime from cars (this one has engine from Audi )"
sorry for the detour, just couldn't help myself...
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Sage
'82 Westy 1.6 D
the mighty n/a |
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carterzest
Samba Member
Joined: January 22, 2008
Posts: 3842
Location: Eagle, ID/Sun Valley, ID
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Rallyedude
Samba Member
Joined: December 06, 2009
Posts: 206
Location: Aylmer, QC
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| Posted: Sun Dec 20, 2009 6:20 pm Post subject: |
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| that dude's running a right rear MKIII/C/P engine mount, looks tidy , i guess someone already is using my idea, cool. thanks for the link!! |
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carterzest
Samba Member
Joined: January 22, 2008
Posts: 3842
Location: Eagle, ID/Sun Valley, ID
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| Posted: Sun Dec 20, 2009 9:16 pm Post subject: |
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| Rallyedude wrote: |
| that dude's running a right rear MKIII/C/P engine mount, looks tidy , i guess someone already is using my idea, cool. thanks for the link!! |
that's what this place is all about
Pm tristareric I think he knows his name. Also may be some more pics in the pdx/pnw/westravaganza thread. Don't have time to dig through the thread right now.
Jeffrey
Ninja edit:
http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=768813&l=ff9dc5fbff&id=1045677541
http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=768814&l=9eec8c517d&id=1045677541
Seems like ground clearance was sacraficed for HP to me, but, I would roll it in a second 
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Happiness=Portland, Oregon in the rearview mirror! |
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VR6 vanagon
Samba Member
Joined: October 26, 2008
Posts: 93
Location: New Port Richey Florida
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| Posted: Fri Mar 19, 2010 11:20 am Post subject: vr6 in vanagon mounts info |
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My VR6 is from a 2000 Jetta, I used a KEP adapter,stage 2 clutch, and started. the cross bar that holds the engine up is home made. The motor mounts I used are MKIII tranny mounts I believe. The crossbar was first made from 3/16 steel, but I soon bent it like a boomarang. Now it is made from 1/4" box tubing. I doubt it will bend again. lol
The wheels and tires are from I believe a 2007 E class mercedes. they are 17" X 9.5". I used a 7mm spacer. The transmission was just rebuilt and put back in about 20 miles ago. I sent it off to German Transaxle of America in Oregon, they put in new gears and a bunch of stuff. Like a super diff with 4 spider gears instead of 2, a bigger ring gear, taller 3rd and 4th gear,( All Weddle gears.) and a reinforced case.
The radiator is from a vanagon, as is the fan, I had stainless coolant lines made, 1 piece from front to rear.
If you have any other questions about what it took to make this work, feel free to reply and ask. I have pictures to post, but now I see that I can't post them here directly, it looks like I need to find somewhere to host them.......
I think I figured out how to post the pics.....
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/gallery/pix/658139.jpg
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/gallery/pix/658141.jpg
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/gallery/pix/658142.jpg
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/gallery/pix/658143.jpg
It is not complete as of yet, it runs and drives, but there is much more work to do. I have most of what it will take to run the AC. I am just lacking the feed and return lines that would go to the fron of the van. Haven't had any luck finding them yet. But when I do find them and get the AC installed, I will put my rear cabinet from the drivers side back in. And the rear center cabinet that hung from the roof will no longer be needed as the factory air is in that spot. I also have been thinking about what the best way to raise my bench seat a few inches would be. I just need to raise it high enough so the bed is level again. Hopefully soon I can get the body work done and have it painted. I've owned it for 23 years, most of the time it was parked in a garage. Not really any rust on it, but there is some assorted dings here and there. And the canvas needs replaced, it has a few small holes in it. I would also like to lay a bamboo floor in the cargo area. |
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ChrisMac
Samba Member
Joined: November 09, 2004
Posts: 155
Location: Waterville, Maine
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| Posted: Wed Aug 11, 2010 6:05 pm Post subject: |
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Question . . .
Why not install the complete VR6 engine, trans, and subframe. Why adapt to the vanagon trans? The VR's tend to eat up their own 5spd's. Why attach them to a trans designed for a small 4 cylinder.
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VR6 vanagon
Samba Member
Joined: October 26, 2008
Posts: 93
Location: New Port Richey Florida
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| Posted: Wed Aug 11, 2010 6:27 pm Post subject: |
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it is a front wheel drive transmission, if you moved it around to the rear, you would have like 5 reverse gears and 1 foreward...
I had my tranny built, now it can handle more torque than i can give it. |
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ChrisMac
Samba Member
Joined: November 09, 2004
Posts: 155
Location: Waterville, Maine
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| Posted: Thu Aug 12, 2010 3:33 pm Post subject: |
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| VR6 vanagon wrote: |
it is a front wheel drive transmission, if you moved it around to the rear, you would have like 5 reverse gears and 1 foreward...
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Not if you set it in the facing the same way the engine sits in a car. With the exhaust manifold towards the rear of the van.
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buildyourown
Samba Member
Joined: March 01, 2009
Posts: 1668
Location: Seattle
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| Posted: Thu Aug 12, 2010 3:39 pm Post subject: |
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| ChrisMac wrote: |
Not if you set it in the facing the same way the engine sits in a car. With the exhaust manifold towards the rear of the van. |
Except then the engine would be in the middle of the backseat. Not impossible to do, but kind of kills the whole point of having a camper van. |
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thummmper
Samba Member
Joined: November 25, 2009
Posts: 2015
Location: Meadow Valley, California Republic
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| Posted: Sun Aug 15, 2010 9:44 am Post subject: |
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No, Its like sleeping with your sweetheart on a cold night with a spaniel between you. i always seemed to get the paws pushing on me though.
I some how am not so critical of this project anymore now that I am a deck violator myself--2.5" at least the westy bench will cover it.
I do have to faux a new deckline though, so I'm taking LSD on thursdays until I get a solution |
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Bern
Samba Member
Joined: March 08, 2004
Posts: 152
Location: Issaquah, WA
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| Posted: Sat Oct 09, 2010 7:07 pm Post subject: |
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Since I'm not on the samba much anymore, if anyone wants some specifics, feel free to email me.
I sold my VR6 van a couple months ago, ironically right before I was going to launch into the project to fit the engine under the factory decklid (or at the very least a much less raised one).
I had started designing a "low-rise" intake manifold for the vr6, basically taking the lower portion of the intake manifold and remaking one to roll downwards into a log style intake manifold. If you look at it, the VR intake wraps over the top of the motor adding another ~4" of height, and by using the valve cover from a different VR6, you can lose the "breather box" built into the top of the early VR6 valvecovers. Then plumb in a different breather setup, and you're very close to factory deckheight.
While I think the Audi v6's are cool motors, the almost entirely non-existence of aftermarket parts (cams, chips, etc) make the VR6 a better choice in my opinion.
That being said, I'm having serious thoughts about getting my hands on a 2.7T motor and slipping that into the back of a vanagon next time I have one.
Glad to see alot of people out there getting more adventuresome with their vanagon motorswaps.
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VR6 Vanagon. Yup, it vrooms and stuff. |
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