How often do you replace your rubber brake hoses? |
Once every year or two |
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2% |
[ 1 ] |
Every three to four years |
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5% |
[ 2 ] |
Every five or six years |
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11% |
[ 4 ] |
Every seven years or more |
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8% |
[ 3 ] |
Only when I see cracking whenever that is |
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44% |
[ 15 ] |
Never |
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26% |
[ 9 ] |
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Total Votes : 34 |
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woggs1 Samba Member
Joined: February 22, 2007 Posts: 531 Location: South Pacifica California
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Posted: Sun Feb 14, 2010 9:10 am Post subject: How often do you replace your rubber brake hoses? |
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I changed my rubber brake hoses yesterday, the old ones had some small cracking on them. I know everyone changes the fuel lines regularly but I have not seen many posts about regularly changing the brake hoses/lines. I want to know how often Sambanites change their rubber brake hoses as the job is pretty easy and the replacement hoses are reasonably priced. I also replaced all the brake fluid with synthetic. _________________ 4 speed 88 Westy |
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syncrodoka Samba Member
Joined: December 27, 2005 Posts: 11998 Location: Santa Cruz, CA
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Posted: Sun Feb 14, 2010 9:25 am Post subject: |
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That is one of the 1st things that I replace on any VW that I buy. My 6 year old vanagon hoses still look good. I do purge the old fluid with new stuff though. |
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insyncro Banned
Joined: March 07, 2002 Posts: 15086 Location: New York
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Posted: Sun Feb 14, 2010 10:03 am Post subject: |
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The only replacing I do is with braided stainless.
Yes the vendors charge $100+, but do a little homework and you will find very affordable ones for other applications that work very nicely.
I am not going to show a link as some states DOT will not allow braided lines without swivel fittings.
Cal Imports is where they can be found and there is a samba thread on the topic. |
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vanaguy Samba Member
Joined: November 20, 2006 Posts: 225 Location: Sumner, WA
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Posted: Sun Feb 14, 2010 10:10 am Post subject: |
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Both of my vans were 19 when I replaced the hoses. I'm pretty sure they were original. |
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windnsea Samba Member
Joined: May 07, 2008 Posts: 424 Location: Pasadena, CA
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Posted: Sun Feb 14, 2010 10:18 am Post subject: |
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Only once! I also replace the hose to the clutch slave cylinder. I use quality braided stainless/Teflon hoses. The 5 required can be gotten for about $15.00 US apiece if you know where to look.
When I put on the Audi brakes with the G60 calipers the new and longer hoses (about 14") were $22.00 US apiece.
Brake feel also increases. |
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insyncro Banned
Joined: March 07, 2002 Posts: 15086 Location: New York
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Posted: Sun Feb 14, 2010 10:24 am Post subject: |
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windnsea wrote: |
Only once! I also replace the hose to the clutch slave cylinder. I use quality braided stainless/Teflon hoses. The 5 required can be gotten for about $15.00 US apiece if you know where to look.
When I put on the Audi brakes with the G60 calipers the new and longer hoses (about 14") were $22.00 US apiece.
Brake feel also increases. |
Agree.
Glad to hear this is common knowledge. |
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randywebb Samba Member
Joined: February 15, 2005 Posts: 3815 Location: Greater Metropolitan Nimrod, Orygun
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Posted: Sun Feb 14, 2010 12:11 pm Post subject: |
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~ 7 years should be fine
cracking on the exterior does not tell you about the important part - the interior; they WILL swell up and reduce braking after some years
you can palpate (squeeze) them periodically all the way up and down the line
the "stainless" are just plastic with a metal stainless mesh - they are often associated with "boy racer" types and fail catastrophically
race cars use high quality ones and replace them after each race; I avoid them after reading about all the dangerous failures in the sports car world |
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deprivation Samba Member
Joined: September 14, 2006 Posts: 1220 Location: Austin, Texas
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Posted: Mon Feb 15, 2010 9:38 am Post subject: |
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randywebb wrote: |
fail catastrophically... I avoid them after reading about all the dangerous failures in the sports car world |
Um - what, now? I was thinking about the braided steel lines because I was under the impression that they were the shiznit. I was not aware they were such a gamble! Are the failures associated with a specific brand? _________________ 1986 Westy 2WD auto a.k.a. "The Old Girl"
www.kittenfart.com |
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deprivation Samba Member
Joined: September 14, 2006 Posts: 1220 Location: Austin, Texas
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Posted: Mon Feb 15, 2010 9:41 am Post subject: |
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Oh - and what's the difference between the $134 set at Van cafe and a generic 60 set I put together from Cip1? _________________ 1986 Westy 2WD auto a.k.a. "The Old Girl"
www.kittenfart.com |
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RCB Samba Member
Joined: September 05, 2005 Posts: 4143 Location: San Francisco-Bay Area
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Posted: Mon Feb 15, 2010 9:50 am Post subject: |
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deprivation wrote: |
Oh - and what's the difference between the $134 set at Van cafe and a generic 60 set I put together from Cip1? |
$74.00 |
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deprivation Samba Member
Joined: September 14, 2006 Posts: 1220 Location: Austin, Texas
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Posted: Mon Feb 15, 2010 10:07 am Post subject: |
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I walked right in to that one... _________________ 1986 Westy 2WD auto a.k.a. "The Old Girl"
www.kittenfart.com |
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randywebb Samba Member
Joined: February 15, 2005 Posts: 3815 Location: Greater Metropolitan Nimrod, Orygun
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Posted: Mon Feb 15, 2010 1:08 pm Post subject: |
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deprivation wrote: |
Um - what, now? I was thinking about the braided steel lines because I was under the impression that they were the shiznit. I was not aware they were such a gamble! Are the failures associated with a specific brand? |
the catastrophic failures were well documented for Porsche 911 units - the fittings blew apart
there is a large amount of info on the Porsche 911 Technical subforum at Pelican Parts; there are also some articles I have filed away somewhere that are not posted there, but then how much info do ya need to avoid something with no or minimal potential benefit and great risk (!)
maybe they are all just fine now - maybe
- I do know that very early on these things did not have DOT approval. Some do now. I would be concerned that they might be made by very cheap foreign labor to low specs. with minimal quality control... I have not seen any that have TUV approval, which is much much better than just a US DOT sticker.
you really need to ask yourself what advantage you are going to get compared with NEW rubber hoses
the pedal feel improvement some say they feel is likely either because the hoses they replaced were old, or is nothing more than placebo effect
In general, I would avoid shiznit and seek out reliable, safe, higher performance true upgrades. You wanna be careful 'cuz everybody in the parts biz wants to sell you something... just look at the current thread re ebay crap... |
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tripod808 Samba Member
Joined: March 06, 2010 Posts: 65 Location: Hilo
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Posted: Thu Mar 18, 2010 9:51 pm Post subject: |
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insyncro wrote: |
The only replacing I do is with braided stainless.
Yes the vendors charge $100+, but do a little homework and you will find very affordable ones for other applications that work very nicely.
I am not going to show a link as some states DOT will not allow braided lines without swivel fittings.
Cal Imports is where they can be found and there is a samba thread on the topic. |
Consider this question as "me doing my homework"
What applications are options for some affordable stainless hoses? |
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Wildthings Samba Member
Joined: March 13, 2005 Posts: 50257
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Posted: Fri Mar 19, 2010 12:13 am Post subject: |
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I did a little checking when this thread was new and found that not all SS brake hoses are SAE/DOT certified. If the add doesn't say that a hose does meet the requirements then I would assume until proven differently that they do not. |
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randywebb Samba Member
Joined: February 15, 2005 Posts: 3815 Location: Greater Metropolitan Nimrod, Orygun
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Posted: Fri Mar 19, 2010 12:07 pm Post subject: |
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What applications are options for some affordable stainless hoses?
- off-road racing; however they may not be affordable & you will need to change them after each race (just like racers do)
the braid can prevent rock cuts from debris thrown up into the area of the hose
I would look for TUV approval - much tighter than DOT; altho DOT is better than non-approval. That is only if you absolutely MUST have them.
I immediately removed them from a Porsche 911 weekend race car I bought b/c of the safety issues I noted above.
Of course, you can always put some cheap braided hoses on, add some neon lights underneath, load the spare tire carrier up with gasoline and see how good our healthcare system is for burn victims. |
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Dingchowping Samba Member
Joined: March 31, 2009 Posts: 134 Location: Seattle, WA.
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Posted: Sun Mar 21, 2010 12:34 pm Post subject: |
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Wildthings wrote: |
I did a little checking when this thread was new and found that not all SS brake hoses are SAE/DOT certified. If the add doesn't say that a hose does meet the requirements then I would assume until proven differently that they do not. |
If you do some digging you'll find that none of the brake lines on the market, SS or otherwise, are SAE/DOT certified. In fact, there isn't a single brake component...lines, rotors, calipers, pads, cylinders...anything that's DOT certified. The Department of Transportation isn't in the business of testing and certifying parts. Even if they had unlimited resources that would be a daunting task indeed! The best they can do is come up with a list of minimum standards, and its up to the individual manufacturers to comply with those standards. AFAIK, the only SS brake lines that are listed as "DOT Compliant" (as opposed to DOT Certified) are Stoptech.
Yeah, its semantics, but it makes you wonder. If a product proudly displays "DOT Certified" on its packaging, did the manufacturer look into the DOT certification process, discover there's no such thing, and decide to slap the label on anyway? Or are they making the claim without lifting a finger, oblivious to its non-existance? Either way, they're lying to you!
But keep in mind the DOT does not police any claims of "Certification" or "Compliance." Adherence to the standards are completely voluntary. So as with anything, Caveat Emptor.
In case the weather where you are is particularly bad, or your incredibly bored and/or lazy, feeling particularly geeky, and you've explored every other possible corner of the interwebs, here's a link to the DOT FMVSS 106 document on Brake Hose standards in all its gory detail:
http://edocket.access.gpo.gov/2004/pdf/04-27088.pdf
Don't have too much fun!
To add my own two cents to this argument, I've installed hundreds of sets of brake lines...the vast majority being of the SS ilk...the vast majority being on VWs and Audis of various incarnations. Many of them reside on cars that are very heavy, very powerful, and are driven very hard...often at track events. I've only seen one SS line failure, which manifested itself during the test drive after installation and was addressed before the owner took possession of the car. Conversely, I've seen probably a dozen or more rubber hose failures including some that caused the strangest symptoms. Such as the inner hose that began to disintegrate, creating a 1 way "valve" that would allow fluid through to the caliper, but not back again, causing that caliper to lock up. But most of the failed lines inflate like a small balloon in one section...scary!
Based on my personal real world experience, I'm going SS every time! _________________ TTFN,
Adam
"For once you have tasted flight,
You walk the earth with your eyes turned skyward;
For there you have been,
And there you long to return."
-Leonardo da Vinci |
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tripod808 Samba Member
Joined: March 06, 2010 Posts: 65 Location: Hilo
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Posted: Mon Mar 22, 2010 3:41 am Post subject: |
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randywebb wrote: |
Of course, you can always put some cheap braided hoses on, add some neon lights underneath, load the spare tire carrier up with gasoline and see how good our healthcare system is for burn victims. |
I really hope that your not suggesting that I'm one of those guys.
For your information, I have owned many vehicles with SS brake lines, all vehicles benefited from it. I never asked if I should go stainless or not, I'll pick stainless everytime. I asked about "affordable" not "cheap" options. Quality is something I don't want to compromise here, but I am a smart consumer and often seek out quality parts for good prices.
Your problem with SS brake lines seems like its based on some outdated information from the past that you have never been able to move on from. Your argument against them seems very weak, and biased. I read your posts above and wasn't really counting on you to answer my question fairly. You just so happened to be one of the only people who did answer. Do me a huge favor, if you see me asking for help, leave the attitude out of it, because you don't know me like that and I don't know you either. |
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Wellington Samba Member
Joined: September 21, 2004 Posts: 1882 Location: Montreal
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Posted: Mon Mar 22, 2010 4:06 am Post subject: |
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On this topic, very rarely have I been able to undo a brake line without messing up the union, I just replaced the rear solid lines lines to the rear cylinders, a 20" length fits perfect.
Now to replace the rear flex lines, I'll probably bugger the solid line going forward, anyone know the lengths of the solid lines used on the Vanagon, 1985 in my case. My van is going to get everything underneath replaced with new, coolant pipes, heater hoses, power steering lines, brake lines, fuel lines. |
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Randy in Maine Samba Member
Joined: August 03, 2003 Posts: 34890 Location: The Beach
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randywebb Samba Member
Joined: February 15, 2005 Posts: 3815 Location: Greater Metropolitan Nimrod, Orygun
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Posted: Mon Mar 22, 2010 12:21 pm Post subject: |
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tripod808 wrote: |
randywebb wrote: |
Of course, you can always put some cheap braided hoses on, add some neon lights underneath, load the spare tire carrier up with gasoline and see how good our healthcare system is for burn victims. |
I really hope that your not suggesting that I'm one of those guys.
For your information, I have owned many vehicles with SS brake lines, all vehicles benefited from it. I never asked if I should go stainless or not, I'll pick stainless everytime. I asked about "affordable" not "cheap" options. Quality is something I don't want to compromise here, but I am a smart consumer and often seek out quality parts for good prices.
Your problem with SS brake lines seems like its based on some outdated information from the past that you have never been able to move on from. Your argument against them seems very weak, and biased. I read your posts above and wasn't really counting on you to answer my question fairly. You just so happened to be one of the only people who did answer. Do me a huge favor, if you see me asking for help, leave the attitude out of it, because you don't know me like that and I don't know you either. |
The functional benefits are minor and the risks are great. My comment was a general one, since many people read posts here.
That is not based on "outdated" information at all. I'm a professional scientist and prefer to rely on studies rather than anecdotes of personal experience.
What do you think the benefits are?
I am not trying to harsh your mellow, blight your bling, and I don't care what you do -- as long as you don't do it where you will crash into me.
Just be sure to disclose it to anyone that buys your Vanagon. |
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